Quick Value RAM question

Naan_H · 31 Jul 2006 at 13:59

hi all, just a quick q.....

im looking to overclock an AMD 4000+ san diego in an asrock 939dual sata2 motherboard, which ram is better for the job?

Geil Value 2gb (2 x 1gb kit) or Corsair Value select 2g (2x1gb kit).

thanks in advance for any advice.

Naan_H · 31 Jul 2006 at 21:16

Nobody? Come on guys!

What about 2Gb (2X1Gb) Corsair TwinX DDR PC3200 RAM as well, i take its better than corsair value select but is it better than the geil?

LordShadow · 31 Jul 2006 at 21:49

Ive always heard great stuff about the Geil value and the only pair I had even ran 10% above their stock speed so I would vote for them.

Naan_H · 31 Jul 2006 at 21:51

im running 2 x 512 Geil at the mo but just wanted to see if Corsair would be the better choice at the same price....however as the geil i have now is working ok ill get some more Geil to be on the safe side...

theforce · 31 Jul 2006 at 22:04

Have 2x512MG Geil Value aswell. The clock quite well for the price, i would recommend em.

Cyber-Mav · 31 Jul 2006 at 23:26

iv heard that the corsair 2gig value kit is one of the miracle 2gig kits that can run 1t command rate on the asrock board. but don;t quote me on that.

Naan_H · 31 Jul 2006 at 23:34

Balls....i ordered the Geil 2gb kit; i have the 1gb kit running at 1t in my asrock so i thought i might aswell get the Geil.....i guess its not a big deal either way....

nheather · 2 Aug 2006 at 09:39

Either will do - in fact I don't think you will be able to stretch either of the RAMs because of the way the dividers work.

I hear that a good SD 4000+ overclock is 250x12 = 3GHz

The Value Ram won't run at 250 so you need a divider.

If you use 166, then your Ram will run at approximately 207MHz
If use 183 then the RAM will attempt to run at 228MHz

My Geil Value runs stable at 225MHz with timings of 2.5-3-3-7 (1T) with a 0.1V voltage increase. It may go to 230 with more volts but I expect that is about the limit.

So for real stability you will probably use the 166 divider which will give you around 207 which either Ram will handle.

Note that because the CPU does the Memory handling the actual frequency divider is dependent on the CPU multi used.

For example 166 on a x11 multi is actually 11:14 rather than 166:200 which gives a slightly lower Ram speed than you would expect.

Cheers,

Nigel

p.s. very few MoBos have a 180/183 divider so you are likely to be restricted to 166 anyway.

Naan_H · 2 Aug 2006 at 10:16

nheather said:
Either will do - in fact I don't think you will be able to stretch either of the RAMs because of the way the dividers work.

I hear that a good SD 4000+ overclock is 250x12 = 3GHz

The Value Ram won't run at 250 so you need a divider.

If you use 166, then your Ram will run at approximately 207MHz
If use 183 then the RAM will attempt to run at 228MHz

My Geil Value runs stable at 225MHz with timings of 2.5-3-3-7 (1T) with a 0.1V voltage increase. It may go to 230 with more volts but I expect that is about the limit.

So for real stability you will probably use the 166 divider which will give you around 207 which either Ram will handle.

Note that because the CPU does the Memory handling the actual frequency divider is dependent on the CPU multi used.

For example 166 on a x11 multi is actually 11:14 rather than 166:200 which gives a slightly lower Ram speed than you would expect.

Cheers,

Nigel

p.s. very few MoBos have a 180/183 divider so you are likely to be restricted to 166 anyway.

Nigel, you are an absolute star, thanks for the advice its much appreciated. the stuff should be arriving this morning hopefully, will post back how i get along too.

Unfortunately the ASrock mobo doesnt allow much tweaking for RAM voltages etc, but hopefully if i can get the RAM close to 200MHz speeds ill be happy.

nheather · 2 Aug 2006 at 11:46

Bit of further info - just looked up how the 166 mem divider works for the SD 4000+ running at x12.

It is 12:15 (0.8), opposed to 166:200 (0.83)

This means that with HT=250, the memory will run at 250 x 0.8 = 200

So no overclock on the memory - so concentrate on tightening the timings - i.e. run a 2.5-3-3-7 rather than 3-4-4-8.

Cheers,

Nigel

Naan_H · 2 Aug 2006 at 11:49

nheather said:
Bit of further info - just looked up how the 166 mem divider works for the SD 4000+ running at x12.

It is 12:15 (0.8), opposed to 166:200 (0.83)

This means that with HT=250, the memory will run at 250 x 0.8 = 200

So no overclock on the memory - so concentrate on tightening the timings - i.e. run a 2.5-3-3-7 rather than 3-4-4-8.

Cheers,

Nigel

Thanks again Nigel, the chip just arrived, it should do 3ghz pretty easily going on other peoples tests with this stepping.....gonna take my opteron 144 and 1gb geil RAM out to be replaced by the 4000+ and 2GB RAM

nheather · 2 Aug 2006 at 12:32

Thanks again Nigel, the chip just arrived, it should do 3ghz pretty easily going on other peoples tests with this stepping

Yep, very envious. I bought an SD 3700+ just 4 weeks ago when it was on a 'This Week Only Offer' and its dropped in price ever since. In fact feel a little picked on because of the 4 items I bought, 3 of them have been significantly reduced in price. Computer parts are always going to drop in price - but after just 4 weeks!!! C'est la vie.

With hindsight I would have waited a few weeks for the 4000 - no wait a mo, with hindsight I would have won the lottery and bought a Conroe

Cheers,

Nigel

Naan_H · 2 Aug 2006 at 13:04

Well if i could afford a conroe i would get one!!

Anyway, the bits are in, im just gonna run memtest and the like to see if this works at 1T, ill overclock it later, and i need to keep an eye on those temps! The freezer 64pro is a pain in the ass to put on!

nheather · 2 Aug 2006 at 15:40

The freezer 64pro is a pain in the ass to put on!

I didn't find it that difficult, but I was concerned that it doesn't sit square on the CPU.

For one it's base is smaller than the CPU - which I had never seen in a heatsink before.

Secondly, the base of the heatsink didn't sit exactly in the middle so that the amount of CPU visible differs from left to right and also from back to front.

But I am advised this is perfectly normal and because the acutal CPU die is much smaller than the CPU top the heatsink does cover the die entirely.

I certainly haven't experienced any problems but it did worry me initially.

Cheers,

Nigel

Naan_H · 2 Aug 2006 at 18:14

well ive clocked the chip to 3ghz, and still on stock volts of 1.35v, simpl stunning!!

However, cpu-z shows the mem at 166Mhz; in the bios i set it to 200Mhz DDR400, and NB-SN link speed to 800....why is the RAM at 166Mhz and not 200MHz?

nheather · 3 Aug 2006 at 08:08

I can't remember the exact location, but on the memory tab, CPU-Z shows how the memory is calculated.

It says something like CPU/n where n is an integer number. I'm expecting it to say 15. If your CPU is running at 3.0GHz and you are getting a RAM speed of 166 then the corresponding value for n is 18. What value for n are you getting in CPU-Z?

I assume the CPU is set to 12 x 250

Here are some possibilities

(i) If n=15 then your CPU is not running at 3.0GHz (more like 2.5GHz)
(ii) If n=18 then the memory divider is set to 133, not 166
(iii) CPU-Z is confused - make sure you have the latest version - my copy of CPU-Z is spot on all the time.

Cheers,

Nigel

Naan_H · 3 Aug 2006 at 08:25

nheather said:
I can't remember the exact location, but on the memory tab, CPU-Z shows how the memory is calculated.

It says something like CPU/n where n is an integer number. I'm expecting it to say 15. If your CPU is running at 3.0GHz and you are getting a RAM speed of 166 then the corresponding value for n is 18. What value for n are you getting in CPU-Z?

I assume the CPU is set to 12 x 250

Here are some possibilities

(i) If n=15 then your CPU is not running at 3.0GHz (more like 2.5GHz)
(ii) If n=18 then the memory divider is set to 133, not 166
(iii) CPU-Z is confused - make sure you have the latest version - my copy of CPU-Z is spot on all the time.

Cheers,

Nigel

Morning Nigel,

CPU is set to 12 x 250 but the divider remains on n=18 for some reason, whatever i do it doesnt change. It was set to n=18 with my opteron i think, and just seems to be stuck on it...do u think i need to reflash the bios?

I understand the divider has to be on 166 but it just wont change to it.

I also have latest cpu-z....ill keep trying i guess but maybe a flash of the bios will be the only way.

nheather · 3 Aug 2006 at 09:01

CPU is set to 12 x 250 but the divider remains on n=18 for some reason

Thats weird.

If you run your CPU at stock (12 x 200) and set your memory to 200 (1:1) does the divider still stick at 18? (it should go to 12).

If it is sticking then there is either something you are missing or the BIOS is confused.

Before flashing the BIOS, try setting the CPU, Memory, Hyper Transport settings to automatic and see what happens

I would expect the following

HT = 200
CPU Multi = 12
Memory Divider = 200 (12:12)
Hyper Transport Multi = x5 (1000MHz)

If it does this then try making manual changes.

If it doesn't then , yes trying flashing to latest BIOS.

Cheers,

Nigel

Naan_H · 3 Aug 2006 at 09:15

Its still sticking on 18 no matter what i do, reflash me thinks

Naan_H · 3 Aug 2006 at 09:40

ok i reflsahed and the same happened; i put the RAM speed to Auto and it seems to have sorted it out. i guess if i leave it on auto and tweak the rest it should all be fine...

thanks Nigel youre a star!