Possible new tax for over-40s to pay for social care

[HACO]

Basically social care for boomers is too expensive and they’re seriously considering introducing a tax for over-40s to fund it:
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/jul/26/uk-ministers-looking-at-plans-to-raise-taxes-for-over-40s-to-pay-for-social-care

It will be a shared pool (i.e. what you pay in is spent now, when you get old what young people pay in is spent on you, like the state pension). In other words, very likely that it won’t exist in a few decades given population stagnation and decline.

 

[PCDAVE2]

Hmmm I'm 41 this year so another tax raise then probably from April next year. I wonder if the money raised will actually go to fund social care and will the level of current services provided just stay the same? This change will not immediately help the current generation in care for the short term, but with an increasing number of elderly in the population this is inevitable I guess. I wonder how this will be calculated (i.e. those with low incomes / families and contributions).

 

[Devilman]

Yet another ******* pyramid scheme to keep the greedy, selfish, arrogant boomers in their paid-for houses at the young's expense.

Utterly disgusting bunch of self-serving *****.

 

[Ryan-3]

They could time it to end with student loans. Then people like myself will go from having one "tax" to another in twenty years time.

 

[Uther]

With an 80 seat majority everyone better lube up for the ride.

 

[Rich1988]

I would like to see how those who don't work and who never have get funded for their social care when they are older ?

 

[muon]

Boomers are already starting to retire now. Millennials will turn 40 towards the end of this decade (already are if you cutoff is early 80s).

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopula...les/ukpopulationpyramidinteractive/2020-01-08

How does this work?

I know you have to start doing it at some point in order to avoid passing the problem to the next generation, but money should be held back to build up a fund (even if it's just notional).

Looking at the age pyramid above, Gen Z are screwed.

https://www.ft.com/content/c69b49de-1368-11e9-a581-4ff78404524e

I always thought really high inheritance tax would be a good way to pay for some of the inter-generational equity problems. But that's moving in the wrong direction for that, decreasing significantly rather than increasing.

 

[Hades]

Yet another ******* pyramid scheme to keep the greedy, selfish, arrogant boomers in their paid-for houses at the young's expense.

Utterly disgusting bunch of self-serving *****.

Strictly speaking a boomer is a person born between 1946 to 1964. My wife is a boomer but I'm just outside of that. I pay 40% tax on most of my earnings and almost all of my peronal allowance is also eroded (so unlike most people I don't get much of a tax free allowance at the lower end). I pay for private healthcare for myself, my wife and my two kids so I am not a drain on the NHS despite happily paying in to it all of my life. My brother and I looked after our father and our mother as they got older and needed medical help when dying from cancer (after they had a life of paying their own tax too). I even pay to put two kids through private education as well as paying the portion of tax that goes towards everyone elses state education which my family do not benefit from. It was not our intention to do that but cuircumstance forced that upon us so we made the best of it. My wife and I hve never claimed unemplyment benefit despite her being unemplyed in the past.

So I've paid extra at every turn as well as (quite happily) paying tax for everyone elses benefit. I've got very little out of the system I pay tax into and am a massive net contributor to it because I believe in helping others in society. My wife and I managed this by living in a house we have no money to refurbish (my kids are embarrassed to bring friends home), until last year we couldn't afford a decent car and we haven't been on a family holiday for the last 7 years (at least - I can't remember exactly when it was). Yet you flippantly throw such insults at my wife's and my generation.

Yes I earn a good salary (usually working 12 to 15 hours a day) but I have thrown just about every penny of that into my family's welfare while still supporting the state through taxation (which as pointed out I am happy to pay for the benefit of society). For people like you to look down on my generation is frankly naive. I don't know you or what you have done in life. For all I know, you pay a record amount of tax. But your post comes across as bitter and jealous. Stop looking to be a victim and try to make your own life better, and the life of others better. Stop looking down on people who had their own challenges in life and made decisions based on the options available to them at the time.

 

[Stretch]

For people like you to look down on my generation is frankly naive. I don't know you or what you have done in life. For all I know, you pay a record amount of tax. But your post comes across as bitter and jealous. Stop looking to be a victim and try to make your own life better, and the life of others better. Stop looking down on people who had their own challenges in life and made decisions based on the options available to them at the time.

This developing crisis has been well documented for decades, but heads have been buried firmly in the sand. All younger people want is for those who are part of the demographic anomaly to take responsibility and stop making excuse as to why such a heavy burden should now be shared amongst the wider population when it could/should have be solved back in the 80s.

 

[Devilman]

This developing crisis has been well documented for decades, but heads have been buried firmly in the sand. All younger people want is for those who are part of the demographic anomaly to take responsibility and stop making excuse as to why such a heavy burden should now be shared amongst the wider population when it could/should have be solved back in the 80s.

Exactly this.. The problem has been obvious for decades, but the boomer generation chose to simply kick the can down the road so they could continue to enjoy what they fought for, while subsequently denying it from their own children and grandchildren.

Strictly speaking a boomer is a person born between 1946 to 1964. My wife is a boomer but I'm just outside of that. I pay 40% tax on most of my earnings and almost all of my peronal allowance is also eroded (so unlike most people I don't get much of a tax free allowance at the lower end). I pay for private healthcare for myself, my wife and my two kids so I am not a drain on the NHS despite happily paying in to it all of my life. My brother and I looked after our father and our mother as they got older and needed medical help when dying from cancer (after they had a life of paying their own tax too). I even pay to put two kids through private education as well as paying the portion of tax that goes towards everyone elses state education which my family do not benefit from. It was not our intention to do that but cuircumstance forced that upon us so we made the best of it. My wife and I hve never claimed unemplyment benefit despite her being unemplyed in the past.

So I've paid extra at every turn as well as (quite happily) paying tax for everyone elses benefit. I've got very little out of the system I pay tax into and am a massive net contributor to it because I believe in helping others in society. My wife and I managed this by living in a house we have no money to refurbish (my kids are embarrassed to bring friends home), until last year we couldn't afford a decent car and we haven't been on a family holiday for the last 7 years (at least - I can't remember exactly when it was). Yet you flippantly throw such insults at my wife's and my generation.

Yes I earn a good salary (usually working 12 to 15 hours a day) but I have thrown just about every penny of that into my family's welfare while still supporting the state through taxation (which as pointed out I am happy to pay for the benefit of society). For people like you to look down on my generation is frankly naive. I don't know you or what you have done in life. For all I know, you pay a record amount of tax. But your post comes across as bitter and jealous. Stop looking to be a victim and try to make your own life better, and the life of others better. Stop looking down on people who had their own challenges in life and made decisions based on the options available to them at the time.

Your cherry-picked example of your own situation and then trying to apply it to your entire generation is whats naive. You are an anomaly.. The majority of boomers do NOT pay for private healthcare, they repeatedly voted for governments who would cut them break after break after break.. (Triple lock anyone?) And now they want to take a giant dump on the doorstep of their kids and grandkids with a move like this.

The majority of boomers take far more out of the system than they ever put into it and are expecting the younger generations to pay for them, while denying the younger generations those same benefits. It is truly vulgar.

 

[Rroff]

This developing crisis has been well documented for decades, but heads have been buried firmly in the sand. All younger people want is for those who are part of the demographic anomaly to take responsibility and stop making excuse as to why such a heavy burden should now be shared amongst the wider population when it could/should have be solved back in the 80s.

Stop looking to be a victim and try to make your own life better, and the life of others better. Stop looking down on people who had their own challenges in life and made decisions based on the options available to them at the time.

My reply to both of those are it isn't that easy. The actions of older generations have both denied an increasing number of the younger generations the same opportunities they had, and I'm not saying those opportunities were necessarily come by easily but they were certainly a lot more achievable a few decades back, but also they've made things more intricately interconnected and squeezing the boomer generations is also going to squeeze some of the generations below them that are dependant on them due to the opportunities or benefits they've been denied.

Very simply the same amount of effort today in far too many cases does not net you the same rewards, not even close, as it did for past generations - beyond any semblance of balance to it.

 

[Devilman]

Stop looking to be a victim and try to make your own life better, and the life of others better. Stop looking down on people who had their own challenges in life and made decisions based on the options available to them at the time.

Nobody is "looking to be a victim", I apologize if the truth hurts and you refuse to accept the reality.

It would be great for people to have the chance to "make their own life better"... but are prevented from doing so by vulgar private rental prices (often owned by the boomer generation), combined with a total lack of social housing being built (something the boomer generation benefited from massively) and utterly crap wages (far worse relative to the cost of living, compared to people of the boomer generation).

So please.. do tell us how those "boomer challenges" were so hard for them. No generation before or after has experienced such massive technological, social and economical change in our entire history, they have known nothing but increased prosperity, mobility, quality of life, life expectancy and economic prosperity since their birth.

Tell us, how many people of the current generation of school leavers and those leaving Uni will have even remotely those same benefits?

 

[Hades]

Exactly this.. The problem has been obvious for decades, but the boomer generation chose to simply kick the can down the road so they could continue to enjoy what they fought for, while subsequently denying it from their own children and grandchildren.




Your cherry-picked example of your own situation and then trying to apply it to your entire generation is whats naive. You are an anomaly.. The majority of boomers do NOT pay for private healthcare, they repeatedly voted for governments who would cut them break after break after break.. (Triple lock anyone?) And now they want to take a giant dump on the doorstep of their kids and grandkids with a move like this.

The majority of boomers take far more out of the system than they ever put into it and are expecting the younger generations to pay for them, while denying the younger generations those same benefits. It is truly vulgar.

That is my point - complain about individuals, not an entire demographic. Complain about net takers, not net contributors.

 

[Stretch]

That is my point - complain about individuals, not an entire demographic. Complain about net takers, not net contributors.

Unfortunately that won't solve the problem.

 

[Devilman]

That is my point - complain about individuals, not an entire demographic. Complain about net takers, not net contributors.

When the majority of those individuals fall within the demographic of boomers, then what?

 

[Rroff]

Nobody is "looking to be a victim", I apologize is the truth hurts and you refuse to accept the reality.

It would be great for people to have the chance to "make their own life better"... but are prevented from doing so by vulgar private rental prices (often owned by the boomer generation), combined with a total lack of social housing being built (something the boomer generation benefited from massively) and utterly crap wages (far worse relative to the cost of living, compared to people of the boomer generation).

So please.. do tell us how those "boomer challenges" were so hard for them. No generation before or after has experienced such massive technological, social and economical change in our entire history, they have known nothing but increased prosperity, mobility, quality of life, life expectancy and economic prosperity since their birth.

Tell us, how many people of the current generation of school leavers and those leaving Uni will have even remotely those same benefits?

One thing I find interesting - I dunno how much this is true in a wider context than my own experience. My parents generation you could often get your foot in the door and train up into a role internally and 30-40 hours a week contract was common across the broad spread of roles. These days a lot of companies don't want to take anyone on willingly that doesn't have "a degree, any degree, and previous experience" and 20 hour contracts are becoming far more common - in-fact several roles we just advertised for are 15 hours (though you'd generally work 26-30) when they used to be 28 hours a decade ago and 37.5 hours 30 years ago or so.

 

[Hades]

Nobody is "looking to be a victim", I apologize is the truth hurts and you refuse to accept the reality.

It would be great for people to have the chance to "make their own life better"... but are prevented from doing so by vulgar private rental prices (often owned by the boomer generation), combined with a total lack of social housing being built (something the boomer generation benefited from massively) and utterly crap wages (far worse relative to the cost of living, compared to people of the boomer generation).

So please.. do tell us how those "boomer challenges" were so hard for them. No generation before or after has experienced such massive technological, social and economical change in our entire history, they have known nothing but increased prosperity, mobility, quality of life, life expectancy and economic prosperity since their birth.

Tell us, how many people of the current generation of school leavers and those leaving Uni will have even remotely those same benefits?

My parents could barely afford heating. Many people of their generation were in abject poverty. When I was a kid I had one bath a week. Today's generation is not as poor as many think.

 

[Stretch]

My parents could barely afford heating. Many people of their generation were in abject poverty. When I was a kid I had one bath a week. Today's generation is not as poor as many think.

Certainly not as poor as they'll be tomorrow... unless the soon to be retired start coughing up

 

[Hades]

When the majority of those individuals fall within the demographic of boomers, then what?

So you tar a whole generation because of your belief that some people are priviledged?

Isn't a persons age one definition of an immutable charataristic?

 

[Hades]

Certainly not as poor as they'll be tomorrow... unless the soon to be retired start coughing up

LOL, true.

But there is a law of untintended consequences. Take too much tax from me and I will have to revert to NHS care and state education for my kids. That's an overall net cost to the tax payer.