Please help spec me a £4k gaming rig

[Papablu]

Yeah tell me about it, the 4k OLED is a dream of mine too which is also why I was holding off 4k for at least a year. Like you say though, it looks like it'll be a longer wait anyway. Seeing as the prices are coming down fast I reckon I'll end up going for it next year and just taking the hit when OLED 4K becomes available. I'm not one to be too bothered about losing money on this stuff but having a large family there's always something in the back of my mind telling me not to spend for the sake of it.

Nice choice on the Pioneer, I've always had a thing for Pioneer stuff, aesthetically stunning and a high quality. I would have got the large tower speakers last time if I had any room for them. We only moved into this house last year and our previous place was tiny because I had to constantly make room for other kids so some rooms were being partitioned leaving others, like the lounge, pretty small. So my choice was limited by that house size. Because the Onkyo and Wharfedale combo was so good I just ended up keeping it when we moved and the sound is still good enough to fill a much larger room. If and when this setup does die on me I'll for sure be going for larger tower speakers so thanks for the tip
The RX speakers are yummy, some of my favourites.

I had a Panasonic Plasma in the lounge before that Sony Bravia. It's a brilliant TV and sits in the bedroom now because my daughter plays her Wii U up there on it. You can't go wrong with Panasonic especially their plasma stuff. In my humble opinion they are the best plasma makers by a long way. I've not got a Blu Ray player any more except on my pc. I used to have a PS3 for that and miss it so I'll likely have to get a stand alone player so that I don't have to put my pc on for the kids to watch a blu ray. That Pioneer you've got looks gorgeous, do you recommend it ?

 

[Papablu]

Mortgages eh, the word alone makes me wanna cry. My Mum died last year and thanks to her we were able to pay off our mortgage and that's when we moved to the bigger house. It's way overpriced down here in Bournemouth though.

Thanks for the info on the Pioneer player, I don't mind slower loading times if the quality of the picture is that good so I reckon I'd go for the LX52. I prefer the gloss black look to it too. Although the BDP-450-k is lovely the LX52 looks more Pioneer to me. I'll have to have a good read up on that one and maybe next month I'll splash out. My bank account is pretty much zeroed now, I'm as skint as I could be I just have to keep the mrs away from the internet for a week or two, and the shops actually, that'll be hard to do

I got that Sony for £1,200 a couple of months back and I believe it's even lower now. The picture is great especially for gaming but the one thing that stood out when I first got it was the colours. Blues are absolutely stunning. Sky sports news for example showed another depth that I didn't know existed. The sky in games shows so much more variety in colour and football shirts have a much wider variety than I knew. Subtle differences like that in the home environment really stand out. Sony have got it perfect with the colours but some people don't like it, it's down to personal taste, personally I love it. The latency in gaming is amazing for a non plasma, way better than my Panasonic Plasma was and not far off a monitor.

It's a stunning TV for the money. The 3D side of it I just don't bother with but I did have a dabble when I first got it and I'd say it's equal to the Panasonic Plasma and that's saying something. Yeah I'm totally happy with that tele until I get a 4k one.

Oh yes, I added another 2 backplates to my order at ocuk so that all three cards now have one. I'll be modding the top plate at some point and likely making a fair few changes. A couple of months down the line I may get it all into a new case, something that fills the area more and allows a bigger res.

 

[Papablu]

Ouch, 200K, that sounds worse than it is here but then it's to be expected with any properties around there now. Up north you can get the same type of places for fractions of the price but for me I wouldn't want to leave the sunny south coast.

With the 3D stuff I have experienced I have only come across one game that was perfect and that was Batman Arkham Asylum on the PS3. The 3D in that game was flawless and each game after that just started to disappoint me with ghosting on either foreground objects or in the background, there was always a downside and nothing hit that perfection again. So I gave up on it and hadn't used it since that first try on the Sony a couple of months ago.

I couldn't agree more regarding the 4k stuff at this time. I really love the idea of getting a 4k TV but something keeps telling me 'no', PC gaming, like you say, is not quite ready yet. There's not any 4k content available on Sky either which would be a major draw if there was. At least there's none that I'm aware of.
If I could have bought a 55 inch TV that ran at 1440p then that's the way I'd have gone. I think PC gaming's sweet spot is 1440p for good frame rates at high quality.

Oooh, now I do like that NZXT HUE RGB LED Controller. That's not something I'd seen before so I'm going to have a look into that. I don't think I can really add anything more to my build at this time as I only have 2 bays and they are full now, but I may be able to do some customising to fit that in later on.
My current stance with this build is to go with white lighting until I can figure out the way I want to take it. I may just leave it white but that controller would give me the option to try all sorts Thanks for the link Curlyriff.

I'm going to have a look through the forum for some of those 540 blogs now too.

Oh yes, my new rig will be with me on Tuesday. At least that's the estimate at the moment. I really can't wait

 

[Papablu]

Thanks Shivy, I do have a fair bit of soldering skill from a previous job but I don't have a multimeter. It's tempting to have a go at that but I've worked out a way that I can use the NZXT controller with my system if I can find the parts I'm hoping they sell.

I'm looking for a bracket or box that I can install that controller into, on the outside of my pc. I've been planning on using a riser to bring my pc up about 10cm and it'll give me a better place to store my keyboard. But I can mount the controller under the pc on that riser so I need an external enclosure that will allow me to do so. Does one exsist ?

 

[Papablu]

lol, yeah that was the main selling point for me too. As you can see my table is full of remotes but that's because my Harmony remote got stood on.
I think once I find the hue the I'm looking for I'd most likely leave it be anyway so I don't mind the button one. Except my little 3 year old loves buttons too so there's no doubt I'm going to have to find that perfect setup quite often

Hm, dilemmas eh.

 

[Papablu]

That's OK, the Hue to me being plug and play just made it so much simpler. If I can I often find something that just works, has a warranty and don't have to worry. DIY systems are great for value and custom needs but with my spare time at moment and I can only imagine yours with the Children etc, this seems like a simpler option.

Luckily I work from home but for the last year I've taken on double the work after a guy left so I don't get as much spare time as Id like, but that's ok, it's allowed me to be able to afford this pc and get my house up to scratch.

Yeah, there are some great builds, anything take your fancy?

Yeah there's a lot of decent stuff. I've almost got through the Corsair 540 specific thread and I'm working through the "Show Us The inside of your Case!" thread at the same time. Some very inspiring stuff and like you, I have loads of ideas that I'd love to try. At the moment I consider myself a total newb so connecting those ideas with the knowledge needed to implement them is the issue for me. That'll come with time and the invaluable help I get from guys like you Curlyriff and for that I'm so grateful.

Can't wait, I think I am almost as excited as you haha

I've got over a hundred PC games so getting this PC back is better than 10 christmas days all in one I bought a lot of the games during Steam sales and am yet to try 50 percent of them so I hope that some day I'll get through them all. Looking through some Steam profiles I see people that have over a thousand games and I'm like

 

[Papablu]

That's alright then. What you doing for work? I need to get a better paying job tbh. This all fine and dandy but just to be able to get a luxury item ever couple of months without having to remortgage the flat would be a godsend.

I work for my Father in Law who's based in Ohio, designing custom paint schemes for all sorts of stuff but mainly cars and bikes. Getting all the stencils made etc so I'm lucky enough to have a cutting machine in the workshop.

Haha, yeah there is just so much inspiration to be found in the modding community. I am really wanting to do an acrylic tube build with the new Monsoon water cooling gear. Custom braided cables and some custom acrylic sheeting in a large cube case. Colour wise I want to get back to Yellow or Green. Something other than the unfortunate situation of Red & Black we have at the moment.

lol, yeah I know exactly what you mean regarding the red and black. That hasn't been helped by the simply gorgeous looking Asus and MSI motherboards. Hence why I went for white tubing, to try to get a little bit away from that red and black dominance. But they do look superb.

I went to UV and orange on my Tesseract and it looked really nice, a little gimmicky I s'pose but I'm not one for creating the same thing twice which is why I went with the Asus board on this build. It had to match in with the surroundings and the white tubing was ideal for that. Oooh, while I was typing I just had a photo sent to me of the build so far, it's looking exactly how I wanted it

Ha, I think I have 4 games in total at moment. I haven't had my PC more than a month and I always buy a game, complete it, maybe play again depending and then buy another.

I can't imagine having 10 games tbh mainly because I need to sort out more hard drive space. Having things on my 3TB HDD is a chore and such a throwback for me. I just want SSD's everywhere. Small, silent, reliable and reasonable in cost to storage.

I think my obsession stems from the days of the Mega Drive and SNES. I was pretty skint all the time back then, young kids, bad job, no money for games. I always wanted to be able to have more than one or two games at the same time, so that I could pick and choose what I wanted to play. But all I could afford was one or two and had to trade in every time I wanted a new game. I promised myself that one day when I was financially more stable I'd never trade in another game. I know you can't trade in PC games anyway but that's where I got the attitude from It's probably pointless as I only play maybe 4 or 5 of them at any one period in time but the others are there just in case. With a 1TB SSD I can have 50 decent games installed and still have 400GB left over so it's nice.

I've read that the more you fill the space on an SSD the quicker it will deteriorate, is that correct ?

 

[Papablu]

Fair play. Sounds like a great job and certainly gets you some cool tools for home. Ha workshop. I have a kitchen floor with not much space. The ideas that could be finished with the cutting machine etc. I might be down to your at this rate lol.

My workshop's a little too temporary at the moment as I just got a 16ft garden shed put up quickly before moving here and haven't had a chance to get a decent cabin type workshop yet. The prices are so good these days that it's cheaper to have them built for you than to build it yourself. I used to be a shed builder, back when I was totally skint I loved the job and I could make any type shed or workshop but the pay sucked.

That is fair play. White tubing looks really good and can go really well I think when the rest of the build is pure stealth black. That would have been my option. Asus black edition mobo, RAM with white LED's and some custom cables that are black with white highlights or similar.

I don't really like the UV of anything. Always makes things look/feel cheaper I have found but Orange itself can look really classy when done right. I saw your old build mind and thought that looked good.

I couldn't agree more about UV. I liked some builds that I saw but others lost a certain amount of classiness. In all honesty I didn't like mine too much and was considering putting back the normal led strip. Then this latest issue cropped up and left me with no confidence with the combination of parts I had in the system. I still don't know for sure what caused the problem but ocuk have been amazing sorting me out with a replacement.

And photos!! Can't wait to see them.

I'll get some taken with my good camera on Tuesday and I'll also be asking for ideas on aesthetically improving the system. I have a few ideas but want to run them by you guys first. I may get some ideas drawn up this weekend.

Oh I feel young now. I am only 25 but I have an Amiga 1200 and a Megadrive. The Amiga was awesome. It had about 300 games for it at the time. Most are worn out and dead now but the original Doom, Settlers, Desert Storm, Lemmings were great games that I spent many a happy day playing.

Yeah I am wanting to place 2 x 1TB SSD's in Raid 0 and just have everything on one drive location. The speeds are fast enough and all that. I am just lazy when it comes partitions and set-up. As long as my folders are organised and easy to search for then I am a happy gamer.

And I really wouldn't worry about deterioration. There have been tests done where SSD's have had 600TB of data written over a long term test to them with no issues at all.

That's a relief regarding the SSD's, I have been concerned about that. I too am lazy regarding setting up the drives, I just settle for what's there instead of planning for something that could be so much better and easier to use. I'm not that good at keeping things organised.
I never had an Amiga, that was not a good time for me financially to be able to get one. I tended to just walk past the shop windows and see them there and cry I don't know what game it was that I used to see in one shop but it used to impress me somewhat. It was a platformer and there were floating eyeballs to fight, in a forest setting ?

 

[Papablu]

No worries on the delay Curlyriff, we all have lives to get on with and priorities above the internet.

A black / purple highlight build is one that I considered for this current project as it matches one of the sofas in my lounge. I know it's a bit silly to match your furniture but that's me Not only that though, they are subtle yet striking and I've seen only a few around at the moment. The only reason I backed away from it was the availability of parts and finding replacements in a suitable timeframe for me to get a replacement PC..

The PC is coming along nicely. I have had to do a few repairs on it as three fans were not working and one was fouling on the waterloop. I needed to get the thermal sensors relocated as ocuk did a temporary job on those at my request. It needed a good cleanup

I've fitted that NZXT led controller in the back of the case because there was no spare bay due to the blu ray writer and fan controller. That's working brilliantly, I love having the full control of the light levels. I'm waiting on some black numberplate tape to arrive so I can get the led's in properly.

I need to get some combs fitted to my cables which I've got but will wait for the tape to arrive and do that at the same time.

I will be painting a simple mask around the upper and right edges of the clear panel to hide the led's better.
The green led on the left will be put behind the graphics cards water blocks to give the clear parts some light.

Obviously this pic has been taken with a flash and the front panel off so it's all a bit bright but once I get everything the way I like it I'll get some proper pics.

I would like to get rigid acrylic tubing down the line a bit but I can't find any help on those. Do they need different fittings ?

Cheers,
Mark.

 

[Papablu]

If it was my 4k I'd personally be waiting or x99. It's so close now and those 4 gpus on a six core haswell-e and ddr4 would be mighty sexy..


Speaking of sexy, god damn and the above rig.

I'm way too impatient for that, besides, what if I'd dead by then, I'd have missed out on a few weeks gaming Thanks, glad you like the rig, I'm going to try to make it 'my own' but that will take time. I needed the warranty especially after what happened to the last one.

Originally Posted by Curlyriff
Bloody at work and can't see pictures again so will have to wait till tonight.

In regards to the acrylic tubing, yes they require different fittings. Check out OcUK for Monsoon free center fittings.

YOUR BASKET
1 x Monsoon Hardline Pro Bender Kit 1/2 x 5/8 (16mm) - Value Bundle £49.99
1 x Monsoon Free Center Hardline 1/2 X 5/8 (16mm) 6 Pack - Red £24.95
1 x Monsoon Hardline Acrylic Tube 1/2 X 5/8 (16mm) 4 Pack - Black - 4x30" £9.95
Total : £84.89 (includes shipping : ).




Here are the fittings, tubing and full tool kit with mandrels for the bending.

In regards to the black/purple. The best I have seen at moment is pretty much stealth black build, black tubing, purple fittings, purple fluid & lights with Black & Purple sleeved cables.

Spray can with some of the Corsair SP120 fans to make the rings purple and you could be set to go.

Thanks a lot for those links Curlyriff. I searched ocuk for acrylic tubing and came up empty but that was on my Mac which doesn't surprise me with using Safari. That looks pretty decent stuff for a relatively minor outlay. It's definitely something I want to do in the coming months.
Are those fittings as reliable as the standard soft tube fittings or is there more chance of a leak with the acrylic setups, requiring a lot more precision in the build process ?

So basically without the ROG light in the centre of my board and new extension cables I could quite easily convert to purple at the same time as doing the acrylic tubing, that's another option I'd like to try. Being an airbrush painter I have plenty of different purples to get that exact match on the fan too. Food for thought

Thanks for the help again buddy.

 

[Papablu]

Curlyriff, thanks again mate for the help and excellent advice.

Those tube bending parts would actually be useful for other stuff for me so I will have to get that kit when I'm flush again, maybe next month.

Do you know anyone who has successfully painted fittings ?
I'm just curious about how much they can be handled once painted as my fittings are pretty tight and I reckon if I painted them with my current paints they'd likely rub off the edges with the handling they'd need. Mind you I have the dark nickel type fittings at the moment and they could look good without painting.

Absolutely love that bedding I may get a set of that next month as our bedroom is going down the purple, off-white and black route already.

The black tubing has always taken my fancy, I just think it looks classy with an acrylic setup. I think I'd like to have a bit of clear in there also with a coloured coolant because a lot of the people who see my pc in the flesh would need the visual proof that there's actually something running through those pipes You know the type

It's a real shame about Mayhems Aurora, it looks perfect for that type of setup.

Bart, I love the Caselabs stuff but as Curlyriff says they don't have stock at ocuk at the moment and it would have slowed the build down considerably. I like their Mercury S8 but seeing as my son will get this PC within a year I have to consider that it'll be going into a small room with an even smaller space to fit into. Besides the Corsair 540 is looking rather sweet where it is

 

[Papablu]

Ah I see, it's no wonder I couldn't find them

Well it's too late for this build right now but I'll keep that in mind for the upgrade I may do in the purple scheme over the next few months. I'll have to get a very specific size though. Thanks for your help Bart.

 

[Papablu]

Hey Curlyriff,

Yeah I'm not happy with the tube lines to be honest. In particular the the way the middle card has been dragged down by the short fitting between itself and the bottom card. That has made the tube between the top two cards slant off considerably.

Obviously the choice of those two fittings was the wrong choice and I'm going to email ocuk and ask for something more suitable to be sent out. Which of course means emptying my entire loop yet again. Grr it's just an ongoing theme at the moment.

Do you have any suggestions for a better bridging setup between these cards where there's a one card gap ?

 

[Papablu]

Hey Curlyriff, thanks once again for your much appreciated expertise on this. I've spoke to ocuk and they have apologised and I'm just trying to sort out a fix.

I thought about a quad parallel with blank link but the gaps are a bit odd with this board like you say. The space from the top card to the second is like one and a half slots and single slot between the 2nd and 3rd cards. That's obviously twin slot cards or whatever term is used.

I could use a twin parallel on the bottom two cards and a normal fitting and tube between the top card and the further away 2nd card ?

 

[Papablu]

Thanks Curlyriff. The distance between the two bottom cards is 40 mm at the end closest to the left of the case.

The measurement at the other end of the card just past the fittings is 35mm.

 

[Papablu]

Sorry for the late reply Curlyriff, I've been having nightmares with the PC tonight and have just finished putting it all back together.

Basically I was told to fit a spacer which was in my box of watercooling spares. So I did this and I didn't like it too much. I wasn't happy with the amount of thread that was left to grip the block but was told it would be ok so I did that. I then started getting the coolant circulated only to have that fitting leak coolant all over the bottom card. So I've been drying that out and getting everything else back to normal and I just finished 20 minutes ago.

You're not being a pain at all buddy, I'm just really grateful for your help so thank you kindly.

The distance from the top of the PCB of the 1st GPU and the top of PCB on the 2nd GPU is: 62mm

The distance between the top of the PCB of the 2nd GPU and the top of the PCB of the 3rd GPU is: 40mm

The gpu waterblocks I've got are these :

EK ones

Come to think of it I did have a triple terminal in my last pc and that has gone awol while it was at ocuk. I'm gonna get them to send me a twin out if we can confirm which one is needed

 

[Papablu]

About Aurora.
Mayhems made an improved version, called Aurora 2.
It's supposed to look good for up to 2 years.
OCuk stocks 3 colors, but you can always use dye.

Oooh, I do like the silver, that would go in any colour scheme. Thanks for the info Bart, much appreciated.

Oh gosh, sounds like a nightmare. I would have freaked out. Spacers are not great and I am not sure I would never suggest placing one of those spaces with the thread that you have. I know people do and have been fine but I just don't like to risk it personally and I think yours above is a prime example.

It was bad, I felt like just walking away and forgetting about PC's altogether. Then I came to my senses and just got on with the clean up process.

Based on the dimensions, the items below are what are required then. This would allow you to install your loop much easier with a cleaner look, at least to me it would be.

YOUR BASKET
1 x EK Water Blocks EK-FC Terminal DUAL Parallel £13.99
2 x Bitspower 1/4 inch adjustable Aquapipe II (41 - 69mm ) - Matte Black £11.99 (£23.98)
Total : £37.97 (includes shipping : ).

That's exactly what's needed, that block will hold the bottom cards straight and the hard tubed link will stay straight and not buckle with the slightest off centre alignment.

One thing though. I was just looking on a youtube video for the Bitspower 1/4 inch adjustable Aquapipe II and couldn't find an exact match but the fella did use some Bitspower Crystal Link Tube and two Multi Link adapters which I thought would be ideal because I could go with the black sparkle fittings to match what I've currently got.

I've had a look through ocuk for these fittings but came across quite a few and wasn't sure which would be right for my setup. All these sizes are totally confusing to me as they seem to use different terms for different items and I don't want to get the wrong stuff.

Firstly, would you recommend going down that route ?

If so can I be real pain and ask you to point me to the items I need ?

Sorry for all the questions and whatnot but I'm very limited with funds right now and combined with my newb status I can't afford to get it wrong

Thanks so much for all your help Curlyriff, I can't explain how grateful I am.

 

[Papablu]

Curlyriff I think I've got them sorted now and have managed to source the same Bitspower 1/4 inch adjustable Aquapipe II (41 - 69mm ) - Matte Black in a shiny black and also got a 22-31mm version for the lower cards which I'll get fitted while I wait for ocuk to get the dual parallel for me.

I would really like to get some quick release fittings set up around the system in strategic places but I don't know what I need to connect them to the pipes. They aren't well explained or photographed and I can't work out if I need to buy compression fittings as well. Any ideas anyone ?

 

[Papablu]

Hi Curlyriff,

Thanks so much for the advice. I have purchased 3 sets of Bitspower quick disconnects already (One spare set for draining) which I'll use to isolate the graphics cards. I am getting through so much coolant at the moment as I have a leak on the left side front fitting on the top rad. OCUK have sent out a new 45 degree rotary fitting to replace it.
That's the second one of those fittings I have had leak on me.

I'm hoping I can get it all done in one go as I'm expecting those adjustable fittings this Thursday.

As for the Y fitting I've had a look at the back end of my pc and as you can see here there's not a lot of room to get a Y fitting in there. The wiring has been messed up as I'm still trying to hook things up so ignore that mess
Instead of the Y fitting I was wondering if I could simply put an elbow fitting on the plugged up side of the pump where the makeshift arrow is pointing. If I had an elbow fitting with a 6 inch length of tube and a compression fitting and plug on the end of that, would I be able to drain from that, would it work like that ?

Basically rotate the fitting to pull the tube out and unplug from the compression fitting to empty ?

No worries about the reply buddy I gathered you were busy

 

[Papablu]

What did you decide on component wise then? Or is it still a work in progress?

- Case: Corsair Carbide 540 Cube Case- Black
- CPU: Intel Core i7 4790K, Watercooled and Overclocked to 4.5GHz (I've knocked it back to 4.5 due to wanting more stability)
- Motherboard: Asus Maximus VII Formula Z97X Now water cooled too
- RAM: Avexis Blitz 16GB (4x4GB) 2400MHz C10
- Graphics: 3 x Sapphire Tri-X OC AMD Radeon R9 290X 4096MB Watercooled
- Cooling: Full Custom Watercooling Loop, Mayhems White Fluid
- Primary Drive: Samsung 840 Evo Series 1TB SSD
- Secondary Drive: Seagate Barracuda 2TB SATA-III Hard Drive
- Optical Drive: LG 16x Bluray writer
- Audio: 7.1 Channel HD Audio with SPDIF I/O
- Operating System: Microsoft Windows 8.1 64-Bit
- Power Supply: Super Flower Leadex Platinum 1200W
- Bitfenix Fan Controller
- DEMCiflex Dust Filter Kit
- NZXT Led RGB controller

But yeah it's still a work in progress as I'll eventually add acrylic tubing and the appropriate fittings. Plus I'm still working on lighting and cabling.

Honestly that sounds like such a ball ache. Are OcUK sending some more coolant as well then.

It has to be said that 45 degree rotary fittings are not the greatest. I have not used them in a long time for the exact reason that around 50% off the ones I have used leaked.

Honestly the best resource to check out for waterloop ideas and how to get yours cleaned up and set up is google images.

I would still standby and suggest that the quick disconnects would not be worth the time and effort to fit in the loop.

Curlyriff, lol, yeah I agree a total ball ache. I've purchased some more white coolant myself but ocuk are sending me more when they send the block out which is on order.
My main reason for going down the quick disconnect route was my son. I can see me having to do a lot of running repairs when he has it.

Aesthetically it shouldn't be too bad as one will go across that bottom tube into the rad. The other I'm not 100% sure yet, I may just leave it at the one and save the others for the next build. I'll see how it fits in first. I've got 2 metres of primochill white tubing on the way as there's a few scratches and marks on my current tubing so it'll be the ideal time to fit those disconnects.

I'm going to see how it goes for the next few months and I'll swap to the hard line setup then even if I haven't had any more issues with leaks. But if I do get any more leaks I'll swap it straight away. If I change too much right now and my system starts to play up then ocuk won't be liable for any problems. I want to know for certain if the system is fully reliable before I start to swap out too much. Everything I'm doing at the moment is being discussed with ocuk and OK'd by them or even down to their parts failing as with the leaks.

Again, at work at moment so picture not visible. However the idea to get the drain is to make sure that you connect the drain run to the lowest part of the build so it drains via gravity (and maybe a little wiggle). If your elbow fitting is at the bottom with 6" of tube that will be fine.
Are you by an chance to spin the top radiator around by 180 degree? This could make for much cleaner loop but based on the previous picture it might be a little tight.

Thanks for everything buddy. I'll have a look at that rad. As mentioned I have some spare tubing if I decide to switch it around then I'm all ready with parts. I'm hoping it would allow a straight connection to be able to get rid of that 45 degree fitting.

If you could have a look at that pic when you get the chance and let me know if that elbow and tubing would work from there I'd be very grateful.

The pic you posted is not showing for me either I bet it's nice though