Online sales tax considered in bid to save the high street

[Rofflay]

This is how big money goes abroad! Hayday mostly UK money going back into the UK. Modern day UK money going into overseas bank accounts. Mainly America.

It doesnt take a genius to figure out where this ends.

 

[SPG]

Online sales tax... how about taxing the ****** companies in the first place instead of the consumer.

Fix the loophole against the likes of amazon, google, apple etc etc.

This boils my ****

 

[potatolord]

Which is probably the real motivation here. Tax the online retailers making them look like the problem, paint the high street as the poor victim that needs help, and everyone keeps shopping online anyway generating a nice juicy tax revenue for the Government. The high street will still die even with the subsidised rate but the online tax will remain.

Governments love sin taxes. They can point out the righteous escape them, while sinners are punished.

For atheists like me, this would appear to a 2% VAT increase.

 

[Quartz]

Fix the loophole against the likes of amazon, google, apple etc etc.

I wrote to the Chancellor on the subject early this year. Rather than extra tax though, I suggested he make marketplaces and agents like Amazon, eBay, & co responsible for collecting VAT and import duties - non-payment of those is a significant reason behind their success.

I didn't even get an acknowledgement.

 

[englishpremier]

Governments love sin taxes. They can point out the righteous escape them, while sinners are punished.

For atheists like me, this would appear to a 2% VAT increase.

VAT is already too high in the UK. Germany reduced theirs to 16%.

The 15% during the 2008 crisis felt about right, but as we all know it was just an excuse to increase it to 20% later. Then they blamed the EU, which was nonsense.

 

[HACO]

VAT is already too high in the UK. Germany reduced theirs to 16%.

The 15% during the 2008 crisis felt about right, but as we all know it was just an excuse to increase it to 20% later. Then they blamed the EU, which was nonsense.

VAT is a regressive tax, and it's intended that way. UK decided that regressive consumption tax is a good thing given that income tax is pretty high for our level of social services, other countries decided to tax wealth and properties instead.

 

[cheesyboy]

I've posted my thoughts on this before in a different thread:

Another boomer policy. "save the high street"

**** the high street. Transform the bulk of the shops into affordable apartments, knock others down in favour of parks, keep a few premium shop fronts for the actually-profitable retailers and lower rates on a few others and limit them to being local businesses - servicing the people living in the new apartments.

And let the common man have his cheap online retail.

Or, if you're really that keen to flog that dead highstreet horse, then lower the ******* business rates all around and subsidise parking.

 

[b0rn2sk8]

VAT is already too high in the UK. Germany reduced theirs to 16%.

The 15% during the 2008 crisis felt about right, but as we all know it was just an excuse to increase it to 20% later. Then they blamed the EU, which was nonsense.

That reduction is only temporary, if you actually compare the UKs VAT rate to the rest of Europe’s typical rates it’s on the lower side. Our threshold before vat kicks in is also by far the highest.

 

[Psycho Sonny]

VAT is already too high in the UK. Germany reduced theirs to 16%.

The 15% during the 2008 crisis felt about right, but as we all know it was just an excuse to increase it to 20% later. Then they blamed the EU, which was nonsense.

VAT rate makes zero difference to prices or customers it only makes a difference to businesses.

When we reduced it to 15% prices stayed the same and businesses pocketed the difference.

When it was increased to 20% prices went up.

Reducing it with make zero difference to the majority of people. In fact you could zero rate everything and something which cost £200 yesterday would still cost you £200 today.

If something needs changing its the tax allowance. It should be increased to £20k. This will actually help the people who need it most.

 

[englishpremier]

VAT rate makes zero difference to prices or customers it only makes a difference to businesses.

When we reduced it to 15% prices stayed the same and businesses pocketed the difference.

When it was increased to 20% prices went up.

Reducing it with make zero difference to the majority of people. In fact you could zero rate everything and something which cost £200 yesterday would still cost you £200 today.

If something needs changing its the tax allowance. It should be increased to £20k. This will actually help the people who need it most.

I somewhat disagree. VAT makes a difference. Just the other day I was pricing up a large purchase around the EU. The only difference was the VAT and as such the item was cheapest in Germany by the same amount as the VAT reduction. Take a look at the KTM website at their motorcycle prices around the EU. You'll see they change with VAT.

The difference VAT and the UK's £85k odd threshold can also be seen in smaller business being able to undercut larger businesses, who then must get competitive on price.

 

[b0rn2sk8]

Not sure phycho could be more wrong there. VAT isn’t a cost on business at all, the customer pays the vat and businesses collect it on behalf of the gov. It was never the business money.

If VAT gets reduced, prices should come down. The last time VAT was reduced prices came down in general, the only places it didn’t were independent traders/restaurants/takeaways who pocketed the difference. I tend to avoid those sorts of places that don’t pass it onto the customer as should you.

 

[Psycho Sonny]

Not sure phycho could be more wrong there. VAT isn’t a cost on business at all, the customer pays the vat and businesses collect it on behalf of the gov. It was never the business money.

If VAT gets reduced, prices should come down. The last time VAT was reduced prices came down in general, the only places it didn’t were independent traders/restaurants/takeaways who pocketed the difference. I tend to avoid those sorts of places that don’t pass it onto the customer as should you.

I know how vat works.

Yeah it's never the businesses money they are simply a middle man holding onto it to pass over.

But rarely does a reduction in vat ever make any difference in the price.

Some companies do it and sometimes only on some products.

Nandos passed on the vat reduction thanks to Covid but plenty of major chains didn't.

A lot of businesses treat the price as being the price regardless of the vat rate. Vat inclusive price.

I remember when the government needed money and they decided to move domestic energy from zero rated to standard rated.

Thereafter when they filled their coffers they couldn't make it zero rated again because of the EU so made it reduced rated.

It will be interesting to see for example of tampons come down in price when we leave the EU.

Because that's the first thing the public is going to ask for to be zero rated. However I'm willing to bet not all of the reduction is passed on in every retailer.

 

[chaparral]

With Sainsbury's immediately closing for good ~120 still temporary closed Argos high street stores with 80% of the rest to go - that is a further blow to the high street.

I heard of Sainsbury's, Are they big stores ?

We no have a sainsbury store where i live in Guernsey so i never been in one or seen one..

 

[Rroff]

I heard of Sainsbury's, Are they big stores ?

We no have a sainsbury store where i live in Guernsey so i never been in one or seen one..

Yeah they are your average size big supermarket shops. They've been slowly absorbing Argos standalone stores and moving them into nearby Sainsbury's stores as concessions counters.

 

[dacads]

RIP high street

all about retail parks now

slowly but surely towns will be mostly accommodation and offices if not already

@cheesyboy spot on lad, greenery never hurts whether it’s parks or vegetables

 

[Psycho Sonny]

RIP high street

all about retail parks now

slowly but surely towns will be mostly accommodation and offices if not already

@cheesyboy spot on lad, greenery never hurts whether it’s parks or vegetables

Even the stores in them are struggling. High rents and rates.

You simply cannot compete with a website. People buy online and just return what they don't like for free.

It's easier when there is no face to face interaction. For instance I know women that buy a whole new wardrobe for a holiday. Keep the tags on and tuck inside. Send it back on their return.

Free clothes essentially.

 

[413x]

We have to accept the high street it's naturally dieing.
Covid has accelerated it.


So what happens? You have to tax online more.

Offices going, shops folding, big USA corps taking all the business, bigger welfare bill

All these result in less tax coming in. What else can you do but tax online more?

That's where the money is being spent. American online services.

 

[ttaskmaster]

**** online retail and **** the Covid exacerbating it.
I had to buy two* printers just to print a returns label to send something back that was in the wrong size. I could have driven to the high street and back for a fraction of the cost!



*because the first one was out of stock and won't be restocked, though they neglected to mention this until a day after it was due for delivery, but it's OK because they'll gladly keep my money in case they ever do get them back...

 

[Psycho Sonny]

**** online retail and **** the Covid exacerbating it.
I had to buy two* printers just to print a returns label to send something back that was in the wrong size. I could have driven to the high street and back for a fraction of the cost!



*because the first one was out of stock and won't be restocked, though they neglected to mention this until a day after it was due for delivery, but it's OK because they'll gladly keep my money in case they ever do get them back...

Lol at not owning a printer.

 

[Rimsy]

You are all going to be so ****** when things go wrong online. No more corner groceries, bike shops, clothes, furniture shops etc.no cash payments, no person at a counter to sort out your ransom ware or fraud enquiries. No footfall on the streets, those not WFH are in their electric uber self hires failing to notice street robberies or property fires. The police and fire services have all gone online as well with automated answering services (oh **** gone down again). Cinema going is superceded by Netflix and you can alternate with your fave pron server. Libraries, what were they? You just order a couple of ebooks from your sofa alongside a 12" pizza for one. On the other hand make it an audio book then you don't even need to read it yourself.
Eventually you are all so ******* fat you cannot climb out of your custom sofa with built in commode that you die of exhaustion or the fire that the brigade cannot respond to burns you to a crisp...
...no one notices.

I know you said you were ranting with this but its kind of spot on.
Its terrifying how many people here are actively promoting the complete reliance of our survival on somthing so fragile as the internet. Just one significant CME from the sun and we'd be screwed and the last one was less than 200 years ago so its hardly unprecendented.