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Radeon VII

Raelgun said:
I personally think the new consoles can do high res at high FPS, console optimisation on the new projected hardware is gonna be something.
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If by console optimisation, you mean turning down the settings from ultra to medium/low, yes.

But I don't think we're getting true 4k and 60fps in the most demanding of titles in all honesty. Especially "next gen" games. Games graphics will continue to improve and get more complex so I still think they'll hover around the 30fps mark.

If I compare Witcher 3 4k on PC to my Ps4 pro... its still worlds apart.
 
Safetytrousers said:
NVIDIA are a business. Most businesses want to make money. And most want to make as much money as they can.
A business will price according to what they think the market will withstand. You may think of it as greed, but it seems like normal business practice to me.
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When those business practices mean shafting and repeatedly lying to the consumers, then it is greed pure and simple.
 
ICDP said:
When those business practices mean shafting and repeatedly lying to the consumers, then it is greed pure and simple.
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I was talking about pricing, and the aspect of their cards that is their pricing. I took 'greed' to mean desire for money.
There's nothing about the performance of my 2080ti that is counter to what I took from what I read or heard from NVIDIA. If you pay them for one of their GPUs, you get a GPU of exactly the specifications they have stated.
 
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aoaaron said:
If by console optimisation, you mean turning down the settings from ultra to medium/low, yes.

But I don't think we're getting true 4k and 60fps in the most demanding of titles in all honesty. Especially "next gen" games. Games graphics will continue to improve and get more complex so I still think they'll hover around the 30fps mark.

If I compare Witcher 3 4k on PC to my Ps4 pro... its still worlds apart.
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Not really, setting for setting, consoles win out for performance.

Devs extract more performance out of the given hardware on consoles then on PC.

If you actually look at how the games actually look and perform on consoles and realise whats currently under the hood, you will be surprised, you couldn't do that with the equivalent hardware for the price, its just not possible at normal retail price.

If you recall what I said in my post, in order to get high performance at high resolution on PC, you need to spend a lot of money to do so, if the new consoles provide all of this at console pricing, then whats the point of PC gaming for most people, PC gaming advantage is being eroded.
 
Raelgun said:
Devs extract more performance out of the given hardware on consoles then on PC.
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Because it's a fixed spec they have to work with so theytknow exactly how much they have in terms of grunt to put to use. If a console had the spec of a bleeding edge gaming pc it would probably eclipse anything most PC's could do.
 
Gerard said:
Because it's a fixed spec they have to work with so theytknow exactly how much they have in terms of grunt to put to use. If a console had the spec of a bleeding edge gaming pc it would probably eclipse anything most PC's could do.
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Which is the point I am getting at, the ps5 is projected to use what is considered very decent specs, the optimisations in theory will put it on par with a bleeding edge PC for the performance and fidelity if not surpass it.
 
Raelgun said:
Which is the point I am getting at, the ps5 is projected to use what is considered very decent specs, the optimisations in theory will put it on par with a bleeding edge PC for the performance and fidelity if not surpass it.
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Certainly possible. But I bet you on non twitch games they will still target 30fps and stick the rest into eye candy ;)
 
ICDP said:
When those business practices mean shafting and repeatedly lying to the consumers, then it is greed pure and simple.
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No, a business is legally required to maximize profits for the share holders. The CEO can spend a lengthy time in jail if they do anything purposely against that.
 
Participant said:
Well that's not true.

But I don't agree with ICDP's comments about greed, either. It's not greed to generate maximum value from a market, it's standard business practice.
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The exceptions are things like environmental and worker protection or reducing short term profits for longer term profits, investment etc. CEOs are legally required to support the sharehodlers interests while operating the company within the law.

Maximizing profit from a market is not only standard business practice, the CEO can face serious legal issues if they purposely try and avoid doing that without consent form the shareholders and BoD.
 
Raelgun said:
Not really, setting for setting, consoles win out for performance.

Devs extract more performance out of the given hardware on consoles then on PC.

If you actually look at how the games actually look and perform on consoles and realise whats currently under the hood, you will be surprised, you couldn't do that with the equivalent hardware for the price, its just not possible at normal retail price.

If you recall what I said in my post, in order to get high performance at high resolution on PC, you need to spend a lot of money to do so, if the new consoles provide all of this at console pricing, then whats the point of PC gaming for most people, PC gaming advantage is being eroded.
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Generally (not always these days but still, generally) pc games games are cheaper, you don't have to pay to play online and there is a far wider range of 3rd party peripherals often at better prices on pc.
I agree console punch above their weight and current mid range GPU prices will certainly win some over to console but even so over a 5 year period I doubt the gap is as big as it 1st looks.
Also I dunno about you guys but IME full blown pc upgrades are not needed that often if you buy sensibly. Eg my 4.3 GHz 5820k is still no where near being a bottleneck (3.5 years old already) and I fully expect to last this console generation and well into the next.
 
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Gerard said:
Because it's a fixed spec they have to work with so theytknow exactly how much they have in terms of grunt to put to use. If a console had the spec of a bleeding edge gaming pc it would probably eclipse anything most PC's could do.
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In the old days maybe, but consoles are on the same architecture as PC now so there shouldn't be much difference tbh. A PC has a bit more crap running on it, but also have far more CPU and memory overhead.
 
Nasher said:
In the old days maybe, but consoles are on the same architecture as PC now so there shouldn't be much difference tbh. A PC has a bit more crap running on it, but also have far more CPU and memory overhead.
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It's more than you think, hence why devs can squeeze so much out of them. Everything runs far closer to the metal than it does on a PC.
 
Safetytrousers said:
I was talking about pricing, and the aspect of their cards that is their pricing. I took 'greed' to mean desire for money.
There's nothing about the performance of my 2080ti that is counter to what I took from what I read or heard from NVIDIA. If you pay them for one of their GPUs, you get a GPU of exactly the specifications they have stated.
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With your logic, if NVidia has followed that policy the last 10 years, you should be paying £26,000 for their top GPU not £1100.
I can do the maths if you cannot on follow up post.
 
So it slots in between an RTX2070 and RTX2080 at $699? - not impressed.

UK price will probably be upwards of £700 so not sure why anyone would buy it. Surely people will just get the RTX2080 instead at this price, I don't get it.
 
Panos said:
With your logic, if NVidia has followed that policy the last 10 years, you should be paying £26,000 for their top GPU not £1100.
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If £26,000 maximised their profits I would expect that to be the price.
But if made as a gaming GPU that price would not maximise profits.
My thoughts provoked by Buildzoid, NVIDIA have price the 2080ti as they have because they know how many Pascal Titans they sold to gamers. It's probably quite a lot. It's proof for them the market will pay that price for the top end gaming offering.
 
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Shocky-FM said:
So it slots in between an RTX2070 and RTX2080 at $699? - not impressed.

UK price will probably be upwards of £700 so not sure why anyone would buy it. Surely people will just get the RTX2080 instead at this price, I don't get it.
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How do we know this? As far as I can see there are no reviews or pre orders. I have been trying to find one on pre-order all morning but alas cannot find one.
 
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