Oil giant Total SACKS 900 people

PlacidCasual said:
That line is not always certain and witholding labour may often be the only recourse the workers have. Whilst I'd prefer the unions use their hard won rights more carefully I wouldn't wish to remove them fully.
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There is always mutual benefit, whether it's enough benefit for you is a different matter, as is whether certain aspects (such as hours) are high or low on the benefits list

For instance it has been an extremely long time since any of the Electricity or Water industry unions last took action but the Postal Workers seem to strike repeatedly. They are driving their jobs out of existence with their action in my opinion. How is that beneficial?
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Its not beneficial in any way, the sooner the more militant unions learn this the better.
 
PlacidCasual said:
Some of this is the Governments fault and some the Industry's. In some of the European countries the law states that foreign workers must be paid according to locally agreed standards. So foreign workers are no cheaper or better paid than local workers, thus there is less incentive to employ them unless their is a genuine skills gap or shortage. No such law or agreement exists here. So places like Milford Haven and Total have used cheaper foreign labour when adequately skilled locals were available. It's poor form really from the employers but equally the Government hasn't acted to close this loop hole either.
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Technically it's the other governments that are acting against the EU free trade rules in this case. Take it up with them.

scorza said:
I thought this was the case in this country too, however I know it's a law totally ignored by most employers. The government are guilty of not enforcing this law.
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No, there isn't. They are subject to minimum wage laws and standard UK employment law though.
 
I love all the "get another job" most of you dont know what its like to the threat of strike looming, I have seen grown men cry at the prospect of having to strike.

You are just sad pathetic ****
 
Damn my patheticness for being a responsible employee and relying on actual performance and ability to make my mark....
 
cheets64 said:
I love all the "get another job" most of you dont know what its like to the threat of strike looming, I have seen grown men cry at the prospect of having to strike.

You are just sad pathetic ****
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If they don't want to strike no-one forces them to strike
 
rypt said:
If they don't want to strike no-one forces them to strike
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Actually many unions do, there is a strong expectation on all union members to support strike action irrespective of whether they agree with it. Indeed, history over the last century or so is littered with examples of union led violence against fellow workers for not supporting their position.
 
Dolph said:
Actually many unions do, there is a strong expectation on all union members to support strike action irrespective of whether they agree with it. Indeed, history over the last century or so is littered with examples of union led violence against fellow workers for not supporting their position.
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So quit your union if you feel they are doing "wrong" and you do not support their actions.
 
rypt said:
If they don't want to strike no-one forces them to strike
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You have absolutely no idea.
I on the other hand started on a massive factory of 8,500 people in 1974 called the Michelin Tyre Company and no matter what your stance was if others went on strike so did you because the consequences of losing all your friends wasn't worth it.
I then went to work at a factory of 2,500 called Creda and once again you went on strike and those that didn't were not talked to again.
The worst people were those who wouldn't join the Union and pay their subscription but still expected Union help because that is the law.
In 2007 when they announced the factory was to be shut about 200 people joined the Union, we fought hard to stop them but it was the law.
I'd paid for 27 years and they had paid a week.

Go and read up on the Miners strike and the consequences of not striking.
My brother in law gave up the strike 1 week before it was resolved because he had got so much debt and he lost all his mates.
 
rypt said:
We are in 2009, it has been a fair few years since any major union violence - and I would expect the Police to be able to do their job now-a-days.
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You'd like to think so, but the attiutude towards strike breakers (or scabs, to use the unpleasant but union preferred term) in recent fire brigrade, tube and post office strikes show that such beliefs are still very much present in unions, and therefore the intimidation is still very much present in heavily unionised industries.
 
Dolph, it might be unpleasant but I doubt you would lose any genuine friends over it or be in any real danger today as opposed to in the 80s
 
Jokester said:
What's changed? People certainly haven't, I've no reason to believe that the same mob mentalities would exist to coerce workers to join a strike now that did back then.
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I beg to differ, people have changed - I for one have had a string of awesome postmen now.

Also the way the police deal with things have changed, I would expect the police to be prepared to uphold the law and engage violent yobs now.
 
dmpoole said:
You have absolutely no idea.
I on the other hand started on a massive factory of 8,500 people in 1974 called the Michelin Tyre Company and no matter what your stance was if others went on strike so did you because the consequences of losing all your friends wasn't worth it.
I then went to work at a factory of 2,500 called Creda and once again you went on strike and those that didn't were not talked to again.
The worst people were those who wouldn't join the Union and pay their subscription but still expected Union help because that is the law.
In 2007 when they announced the factory was to be shut about 200 people joined the Union, we fought hard to stop them but it was the law.
I'd paid for 27 years and they had paid a week.

Go and read up on the Miners strike and the consequences of not striking.
My brother in law gave up the strike 1 week before it was resolved because he had got so much debt and he lost all his mates.
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I never joined the union, I was glad because they promised a lot of things but never did anything, £10 a month to pay to some guys who just put on a big speech when trouble kicks up, the only thing a union is worth paying for is unfair dismissal and pay negoations, just because you paid your money every year does not make you a better person.

A union is just another business, it has to make money to survive.
 
rypt said:
Dolph, it might be unpleasant but I doubt you would lose any genuine friends over it or be in any real danger today as opposed to in the 80s
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I disagree. What's changed is that unionism (especially of the militant variety) is much less prevelant than it was, and infects far fewer workplaces (in fact, it's pretty much restricted to public services and former public services in most cases), but in those enviroments, the risks are the same as ever.

rypt said:
I beg to differ, people have changed - I for one have had a string of awesome postmen now.

Also the way the police deal with things have changed, I would expect the police to be prepared to uphold the law and engage violent yobs now.
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Intimidation doesn't have to come in the form of violence, and intimidation on it's own is not illegal.
 
Ricochet J said:
The damages local businesses had were huge. You can't just cut a major transport link in what is now the world's busiest fanancial centre, especially during a recession.

Although it is sad, I welcome Total's decision.
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I agree. It was harsh, but fair. If it wasn't official, then they have no right to do it.
 
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