Protesters

When I was at university I took part in the NUS organised rent strike over unfair increases in halls of residence rent. We basically paid our rent money to the NUS rather than the university and as a result we got a fairer deal for ourselves. Was pretty intense for a while, got a letter from the uni telling me to pay up or get thrown off my course, fortunately the NUS forced another letter from the uni a few hours later rescinding that threat. Pretty tame by today's standards, but back then we were a much more passive bunch. Even now after significant "life experience" I'd do the same again. I applaud the current student protests (but not the violence), I think it's marvellous that these young people are prepared to stand up for themselves. Fist in the air in the land of hypocrisy etc...

You were standing up to pay FAIR amount for the place YOU were living.

Current protesters are standing up saying its unfair they have to pair fair costs themselves rather than the whole country paying for THEIR education, because the payment method was inadequate, vastly underfunded and not at all fair before hand.

Being unfair, inadequate and not sustainable beforehand doesn't make the current fee's unfair.


The same situaiton might be, you were living in a penthouse suite that for some reason the previous owner had given to you for £30 a month, despite market value meaning all costs included, the new owner loses money every month at that cost. When he raises the price to at cost, at £100 a month, you deem it unfair purely because the previous deal was better, this isn't true, the previous deal was "too" fair, the current deal fair, and £200 a month would be unfair. Thats where the students are right now. They want everyone else to pay for their education because everyone else always has, unfortunately Labour has pushed unprescedented numbers of students into university without increasing funds to cover it.

If you were already paying £100 a month, and the new owner was making a fair profit, and then asked you for £500 a month, that would be unfair, I'd protest, thats simply not the case here.

Worse deal does NOT automatically mean unfair, but thats the problem both with labour, and our country, if we have a vastly unfair system, changing it to be fair, if it costs more, is hell because people won't use common sense.

This is the inherant problem with morons like Blair/Brown promising more than they can ever deliver, they drive costs up, without ever paying or balancing the budget for them, eventually we go bust, or PAY for them, and when asked to, the people think its unfair.

Its no different to buying a £5000 car and getting 0% finance for a year, then thinking its really unfair they actually have to pay for it a year later.

THe big problem is, Labour think the government spending card is a 0% finance for 50 year credit card, and went utterly nuts without a single thought to ever having to pay it back, the country is now in major debt and being asked to rework its budget to allow a repayment plan essentially.


I get the general impression of protesters that its a 70/25/5 mix where 70% just join any cause as they want to seem to be thinking the same things as anyone else, lemmings who take on others opinions without understanding them because they don't want to seem different. 25% who think they know what they are talking about and actually care for the subject matter but are ideologic young people, too stupid to realise how the real world works, think the government should spend 100billion a year on developing clean energy tech and building schools in Africa, with no idea the country doesn't have that money to spend, 5% of just flat out stupid people who have no idea and never will have any idea how the country works, stick with their stupid ideological and completely impracticle beliefs all their life, and vote Labour.
 
Yeah remember that Chinese hippy in Tiananmen square, i bet he got himself run over by a tank just for the lulz.

Thing is, Tiananmen square was huge, and it wasn't organised, it was the heartfelt protest of a nation lacking freedom and personal rights, several hundred people were killed, it was a huge deal, and a protest with big implications.

Current protesting, students, know we have debt, know we can't afford everything for free for everyone, education is available, cutbacks are required, so the government asks those who get the education to pay for it, and those that aren't getting it to not pay extra for those that do. Its painfully selfish to protest over it.

Protesting for rights, freedoms, fair treatment, etc, thats all fine, and should be done, but knowing the government is in a financial whole(they didn't create) they have to fix, and complaining about not getting something expensive for free is childish and pathetic.

People who have protested over real injustices in the world and real problems will be cringing at those asking for a government handout when the government can't afford it.

Even worse is these students, if they got their own way, would end up paying the exact same amount, plus a heck of a lot more, in increased taxes everyone would have to pay to keep the current fee's as low as they are. Its short term and stupid thinking.
 
Current protesting, students, know we have debt, know we can't afford everything for free for everyone, education is available, cutbacks are required, so the government asks those who get the education to pay for it, and those that aren't getting it to not pay extra for those that do. Its painfully selfish to protest over it.

I would agree with that if the Government didn't throw our cash away on immigrant handouts/rent for stately home. etc etc.. I know which I'd want my taxes to go on. Charity begins at home & with our next generation.


When I was younger in the eighties I joined CND & used to join protests on the streets, do blockades on missile sites etc. However I was oblivious to the fact of what CND was. I joined because I didn't like Nuclear Missiles pointed at me. (such was the fear at the time). I did'nt realise why everyone else joined CND. A good number were Vegans, Hippies, & into anything else that means rebelling as opposed to having a certain belief. IE, tree huggers. the typical stereotype.

I left shortly after having to listen to a coach load once all singing "we are the happy gentle people". Still, it was something I'm glad I did as it's something to look back on.

The trouble is protesters are getting knocked on here yet it's what we all should be doing en-mass instead of siting at home venting our anger on immigration etc via our pc's. We should take note of the French & as for the current student demo's, whatever the moral sides, may they long continue & fight on. Personally I'm proud of our youth here. (those genuine of course).
 
OT slightly but

throw our cash away on immigrant handouts/rent for stately hom

Orly? Care to throw me a link where immigrants are being given grants to live in stately homes.

it's what we all should be doing en-mass instead of siting at home venting our anger on immigration

I'm not venting any anger at immigration.


On another note, it's slightly amusing that Amigafan2003 and CD32 are having this conversation!
 
I suppose my view is in that in general half of them are a passionate bunch that feel their voice will be heard and listened to, my cynical side says maybe they won't be.

The other side of them are the activists that are just out to attempt to place the country into anarchy, cause embarrassment to whichever rabble are in power at the time and cause as much disruption to everyday life as possible.

Not many people understand Anarchy - it's actually, ideologically, a very good thing. Too many use the word just to mean 'chaos'.
 
I went on an anti-vivisection march once, simply because a girl I quite liked was going on it too.

David Icke spoke at the main assembly, it was the time when he was going from sports presenter to utter fruitloop, so was quite interesting.

I didn't get anything out of it though.
 
OT slightly but



Orly? Care to throw me a link where immigrants are being given grants to live in stately homes.



I'm not venting any anger at immigration.


On another note, it's slightly amusing that Amigafan2003 and CD32 are having this conversation!

No-one said you was venting anger at immigration. & I also put it as an example.

You can read newspapers can't you? Find your own links.
 
You can read newspapers can't you? Find your own links.

I haven't read any newspaper articles on immigrants getting grants/allowances to live in stately homes. Neither can I find any internet links, which is why I asked if you could provide them.

I severely doubt you have any evidence to back up your statement though, which is why you came back with your weak retort.

I have however found many links of immigrants owning stately homes - Russian millionaires seem to be the biggest grouping - but I don't think that's what you were referring to.
 
Been on loads of demonstrations over the years:
-Support for the miners
-Ditto for CND
(when i was a naive unwashed young student)

-Poll tax riots in London 1989 (went along to observe rather than participate)
-Anti motorway (ditto)
-Several anti war demos in 2003 including the big London one (ditto)
-Several anti NF and BNP (ditto)

On all I have seen a great cross section of society, so OP is maybe a little off target with the stereotype but to protest/demonstrate is to collectively voice dissent surely not a bad thing in a democracy even if the articulation (particularly the young) can sometimes be emotive, not clearly thought out and argued...:)
 
I haven't read any newspaper articles on immigrants getting grants/allowances to live in stately homes. Neither can I find any internet links, which is why I asked if you could provide them.

I severely doubt you have any evidence to back up your statement though, which is why you came back with your weak retort.

I have however found many links of immigrants owning stately homes - Russian millionaires seem to be the biggest grouping - but I don't think that's what you were referring to.

Point of the matter is Amigafan, most of the UK know what I'm on about when I say immigrants being put up in stately homes. (No you're not supposed to take it literal so you can nitpick). Now unless you live under a rock you shouldn't need a link. & I'm sure you're not that stupid.

& quit with the weak retort crap. (what??? I owe you an explanation because you have issues? DO ONE!) I won't be drawn into a petty argument because you seem to have issues with my passing input on the thread. Now theres the door, find someone else to drag things out with & try & score points. (god I hopes he's not an ati fanboy, I'm doomed)
 
Unfair, I am a middle class reasonably well off (my parents pay my food), reasonably articulate student, but am down to earth. I am not ashamed of my slightly sheltered upbringing, and feel no reason to protest against anything.

I'm one of the few people who voted Conservative that I know from uni, and got sometimes almost aggressive comments from it, but I don't really care. I'm not sure whether me doing economics has anything to do with it though.
 
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