Party wall insulation - Agreement needed?

Soldato
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Hi,

Has anyone had their semi detached property insulated particularly at the party wall?

I was wondering if you needed an agreement or if you can just go ahead and get it done, next door is rented and getting hold of the landlord isn't going to be easy as I don't have a particularly good relationship with next door

I'll be honest I'm not interested in the insulation aspect of it, more the mess free and potentially cheap sound proofing properties of it so if anyone has any experience on that it would be gratefully received because installing internal soundproofing would be challenging and very inconvenient with two young kids, not to mention it is very expensive

Cheers
 
Soldato
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Does the method you employ not matter rather a lot on this? i.e, if you needed to replace the plasterboard (and subsequently added insulation) you wouldn't need any details from them surely?
 
Soldato
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Does the method you employ not matter rather a lot on this? i.e, if you needed to replace the plasterboard (and subsequently added insulation) you wouldn't need any details from them surely?

The OP was more regarding the stuff thats fitted into the gap between the walls which after reading some more last night would appear you need an agreement so I'm going to turn my attention to internally installed soundproofing which will no doubt be more expensive, messy and inconvenient but I've found a local company that looks interesting and logged a query with them
 
Associate
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we are now doing insulation in the rented room, we needed an agreement with the landlord. Such rental rules - initially they said that nothing should be done with the walls, but since we change their properties strongly, we do not damage the walls, we were allowed to make soundproofing. We decided the issue ourselves, just talked in a friendly way. Don't know if this information will help you. hope it helps.
 
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I have been looking at PU Foam Cavity wall insulation for the same reason as you.

I've only managed to find a handful of companies who do this. Most companies don't seem to touch cavity wall insulation with a barge pole now either. There seems to be more companies removing the stuff than installing it!

Anyway, in answer to your question, when I asked the companies if I would need to get permission from the neighbour, they essentially said no. As in, they would be happy to undergo the work without the neighbours consent.

I've been quoted around £55-60 per square metre for a 75mm cavity gap. However I haven't accurately measured the party wall gap yet, it may only be 50mm.

Either way, I'm looking at around £1500-2000 to undertake the work.

The issue then is, it's impossible to say how much it might help, or even hinder, the actual problem.

For me its impact noise, which from the research I have done, is very difficult to combat.

Ultimately the house is poorly designed.

I feel your pain.
 
Soldato
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we are now doing insulation in the rented room, we needed an agreement with the landlord. Such rental rules - initially they said that nothing should be done with the walls, but since we change their properties strongly, we do not damage the walls, we were allowed to make soundproofing. We decided the issue ourselves, just talked in a friendly way. Don't know if this information will help you. hope it helps.

Thanks appreciate the info

I have been looking at PU Foam Cavity wall insulation for the same reason as you.

I've only managed to find a handful of companies who do this. Most companies don't seem to touch cavity wall insulation with a barge pole now either. There seems to be more companies removing the stuff than installing it!

Anyway, in answer to your question, when I asked the companies if I would need to get permission from the neighbour, they essentially said no. As in, they would be happy to undergo the work without the neighbours consent.

I've been quoted around £55-60 per square metre for a 75mm cavity gap. However I haven't accurately measured the party wall gap yet, it may only be 50mm.

Either way, I'm looking at around £1500-2000 to undertake the work.

The issue then is, it's impossible to say how much it might help, or even hinder, the actual problem.

For me its impact noise, which from the research I have done, is very difficult to combat.

Ultimately the house is poorly designed.

I feel your pain.

I'm going another route now, I want to make sure the solution works because its either this or move house I just had a quote this morning for both bedrooms to have a sound proof wall installed, floor lifted sound deadening material installed where it meets the wall, all plastered and any electrics reinstated for £4.5k which compared to some of the other things I've read is relatively cheap, certainly cheaper than moving

If it works as well as I hope we will get downstairs done too but yeah, rubbish isnt it, we didnt have anyone next door for 18 months and it was bliss, now we have seriously noisy neighbours and its a nightmare
 
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I had a quote similar to yours from a specialist noise proofing company who felt the only solution was to build a 'floating' false wall in front of the existing wall.

I explained to them that much of the sound I can hear is clearly travelling down the open cavities between the properties, he had no answer to this.

The fact is that these businesses are happy to take your hard earnes cash regardless of whether it fixes the issue for you or not.

I don't intend to poo poo your new plan, as I was contemplating the same thing. There are just logical flaws in that solution if you ask me.

What sound is it thats bothering you?

For me, it's doors slamming, drawers and cupboards being closed, footsteps up and down the stairs.
 
Soldato
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I had a quote similar to yours from a specialist noise proofing company who felt the only solution was to build a 'floating' false wall in front of the existing wall.

I explained to them that much of the sound I can hear is clearly travelling down the open cavities between the properties, he had no answer to this.

The fact is that these businesses are happy to take your hard earnes cash regardless of whether it fixes the issue for you or not.

I don't intend to poo poo your new plan, as I was contemplating the same thing. There are just logical flaws in that solution if you ask me.

What sound is it thats bothering you?

For me, it's doors slamming, drawers and cupboards being closed, footsteps up and down the stairs.

Interesting, they have a fair few positive reviews on Google and FB for the same thing I am looking at having done in terrace and semi detached houses. They did explain that you would need to do the whole house for the best solution and that it wouldnt completely remove all of the noise but should get rid of most of it from the room with the sound proofing

The noises are TV, Music, Cupboards, shouting and voices
 
Soldato
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I'll be honest I'm not interested in the insulation aspect of it, more the mess free and potentially cheap sound proofing properties of it

Contact the landlord's agent and complain about the noise your neighbours are making. Or are you concerned about the noise your family is making?

Is the party wall just a single layer of bricks or is there a double layer with cavity inbetween?
 
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Contact the landlord's agent and complain about the noise your neighbours are making. Or are you concerned about the noise your family is making?

What do you propose the council will do about a family just making regular noise?

Unless their blasting techno at unsociable hours with a regular pattern to it, don't believe the council will do much at all.
 
Soldato
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Contact the landlord's agent and complain about the noise your neighbours are making. Or are you concerned about the noise your family is making?

Is the party wall just a single layer of bricks or is there a double layer with cavity inbetween?

We've already spoken to the family and they have made an effort to quieten down but yes now that we've spoke to them about it we now need to try and be as quiet as possible and its created this stressful situation where we're trying to explain to a 4 year old to not slam his wardrobes because we've asked next not to and he just doesn't get it

The landlord wont care, that'll just be wasted time

That and because its rented who knows who will be living there next, I want to stay in this house I've invested a lot of time and money into it and want to get a loft conversion because the loft is massive and its in a very desirable location we got very lucky just to get it as a do upper, we just had it valued and in 2.5 years the value has risen significantly so I really dont want to sell at the moment

As for the structure of the party wall I am honestly not sure, one of the reasons I wanted to go for an internal solution, I think its double layer but would need an expert to come out and look
 
Soldato
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What do you propose the council will do about a family just making regular noise?

What's the council got to do with it? And why are you assuming it's regular noise? Anyway, the point is to establish that there is a problem. Either with the tenants or the building or both. And once a problem has been established, a solution can be proposed.
 
Soldato
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That and because its rented who knows who will be living there next, I want to stay in this house I've invested a lot of time and money into it and want to get a loft conversion because the loft is massive and its in a very desirable location we got very lucky just to get it as a do upper, we just had it valued and in 2.5 years the value has risen significantly so I really dont want to sell at the moment

As for the structure of the party wall I am honestly not sure, one of the reasons I wanted to go for an internal solution, I think its double layer but would need an expert to come out and look

Things like Soundboard 4 can be screwed to party walls. They are heavy though. There are other options for stud walls. They are good for air noise, but impact noise is more difficult because that travels through the walls that are attached to your house too.
 
Soldato
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You lose nothing by trying. And at least in Scotland, it is not correct to say it is wasted time. They can be forced to care.

Either way it could be a long road, I want a permanent solution that includes sound going both ways to cover us, current and future neighbors of next door. That might sound very charitable of me but its not, I'm only interested in me and my family being happy in this house and if that cost a few grand then its money well spent

In all honesty I hate the fitted wardrobes anyway and my desk was custom fitted to the innards of one of the wardrobes and is too small and too shallow so having it all ripped out and sound proofed will allow me to have a bigger desk until we can get a loft conversion sorted then I can move my desk to a dedicated room

Things like Soundboard 4 can be screwed to party walls. They are heavy though. There are other options for stud walls. They are good for air noise, but impact noise is more difficult because that travels through the walls that are attached to your house too.

Appreciate the links but this isnt a DIY job I'm willing to take on, I want it done properly by someone who know what they are doing
 
Soldato
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Appreciate the links but this isnt a DIY job I'm willing to take on, I want it done properly by someone who know what they are doing

I'm not suggesting you can't hire tradesmen to do the work, just to let you know what kind of options are available so that you can specify the sort of thing you want. There's a lot more options today than the old style of building a floating stud wall and filling it with rockwool, especially if you want to minimise the loss of your internal space.
 
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What's the council got to do with it? And why are you assuming it's regular noise? Anyway, the point is to establish that there is a problem. Either with the tenants or the building or both. And once a problem has been established, a solution can be proposed.

When I read your post regarding making a complaint I appear to have misunderstood, I thought you meant to contact the council. My point remains, complaining to people is a waste of time and energy unless they are being extremely anti-social.

Trying to solve the problem is problematic because any potential fixes (soundproofing), aren't guarranteed to make what you perciece to be an adequate difference. This wouldn't be a massive problem if we are talking hundreds of pounds to try a solution out. We're talking thousands of pouns which may result in you being unhappy with the results.

It's a really crappy situation to be in. I blame the house builders.
 
Soldato
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I'm not suggesting you can't hire tradesmen to do the work, just to let you know what kind of options are available so that you can specify the sort of thing you want. There's a lot more options today than the old style of building a floating stud wall and filling it with rockwool, especially if you want to minimise the loss of your internal space.

Yes its a 12cm wall with a metal frame filled with material then acoustic board, then that techsound material and then plastered, this their video -

 
Soldato
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I have the same issue with noise from next door in a semi too.
I don't think the best soundproofing will drown out the chavs I looked into it all and for the money for me it's cheaper to move.
Thats what I'm doing right now.
 
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Yes its a 12cm wall with a metal frame filled with material then acoustic board, then that techsound material and then plastered, this their video -


That's the same process a company I was in contact with proposed.

How does that solution stop the noise carried through the external walls of the house? Through the joists?

Short answer, it doesn't. It sucks, but it's only a solution if you don't suffer with any impact noise.

I have the same issue with noise from next door in a semi too.
I don't think the best soundproofing will drown out the chavs I looked into it all and for the money for me it's cheaper to move.
Thats what I'm doing right now.

It's gutting but that's essentially the situation I'm looking at. Why drop thousands to stay in a house that I still have idiot neighbours.

I want to be more constructive but I'm out of ideas myself...
 
Soldato
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@BogEyes

How have you come to that conclusion if you haven't tried it? Just curious because there are numerous reviews stating the solution worked for them, reviews can be faked but I looked into a few of the reviewer profiles and they seem genuine to me
 
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