Nye vs Ham debate

kedge said:
I can tell you that the Bible clearly states God created the first human pair (man and woman)
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Does it? Clearly?

Then why does the language used alter depending upon the source material and the interpretation mean that various positions can be derived from them. For example, in the Hebrew, Adam can be interpreted as both Man and Mankind, as well as being both sexes at once prior to Eve.

Also where is your observable proof for this, you state categorically that Moses wrote Genesis and the Pentateuch, yet you also advocate Ken Hams position that unless observed it has no validity...did you, or anyone observe Moses write the Pentateuch, or observe the Creation of Man, or the Expulsion from Eden?

Do you not see the inherent flaw in ascribing to a literal interpretation of what is clearly a metaphorical text...how do you explain the inherent contradictions between Genesis 1 and 2? You say they were written by the same Man, yet the are contradictory if you follow a literal position.
 
The first five books of the Old Testamentwere written by Moses which is Genesis through to Deuteronomy. The other books and letters you can research yourself?. Written after creation.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Metallifux View Post
Where is the observable science that covers what happens in the old testament.
Can you be more specific with regards to old testament science?. I can tell you that the Bible clearly states God created the first human pair (man and woman) we know with observable science that humans can only come from humans, for example.

My point being......How could Moses have written about Genesis if he wasn't there, it was in the past and therefore according to creationism can't be observed so in fact could be utter tripe.
 
Kedge I have a question for you, Where do creationists sit with pagan religions such as the gods in Greece, Roman Empire, other religions such as Buddhism, where there are more than one god? Surely if God had sent a flood to wipe out all non believers then these other religions would not have existed, yet they do?
 
Oh, the bible.

Other translations are distinguished by smaller, but distinctive, doctrinal differences. For example, the Purified Translation of the Bible, by translation and explanatory footnotes, promoting the position that Christians should not drink alcohol, that New Testament references to "wine" are correctly translated as "grape juice".
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bible_translations

Castiel raises a very valid point about the interpretation of the Bible, and selective metaphorical versus literal belief in the different passages.

The history of the Bible alone should be enough for most people to dismiss it as a source.
 
just how do creationists explain the fossil record..thats all I want to know about this whole thing?

did noah have a trex on board the ark?

and how did all the salt water fish not die when the earth was flooded with fresh rainwater..in fact how did it turn salty again?!!!
 
FTM said:
just how do creationists explain the fossil record..thats all I want to know about this whole thing?

did noah have a trex on board the ark?

and how did all the salt water fish not die when the earth was flooded with fresh rainwater..in fact how did it turn salty again?!!!
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I expect the whole god put them there as a test of our faith or they arenot real fossils simply made up.

Really makes me sad how people dismiss scientific fact such as how long it takes light to reach the earth from distant stars as not suitable evidence
 
There is absolutely nothing in my life I would not be willing to change my mind on if better or clearer evidence was presented.

So I think the only question really worth asking Kedge is:

"What would it take for you to doubt the Bible is true"

I would love to hear you answer openly and truthfully, but I fear the answer is nothing.
 
Metallifux said:
The first five books of the Old Testamentwere written by Moses which is Genesis through to Deuteronomy. The other books and letters you can research yourself?. Written after creation.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Metallifux View Post
Where is the observable science that covers what happens in the old testament.
Can you be more specific with regards to old testament science?. I can tell you that the Bible clearly states God created the first human pair (man and woman) we know with observable science that humans can only come from humans, for example.

My point being......How could Moses have written about Genesis if he wasn't there, it was in the past and therefore according to creationism can't be observed so in fact could be utter tripe.
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Excellent point... although I can't remember 100%, isn't that the part of the bible they choose not to believe?
 
A disappointing show, but not entirely unexpected. Two players show up and start playing different games - it's what tends to happen when religious folks debate scientists. I can't imagine anyone having their minds changed by watching that debate; creationists will think Ham won, and everyone else will think Nye won. Bleh.
 
kedge said:
Observation, testability, repeatability, falsification or to prove factual to the best of the individuals ability for establishing laws etc.
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Can you show me, at any point in observed history where a fundamental natural law has changed? As required by creationismists.
 
Castiel said:
Does it? Clearly?.
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To me yes to you perhaps not.

Castiel said:
Also where is your observable proof for this, you state categorically that Moses wrote Genesis.
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Proof that God exists?, i can not make another believe what i believe, all bible writers were inspired by God's active force, others believe whatever they want to believe.
Castiel said:
how do you explain the inherent contradictions between Genesis 1 and 2? You say they were written by the same Man, yet the are contradictory if you follow a literal position.
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I believe Moses wrote genesis, if someone can show who else wrote the account then they can show us can't they?.
 
Metallifux said:
My point being......How could Moses have written about Genesis if he wasn't there, it was in the past and therefore according to creationism can't be observed so in fact could be utter tripe.
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A lot of people do think that God, Jesus Christ, the Holy spirit and the Bible and religion as a whole is utter nonsense and delusional and foolish and utter tripe like yourself and many others here.
 
FTM said:
just how do creationists explain the fossil record..thats all I want to know about this whole thing?.
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What do you mean?, the fossil record is a record of ancient life, explain what?.

FTM said:
did noah have a trex on board the ark?.
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T-Rex i presume? all you would need is a parent kind and besides you do realise that their can be very young dinosaurs right?.
 
quickshot89 said:
Kedge I have a question for you, Where do creationists sit with pagan religions such as the gods in Greece, Roman Empire, other religions such as Buddhism, where there are more than one god? Surely if God had sent a flood to wipe out all non believers then these other religions would not have existed, yet they do?
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I can't answer for others with regards to other religious beliefs, people spoke of many gods, if others want to believe in many gods then that is their prerogative i suppose. Why wouldn't other religions have existed after the genesis flood?.
 
MookJong said:
There is absolutely nothing in my life I would not be willing to change my mind on if better or clearer evidence was presented.

So I think the only question really worth asking Kedge is:

"What would it take for you to doubt the Bible is true"

I would love to hear you answer openly and truthfully, but I fear the answer is nothing.
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Fear not ye of little faith. The Bible works for me so why would i cast away what works for me?.
 
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