S Korea - more deaths than births in 2020..environmental lifeline?

413x

413x

413x

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For the first time every for S Korea there were more deaths than births. This is not a covid thing.

It seems.
- house prices/cost of living
- work life stress/culture
- woman's rights

Have tipped S Korea into population decline

This trend is happening across the 'developed' world.
S Korea are paying people to have kids, but it's obviously not enough.

The case study says she wanted a famil , but due to the reasons above is priced out.


Obviously this has environmental benefits - massive ones
At the expense of economic stability.

Or is this happening at the right time , naturally, as automation begins to take jobs ?

The government are concerned but it is this actually an inevitable natural and needed trend ?

To me it seems natural for the system we have. Without a reset costs are spiralling. There's a ever increasing cost of end of life/retirement support.
More people have less assets (home ownership is declining)
This taxes will need to increase

Kids are expensive,

Anyone here not having kids due to cost who want them?

BBC News - Alarm as South Korea sees more deaths than births https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-55526450
 
World population is 7.8 billion, it's predicted to level out at about 9-11 billion, so maybe it's started.
 
Lysander said:
It was 2.5 billion in 1950, so the growth since then has been mental.
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It's unsustainable.

we can't give the world the standard of living the west have.

We certainly couldn't afford our cheap electronics if it wasbt paid for with basically slave labour
 
413x said:
It's unsustainable.

we can't give the world the standard of living the west have.

We certainly couldn't afford our cheap electronics if it wasbt paid for with basically slave labour
Click to expand...

It's totally unsustainable. Any population levels out after a while for a number of reasons, mostly because of basic things like lack of space and lack of resources. The levelling out was predicted to start in the 22nd century, so only a very small percentage of people alive at this moment will see it, unless the situation in SK heralds an early start.
 
413x said:
Anyone here not having kids due to cost who want them?
Click to expand...

We certainly waited a lot longer than we wanted to have our second due to financial reasons, and even so it's going to require quite a bit of cutting back for the next couple of years.

In a way, Covid has actually helped however, as working from home has given a lot more flexibility in terms of childcare. We certainly won't be having a third, and as soon as the pressure is off healthcare and clinics are open again, I'll be getting the snip!

It does seem that the culture in many other countries is far more responsible - meanwhile over here it seems like it's almost a badge of honour in some circles to squeeze out yet another kid you aren't going to look after and the state is going to have to pay for :(
 
Haggisman said:
We certainly waited a lot longer than we wanted to have our second due to financial reasons, and even so it's going to require quite a bit of cutting back for the next couple of years.

In a way, Covid has actually helped however, as working from home has given a lot more flexibility in terms of childcare. We certainly won't be having a third, and as soon as the pressure is off healthcare and clinics are open again, I'll be getting the snip!

It does seem that the culture in many other countries is far more responsible - meanwhile over here it seems like it's almost a badge of honour in some circles to squeeze out yet another kid you aren't going to look after and the state is going to have to pay for :(
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I don't see any reason why you be allowed to have more than 2 kids imo, maybe the government should introduce some some of chemical sterilisation for those on long term benefits :eek::D.

Could send them to Mars, I want to know if their heads would swell up like in total recall:p.
 
theone8181 said:
I don't see any reason why you be allowed to have more than 2 kids imo, maybe the government should introduce some some of chemical sterilisation for those on long term benefits :eek::D.
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Whilst I sort of agree, at the same time, there's not really much can be done about it without some trampling on some major human rights!
 
With the big families in deprived areas you get the population increase within that demographic.

I expect the median salary group are tightest where reduced birth rate is occurring most? Complete guess.

I feel Fortunate that I don't want kids. The impact on my finances would change my level of comfort considerably. Must be very hard of you want kids but struggle to justify the cost
 
It is a good thing - Hopefully China and India will follow suit soon....

I don't see declining population as an issue economically - Unless you have a zero unemployment rate then there is slack in the population which doesn't have a net positive economic contribution. Plus the existing wealth doesn't disappear - Money is passed on and if those it is being passed onto a fewer then this is an advantage to that generation - The only issue I would see economically in that situation is that if it were a sharp sudden decline, then inflation could sky rocket, but it is very unlikely that would be the situation - More likely to be gradual.

Birth rates need to come down to secure the future of the planet - End of.
 
I was always employed but low paid when my kids grew up, the government throw money at you in this situation, even paid them the ema (was it)) at sixth form,then burserys ect don't think I would be here (born and bred in Yorkshire) cash buyer, mortgage free if it wasn't for the help, not saying its a fair system
 
Haggisman said:
Whilst I sort of agree, at the same time, there's not really much can be done about it without adjusting some human rights!
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fixed that :)

They are not stone tablets gifted by the gods. It’s an agreement made by the bods incharge, they can easily agree on some adjustment.

the right to family life, capped at 3 children per child bearing couple.
 
Lysander said:
World population is 7.8 billion, it's predicted to level out at about 9-11 billion, so maybe it's started.
Click to expand...

9-11 billion is a fair margin of error...

Looking at age by country shows a lot of countries have relatively larger older cohorts, suggesting population decline in those over the next forty years or so.

And then there is Chad, where half the population is under 16.
 
413x said:
It's unsustainable.

we can't give the world the standard of living the west have.

We certainly couldn't afford our cheap electronics if it wasbt paid for with basically slave labour
Click to expand...
As demonstrated in the OP with S korea, if you make a country rich the birthrate falls off a cliff.
 
It's a bit of an unknown in terms of how the economy will work, because no an increasing population makes it easy to pay for stuff. Hence why their government is crapping itself.

413x said:
Anyone here not having kids due to cost who want them?
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I don't want kids, but I've always said that if I changed my mind then I'd have to be significantly more wealthy than I am at the moment before I'd want to actually start a family.

413x said:
Must be very hard of you want kids but struggle to justify the cost
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I want a nice house with a big garage full of cars, but that's life...
 
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