Programming language for kids?

NeilF · 28 Apr 2015 at 08:21

So I thought I'd try and do a little programming with my two kids, 8 & 12.

Looked at "Simple Basic" which was actually not bad, BUT:-
1) It's case sensitive so "do" does not compile for example, as it needs to be "Do". Not kid friendly!
2) Compile/running isn't very friendly.

Next, I lookinged at Small Basic (from Micro$oft). Not bad.

But is there anything else out there that's a nice straight forwards/flexible programming languge (basic) for kids?

gregorius · 28 Apr 2015 at 08:49

Python.

NeilF · 28 Apr 2015 at 09:10

gregorius said:
Python.

Got a link to something somewhere to download?

Had a look at Python 3.1 and doesn't seem very kids friendly?

meandu229 · 28 Apr 2015 at 09:13

Scratch?
If you have a pi look here.
https://www.raspberrypi.org/learning/getting-started-with-scratch/
Depending on your kids it may be too young for the 12 year old.
Quite a few resources here.
https://www.raspberrypi.org/resources/learn/
Something called Kids Ruby looks fun.

NeilF · 28 Apr 2015 at 10:04

meandu229 said:
Scratch?
If you have a pi look here.
https://www.raspberrypi.org/learning/getting-started-with-scratch/
Depending on your kids it may be too young for the 12 year old.
Quite a few resources here.
https://www.raspberrypi.org/resources/learn/
Something called Kids Ruby looks fun.

Scratch looks like a very simple way to get kids using coding logic while being visually appealing. Plus all seems browser based so very accessible!

So far Small Basic seems a very nice environment, but it would be nice if graphically it was just a touch more powerful. I mean you can't even do things like draw some lines, clear the screen and redraw them, to do super basic animation etc. (I believe)

GravyMonster · 28 Apr 2015 at 10:23

VB.Net

Not trolling, if they're going to learn something, it may as well be a language that's actually used in production environments. It's got the most english-like syntax too. Download Visual Studio Express for free and you're away and running. I don't see why compiling is such a burden - it's just a single button press.

Stelly · 28 Apr 2015 at 10:41

Spunkey said:
VB.Net

Not trolling, if they're going to learn something, it may as well be a language that's actually used in production environments. It's got the most english-like syntax too. Download Visual Studio Express for free and you're away and running. I don't see why compiling is such a burden - it's just a single button press.

I think C# is better to be honest, closer to C and Java is syntax.

Stelly

GravyMonster · 28 Apr 2015 at 10:52

I agree, as a language C# is much better. However I would imagine that for a child to grasp the core concepts a language with English-style commands would be easier to grasp.

NeilF · 28 Apr 2015 at 11:43

Spunkey said:
VB.Net

Not trolling, if they're going to learn something, it may as well be a language that's actually used in production environments. It's got the most english-like syntax too. Download Visual Studio Express for free and you're away and running. I don't see why compiling is such a burden - it's just a single button press.

A bit heavy for 8-12yr olds to start with surely? I've done a little bit and I don't remember it being a turn key operation. ie: A single little listing with nice english statements in there to achieve something straight forward.

dazzerd · 28 Apr 2015 at 14:14

Spunkey said:
I agree, as a language C# is much better. However I would imagine that for a child to grasp the core concepts a language with English-style commands would be easier to grasp.

Not to start a war here but you do realise that c# and vb.net are exactly the same language (save about 1 or 2 features). The only real difference is in the syntax.

I think when people think vb they think vb6 but it hasn't been that way for over ten years.

But I agree vb.net is a great language to learn and easier to learn than c# or java simply because the syntax is more in line with normal language.

OP you should also delve into VBA, great ways to make things interactive using a spreadsheet and it can be a really helpful introduction to OOP.

Rroff · 28 Apr 2015 at 14:28

NeilFawcett said:
A bit heavy for 8-12yr olds to start with surely? I've done a little bit and I don't remember it being a turn key operation. ie: A single little listing with nice english statements in there to achieve something straight forward.

Depends on how technical inclined they are - I was pretty capable with both quickbasic (qb45) and bbc basic by the time I was 12.

Deceptor · 28 Apr 2015 at 14:55

When I messed around with Lego Mindstorms a few years ago I found their software for creating logic for the "brain" to follow was extremely child friendly, it's simply a visual interface where you can drag/drop in segments to perform actions, check conditions, do loops or call a function/etc. It's not a language (I do believe you can write source code for it too though) but it would certainly help teach some core principles of programming.

Google link below shows the software so you get an idea, it does mean buying some Lego I guess though - but that's never a bad thing

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=l...sa=X&ei=FJA_VcTcHdLLaK7cgPgB&ved=0CMYBEPwFKAE

DodgeeRascal · 28 Apr 2015 at 22:09

http://codecombat.com/

don't see a reason why you can't start off with JavaScript to learn the basics.

EDIT: ahh see it's changed since I last saw this. default language is Python but you can set it to use JavaScript and some more if you wish.

Andre · 29 Apr 2015 at 05:59

Assembler. It would give them the best understanding of how things work under the hood.
I'm still able to look at Z80/8080 byte code and tell what it does

All depends how tech-savvy they are, and what they are interested on - be it graphics or design or actual coding, there are many different areas of computers and what can be done with them. Ask them what they would be interested in and be influenced by that

Scougar · 30 Apr 2015 at 18:09

Alice.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alice_(software)

Purpose
Alice was developed to address five core problems in educational programming

Most programming languages are designed to be usable for "production code" and thus introduce additional complexity. Alice is designed solely to teach programming theory without the complex semantics of production languages such as C++. Users can place objects from Alice's gallery into the virtual world that they have imagined, and then they can program by dragging and dropping tiles that represent logical structures. Additionally, the user can manipulate Alice's camera and lighting to make further enhancements. Alice can be used for 3D user interfaces.
Alice is conjoined with its IDE. There is no syntax to remember. However, it supports the full object-based programming, event driven model of programming.
Alice is designed to appeal to specific subpopulations not normally exposed to computer programming, such as students of middle school age, by encouraging storytelling, unlike most other programming languages which are designed for computation. Alice is also used at many colleges and universities in Introduction to Programming courses.
In controlled studies at Ithaca College and Saint Joseph's University looking at students with no prior programming experience taking their first computer science course, the average grade rose from C to B, and retention rose from 47% to 88%.

Alice is released under an open-source license allowing redistribution of the source code, with or without modification, for non-commercial uses only.

Look it up from Carnegie Mellon.

I mean that... or that lego kit/language.

Xordium · 30 Apr 2015 at 18:44

Most schools use Scratch.

D.P. · 30 Apr 2015 at 19:18

Scratch and Alice for the youngest.

When i was around 12 I started programming Qbasic, by the time I was 15 I had moved to C++, at 16 I was coding Quake 3 clones in OpenGL.

IF I was 12 now with I would probably start with Python and then make the switch to C++, perhaps a year earlier at 14.

AHarvey · 1 May 2015 at 00:30

http://boingboing.net/2012/12/18/python-for-kids-a-playful-int.html

NeilF · 1 May 2015 at 09:58

AHarvey said:
http://boingboing.net/2012/12/18/python-for-kids-a-playful-int.html

That looks interesting! Python looks a touch "deeper" than Small Basic, but I imagine it's faster & more powerful.

The editor in Small Basic is simple & very friendly so I think I'll start them in that, and then once they have the fundamentals, look to move up to something like Python.

With Python, I assume just get the most recent? And then is there an editor that's recommended? ie: Something that super friendly like your typical Microsoft ones?

Armageus · 1 May 2015 at 10:19

While not a language as such, particularly for the 8 year old, looking at the barclays one mentioned in their adverts is worth a mess around with - basic programming elements like variables and very visual feedback.

http://barclayscodeplayground.co.uk/