NHS Database Opt Out

PASONIX said:
The only reason they are trying to sell this - is because they want a bigger slice of the budget. You know it.

The NHS paper records system has never been a problem - and it works well.

I would much rather they poured the money into sorting out the mistakes/reducing the bureaucracy rather than this white elephant.
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Are you an idiot?
Firstly this is all part of one of the biggest expenditures the NHS has ever made, upgrading and implementing new IT systems across the board, with the sole aim of this. It's gone massively over budget and is just starting to come to usefulness. They're not getting any budget for this that is being spent elsewhere.

The NHS paper records system does not work well at all. It restricts your medical history to your GP, and if you're lucky they'll get notified of anything you have done in hospital, but maybe not.

Along with the vital information benefit this presents (which you don't care about because you've not got anything wrong with you, we get it) it also enables you to have some choice over when and where your appointments/consultations/surgeries are.

It's not just your medical history but your medical present as well. You do realise that as with almost everything else that people cry out about there is no new data being stored about you? It is just a more secure and beneficial way of that data being stored.
 
Angilion said:
I don't share your confidence in your ability to foretell the future.
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There is an inevitable risk of intentional leaks, but I don't see how there is moreso with this than the existing system? Most GP's/Hospitals/PCT's have A patient record for you at the moment, with the same information on, this project is just about unifying them and making it so if one is updated it's reflected throughout, and furthermore that this record is available should you go to a different GP or Hospital or anything within another PCT
 
Abraham said:
There is an inevitable risk of intentional leaks, but I don't see how there is moreso with this than the existing system? Most GP's/Hospitals/PCT's have A patient record for you at the moment, with the same information on, this project is just about unifying them and making it so if one is updated it's reflected throughout, and furthermore that this record is available should you go to a different GP or Hospital or anything within another PCT
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A database of almost everyone's medical details (and I expect that in time everyone will be forced to have their medical details on the database) is far easier to sell (or lose or leak) than shiploads of paper scattered around the country.

It will also be possible to connect it with other databases in the ongoing quest to have as much information as possible on as many people as possible easily available.

It is not just the same as the existing system.

Arguing that the benefits outweigh the risks is one thing. Arguing that it's just the same as the current system is quite another (and wrong).
 
Angilion said:
A database of almost everyone's medical details (and I expect that in time everyone will be forced to have their medical details on the database) is far easier to sell (or lose or leak) than shiploads of paper scattered around the country.

It will also be possible to connect it with other databases in the ongoing quest to have as much information as possible on as many people as possible easily available.

It is not just the same as the existing system.

Arguing that the benefits outweigh the risks is one thing. Arguing that it's just the same as the current system is quite another (and wrong).
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I'm not arguing that it's the same, just that the same data is stored. It may now be more saleable data, but it is also significantly more secure.
To the best of my knowledge the only type of data which could ever be collected (other than on an individual basis) will be stripped of identifying information, at which point it becomes an incredibly useful data mining tool which I see no downsides?
 
It amazes me how the same people who constantly moan about "NHS waste" are the same people who moan when they start adopting tools that will make them more efficient. Personally I'd like to see anyone who opts out of this scheme have to pay the extra NHS costs when they are treated.

Like it or not we are in living in the information age, our data is going to have to go on to databases. Historically this country has always paid lip service to data security which has resulted in several high profile failures by both governments and companies. Finally things are starting to move forward, this NHS Care Records System has had security engineered into it from the outset.
 
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I'm opting out. Purely because any body that has tried to implement a centralised database of our information, is cack at handling said information. My younger brother applied to join the RAF. Went and did the trials and all the rest of it, failed the run by 40 seconds or so. About two weeks later he got a letter in the post informing him that his details had been on a laptop that was stolen. His name, address, his medical details from the tests and training. And living in Northern Ireland that's not the kind of information you want lost. ESPECIALLY if you've applied for security services and especially not at the minute either.
 
Brian8bit said:
I'm opting out. Purely because any body that has tried to implement a centralised database of our information, is cack at handling said information. My younger brother applied to join the RAF. Went and did the trials and all the rest of it, failed the run by 40 seconds or so. About two weeks later he got a letter in the post informing him that his details had been on a laptop that was stolen. His name, address, his medical details from the tests and training. And living in Northern Ireland that's not the kind of information you want lost. ESPECIALLY if you've applied for security services and especially not at the minute either.
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But your data from this can't be stored on a laptop unless someone makes a note of your information themselves, which they could currently do, and I'm quite sure you can't opt out of happening.
 
Brian8bit said:
No. Because more than my doctor will be able to see my record, like they currently can't.
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really? anyone with access to NSTS can see your personal details, depending on your type of record chances are most people working within your PCT can access more detailed records for you, and obviously anyone working for your GP has full access to your records there. If anyone specifically wanted to know about you, and your medical history, for whatever reason they could.
 
I'm opting out. The problem some people dont seem to be able to grasp is that once the data is out there in the wild, which will happen, its not coming back. You have lost control of your medical records for ever.

And this is how well the POLICE look after very important critical CRB data. In a spreadsheet.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/04/16/gwent_police_data/

"Police face accusations of incompetence after accidentally emailing a file detailing the results of thousands of criminal records checks to a Register journalist...... Gwent Police asked The Register to consider not publishing a story about its serious data breach saying it would undermine public confidence in the force, but we declined."
 
No way I'm opting out.
I've got quite a medical history and I feel it's damn important that any medical professional who treats me has full access to my history.

If they have to wait for notes to be found and faxed or couriered over - anything could happen in that time.

I cannot understand why anyone would want to opt out of a scheme that could potentially save their life.
Unless they don't have a medical history - in which case why not let them put it on as there is nothing to "hack".
 
scorza said:
It amazes me how the same people who constantly moan about "NHS waste" are the same people who moan when they start adopting tools that will make them more efficient. Personally I'd like to see anyone who opts out of this scheme have to pay the extra NHS costs when they are treated. ...
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Quite seriously, if you know a GP, ask him or her about the centralised NHS database, ask if he or she has chosen to opt out.

Front-line professionals in the NHS do not believe that there is any significant benefit to the public in the currently proposed centralised database or that it is a sensible use of scarce resources, whatever administrators, management consultants, the remaining suppliers, Google & Microsoft may pretend.

. . . you could also check with Accenture and Fujitsu ;)


I would like to see anyone who is too lazy to opt-out forced to pay their share of the enormous cost of this white elephant :p
 
Vanilla said:
What about this clause with the new system that information may be disclosed if it's in the 'public interest'?
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Like I said earlier, no identifying information will be disclosed, there will be warehoused data available for data mining, but it will be for the purpose of recognising trends etc, not marketing to individuals.
 
stockhausen said:
Quite seriously, if you know a GP, ask him or her about the centralised NHS database, ask if he or she has chosen to opt out.

Front-line professionals in the NHS do not believe that there is any significant benefit to the public in the currently proposed centralised database or that it is a sensible use of scarce resources, whatever administrators, management consultants, the remaining suppliers, Google & Microsoft may pretend.
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I wasn't aware that your GP spoke for all front-line professionals in the NHS? mind if I put some questions to her, that's quite some influence she must have!

I've not heard a single member of NHS staff disagree that it's a good idea in principle, just that it's been implemented at too great a cost and with the involvement of too much middle management and consultants, both of which are fair points, but irrelevant to whether it's a good idea or not.
 
Vanilla said:
What about this clause with the new system that information may be disclosed if it's in the 'public interest'?
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This the same as FL as in if you catch any sexually transmitted disease or infection your wife\girl friend will be told and you go onto a database for it.


stoofa said:
No way I'm opting out.
I've got quite a medical history and I feel it's damn important that any medical professional who treats me has full access to my history.

If they have to wait for notes to be found and faxed or couriered over - anything could happen in that time.

I cannot understand why anyone would want to opt out of a scheme that could potentially save their life.
Unless they don't have a medical history - in which case why not let them put it on as there is nothing to "hack".
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And what would you do if the computer went down and they had no fast way to get your paper records inplace because they relied on computers for so long?
 
deuse said:
And what would you do if the computer went down and they had no fast way to get your paper records inplace because they relied on computers for so long?
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The same as currently happens? most GP's use electronic records already. Just not one that's accessible across the NHS
 
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