Quick Ebay Q

[spoffle]

Spot on, I'd forgotten that they are on the exceptions list when booking a courier. For example, from Parcel2Go it states:

guitars - maximum parcel compensation value for damages is £100.00, + up to £1,000.00 compensation for lost items. Guitars must be sent in a hard case.

So it had to be sent in a hard case to be covered, which the courier would have known from the second he picked it up, as they ask what the contents are when collecting.





Get back under your bridge troll.

Ah the good old "I'm told I'm wrong on something, must be trolling."

What you said doesn't apply at all. The seller was tasked with packaging the guitar well enough to and didn't perform.

That's all there is to it. It's got nothing to do with the costs of packing material, that should be accounted for in the price the seller asks considering they did invite buyers to arrange their own courier.

The seller is completely responsible for making sure it's protected well enough simply on the basis that the buyer can't be reasonably expected to oversee the quality of the packaging without being there in person.

So it's very simple, it's the seller's responsibility regardless of whether the buyer arranged collection or not. Had the seller arranged the collection they would have still packed it the way they did.

 

[Nexus]

I think thats the problem.

The OP as the buyer booked the Courier, by doing so he read (was supposed to) and agreed to the terms and conditions that a Guitar must be sent in a hardcase. Thus the onus should be that you accepted that you were taking a risk by not doing that. Otherwise you should have sent a hard case via the courier to pickup the guitar and bring it back to you.

So its hard to see who eBay would side with... which is why I think it best to try and work something out between both parties first... which ultimately is the first thing eBay make you do when you open any dispute anyway.

 

[Nexus]

Ah the good old "I'm told I'm wrong on something, must be trolling."

What you said doesn't apply at all. The seller was tasked with packaging the guitar well enough to and didn't perform.

That's all there is to it. It's got nothing to do with the costs of packing material, that should be accounted for in the price the seller asks considering they did invite buyers to arrange their own courier.

The seller is completely responsible for making sure it's protected well enough simply on the basis that the buyer can't be reasonably expected to oversee the quality of the packaging without being there in person.

So it's very simple, it's the seller's responsibility regardless of whether the buyer arranged collection or not. Had the seller arranged the collection they would have still packed it the way they did.

I incited you were a troll because you posted a snidey comment while offering nothing to the thread other than that and then followed up with another comment in the same manner. That is exactly what trolling is.

You have now actually offered an opinion which is what you should have just done in the first place.

As has been stated though, its not as clear cut as that.
The Buyer booked the courier which has the terms and conditions that a guitar must be carried in a hard case for protection.

 

[spoffle]

I incited you were a troll because you posted a snidey comment while offering nothing to the thread other than that and then followed up with another comment in the same manner. That is exactly what trolling is.

You have now actually offered an opinion which is what you should have just done in the first place.

NOPE.

As has been stated though, its not as clear cut as that.
The Buyer booked the courier which has the terms and conditions that a guitar must be carried in a hard case for protection.

It is that clear cut. The courier's terms and conditions are for insurance purposes, not simply carrying the parcel, you make it sound like they're saying it's against their terms to carry a guitar that isn't in a hardcase.

The real issue here is that the seller didn't perform. The buyer asked for "bombproof", the seller didn't perform. It's got nothing to do with the costs of packing materials or anything else you've said.

They used insufficient packing materials, small cell bubble wrap, a thin sheet of it at that, in a flimsy cardboard box. That's completely the seller's issue and no one elses.

Had the seller used large cell bubble wrap, liberally, in a box of sufficient thickness and rigidity, it would have arrived in tact.

It is the seller's responsibility to ensure it's packed sufficiently, it wasn't, not even close.

It's really that simple.

 

[Glaucus]

And the buyer did not get insurance for postage. Which is also a massive no no and can be his downfall.

However buyers win the majority of cases.

 

[spoffle]

The insurance part is irrelevant anyway, because basically the courier says they won't cover damage unless they absolutely demolish it by dropping a van on it.

Realistically, if they stipulate that it must be in a hard case, there's little to no chance it'd going to get damaged unless they mess up big time so there may as well be no insurance at all.

 

[mjd]

Sorry I hadnt realised there had been so much extra activity.

With regards to those people suggesting the buyer didnt want to ship it.
This is inaccurate. The seller stipulated in the listing that it was local collection or the buyer can organise their own courier to collect. I didnt have to twist his arm, it was offered.
As mentioned I queried the packaging before hitting buy it now, and have an email to that effect from the seller where he confirms that he can provide suitable packaging.

With regards to responsibility (in the eyes of ebay at least), as far as I am aware the responibility lies with the seller to ensure safe passage of an item to its destination, regardless of who books the courier.

Beyond asking for suitable packaging and booking the courier I dont know what else I could have done. (Though in future I will want a photo of the packaged item before dispatch).

In this case the courier was plain negligent.The guitar was out for delivery the day before it arrived, but apparently they ran out of time that day. As such the guitar was collected on the 18th and didnt arrive until the 20th. So it spent the best part of two days in the back of small lorry and looked as such when it arrived.

Finally, with regards to feeling like a git, the seller was polite, quick to respond and generally a pleasure to deal with throughout the transaction and the whole thing has only been soured by the fact that he severely underestimated what was required when sending a guitar via courier.

I am waiting for a reponse from TNT just so I can show I have tried, but knowing this will fall on its bum, I have no doubt I will have to file a claim with ebay.

 

[mjd]

And the buyer did not get insurance for postage. Which is also a massive no no and can be his downfall.

However buyers win the majority of cases.

I paid the extra surcharge to raise the insurance from the default of £50 with TNT to £100.

TNT dont mention guitars being prohibited or uninsured, though parcel2go do, so I'm not sure which takes precedence.

 

[Nexus]

It is that clear cut. The courier's terms and conditions are for insurance purposes, not simply carrying the parcel, you make it sound like they're saying it's against their terms to carry a guitar that isn't in a hardcase.

I never said that, as its quite clear from the terms and conditions that they will carry it regardless. My point was that when a Courier picks up, they will ask what the goods are for their paperwork. When informed that it was a guitar and clearly not protected by a hard case, it would go on record, thus when the OP tries to make a claim, it may well be unlikely because it doesn't meet the terms of their carriage.

The real issue here is that the seller didn't perform. The buyer asked for "bombproof", the seller didn't perform. It's got nothing to do with the costs of packing materials or anything else you've said.

They used insufficient packing materials, small cell bubble wrap, a thin sheet of it at that, in a flimsy cardboard box. That's completely the seller's issue and no one elses.

Had the seller used large cell bubble wrap, liberally, in a box of sufficient thickness and rigidity, it would have arrived in tact.

It is the seller's responsibility to ensure it's packed sufficiently, it wasn't, not even close.

It's really that simple.

I've already said in a previous post that the Seller was an idiot for not packaging it properly and the whole thing could have been avoided. However, as the Buyer was responsible for carriage, it will be interesting to see what happens with eBay, as its not the same as a typical auction where the Seller arranges delivery, thus the blame is instantly pointed at them, or the courier.

I paid the extra surcharge to raise the insurance from the default of £50 with TNT to £100.

TNT dont mention guitars being prohibited or uninsured, though parcel2go do, so I'm not sure which takes precedence.

If you booked through Parcel2Go then I would think their terms stand, as I would think that your contract is with them, rather than TNT directly. Be interesting to hear what happens regardless.