Passport Photo Banned

[TR]SweetSpotOz · 15 Dec 2007 at 20:51

fifiov said:
As covered, it's old, and the passport office apologised.

However, the reason was also given that "it might prove unacceptable in a Muslim country". Not that Muslims are trying to take us over, claim Britain as their own state, and we're bending over backwards for them, but the perfectly sensible suggestion that it might be unacceptable in a Muslim country. Which, to be fair, it might well be, as you wouldn't walk around in one with bare shoulders. Over there, of course, their rules would apply, and thus giving a heads up about it here first would surely be preferable.

Of course, whether the girl is likely to be heading to any Muslim country is another matter. Still, much fuss, little substance.

Everything you have said is everything I want to say.

cleanbluesky · 15 Dec 2007 at 20:54

I agree that the post office are not institutionalising any Muslim-friendly restrictions on passport photos, that the reporting is sensationalist, that the story is old.
But suggesting that Islam does not place restrictive values on 'modesty' that we do not share is incorrect.

Inquisitor · 15 Dec 2007 at 21:04

cleanbluesky said:
It didn't happen then? This is the stereotypical call every time a link to the Daily Mail is offered, probably from the kind of people who read the Guardian and think they've been given a clarity to the issue no-one else has, so that they can make smug injokes on forums.
Everything you read is bull, remember that.

I don't read newspapers actually. I just particularly dislike the Daily Mail's style of journalism; it consists primarily of bending the truth almost to breaking point in such a way as to make it as controversial as possible and have a good rant about 'PC gone mad' and the various ethnic minorities in Britain (read: Muslims).

cleanblueksky said:
But suggesting that Islam does not place restrictive values on 'modesty' that we do not share is incorrect.

That's irrelevant though; the article is about the Post Office.

[TR]SweetSpotOz · 15 Dec 2007 at 21:07

cleanbluesky said:
But suggesting that Islam does not place restrictive values on 'modesty' that we do not share is incorrect.

Where has anybody suggested that?

cleanbluesky · 15 Dec 2007 at 21:07

Inquisitor said:
That's irrelevant though; the article is about the Post Office.

Saying that this article is only about the post office is like saying the internet is only about forums

cleanbluesky · 15 Dec 2007 at 21:08

markyp23 said:
Where has anybody suggested that?

It has been inferred

Inquisitor · 15 Dec 2007 at 21:10

cleanbluesky said:
Saying that this article is only about the post office is like saying the internet is only about forums

It's about the Post Office's (though actually an individual clerk's) rejection of the photo; there were no complaints about the photo from actual Muslims.

G-MAN2004 · 15 Dec 2007 at 21:25

Fraggr · 15 Dec 2007 at 21:25

cleanbluesky said:
I agree that the post office are not institutionalising any Muslim-friendly restrictions on passport photos, that the reporting is sensationalist, that the story is old.
But suggesting that Islam does not place restrictive values on 'modesty' that we do not share is incorrect.

I don't think anyone is saying Muslims aren't being restricted by their religion - Islam DOES restrict its followers. All we are saying is that the post office isn't stopping women showing their shoulders in passport pictures because it might offend Muslims.

cleanbluesky · 15 Dec 2007 at 21:26

Inquisitor said:
It's about the Post Office's (though actually an individual clerk's) rejection of the photo; there were no complaints about the photo from actual Muslims.

No claims need have been made for this situation to typify Islam - you are also assuming that this article is supposed to be about complaint by Muslims. There are a raft of similar situations which have been backed by complaint, although equally obnoxious is when someone who isn't a Muslim sees fit to 'complain' on their behalf - such as is described in this article

DarkShadow · 15 Dec 2007 at 21:34

This discussion has been done to hell and back. Islam is barbaric etc etc :rolleyes:

The trolls don't need to be fed.

Stellios · 15 Dec 2007 at 21:39

Stupid.

cleanbluesky · 15 Dec 2007 at 21:50

dark_shadow said:
This discussion has been done to hell and back. Islam is barbaric etc etc

Although you have yet to join in the discussion. In fact, whilst you mock those who say that Islam is backward, you never address their claims... why is that?

The trolls don't need to be fed.

A new take on restricting freedom of speech, I applaud...

[TR]SweetSpotOz · 15 Dec 2007 at 21:50

cleanbluesky said:
It has been inferred

Right, so I ask you where it has been suggested and you tell me it has been suggested?

[TR]SweetSpotOz · 15 Dec 2007 at 21:52

cleanbluesky said:
No claims need have been made for this situation to typify Islam - you are also assuming that this article is supposed to be about complaint by Muslims. There are a raft of similar situations which have been backed by complaint, although equally obnoxious is when someone who isn't a Muslim sees fit to 'complain' on their behalf - such as is described in this article

It has no relevance to this article if you read the facts. It is brought into the discussion by you.

cleanbluesky · 15 Dec 2007 at 21:57

markyp23 said:
Right, so I ask you where it has been suggested and you tell me it has been suggested?

Inferred has a slightly different meaning from suggested. To suggest is to propose, whereas to infer is to derive as a conclusion from facts - the difference is whether you explicitly state something or you suggest it without expressing it directly.

Either way, me bored... me out of thread.

[TR]SweetSpotOz · 15 Dec 2007 at 22:02

cleanbluesky said:
Inferred has a slightly different meaning from suggested. To suggest is to propose, whereas to infer is to derive as a conclusion from facts - the difference is whether you explicitly state something or you suggest it without expressing it directly.

Either way, me bored... me out of thread.

If you are going to define words to me, then please do it properly and appreciate that they have more than one meaning. Suggest is certainly interchangeable with infer in everyday language.

sug·gest (sg-jst, s-jst)
tr.v. sug·gest·ed, sug·gest·ing, sug·gests
1. To offer for consideration or action; propose: suggest things for children to do; suggested that we take a walk.
2. To bring or call to mind by logic or association; evoke: a cloud that suggests a mushroom; a ringlike symbol suggesting unity.
3. To make evident indirectly; intimate or imply: a silence that suggested disapproval.
4. To serve as or provide a motive for; prompt or demand: Such a crime suggests apt punishment.

in·fer (n-fûr)
v. in·ferred, in·fer·ring, in·fers
v.tr.
1. To conclude from evidence or premises.
2. To reason from circumstance; surmise: We can infer that his motive in publishing the diary was less than honorable.
3. To lead to as a consequence or conclusion: "Socrates argued that a statue inferred the existence of a sculptor" Academy.
4. To hint; imply.

The Free Dictionary

Obviously the OED would have been more appropriate except it says something to the same effect.

Your presence in this thread was getting boring, I would agree.

Inquisitor · 15 Dec 2007 at 22:02

cleanbluesky said:
you are also assuming that this article is supposed to be about complaint by Muslims.

Huh?

What I'm saying is that the article isn't ranting about Muslim intolerance, but about the clerk that rejected the photo, hence Muslim intolerance, as mentioned by you earlier, isn't relevant.

manoz · 15 Dec 2007 at 22:10

G-MAN2004 said:
I know, religion of peace and all that. Bull****.

OT: Hey G-Man, you got a bigger pic of your sig? Can I haz it?

cleanbluesky · 15 Dec 2007 at 22:14

markyp23 said:
If you are going to define words to me, then please do it properly and appreciate that they have more than one meaning. Suggest is certainly interchangeable with infer in everyday language.

Yes, it can be. But it is also possible that it is not, therefore assuming they are automatically synonymous to attempt sarcasm is illogical.