Save the NHS!

joxang · 14 Jun 2012 at 12:34

Milkybk, your entire point of view stems from the fact that you are well off and when in the US, was in a stable job with health insurance.

You're not a majority.

And yes, of course you're entitled to your opinion, but all I'm saying is if the people running our health system were as selfish as you appear to be, then a huge proportion of the population would be suffering and dying in droves from lack of healthcare.

"I have private insurance, I'll take the **** the rest attitude"?

That's pretty damn douchy, even for some random on the internetz :mad:

.

RDM · 14 Jun 2012 at 12:38

Milkybk said:
As with any system there are pros and cons.

Work benefits differ just as much in this country as they do in the USA.

For some reason I really wouldn't want my employer to be able to hold the health of my child over me as some sort of bargaining tool.

RDM · 14 Jun 2012 at 12:42

Milkybk said:
Indeed I must agree. Luckily I don't want children (although that point is moot in this discussion).

As with anything in life, especially big changes like moving job, you need to weigh up the best options for everyone involved and take into account things you can not predict.

Indeed, but are you really sure you want to move to a situation that puts the balance of power much more firmly in the hands of the employer rather than the employee?

C.R.A.Z.Y · 14 Jun 2012 at 12:46

mikeh501 said:
I reckon the Americans I work with have far better healthcare than I do in the uk.

Yeah provided you have loads of money :rolleyes:

And even then that's not always the case otherwise why would one of the richest people in America need to bring his child over to the U.K so that they can be treated in the NHS funded Great Ormond Street Hospital ? (Kudos to him for donating £1million!! Top Fella )

Not surprised that the NHS is getting so much hate here considering this forum is full of right-wing selfish, greedy and un-empathetic people!
Shame on you! Not everyone is as fortunate as we are and part of being an evolved and civilized primate is the fact we can care and help one another, we are all brothers and sisters!!

RDM · 14 Jun 2012 at 12:50

C.R.A.Z.Y said:
Not surprised that the NHS is getting so much hate here considering this forum is full of right-wing selfish, greedy and un-empathetic people!

It isn't really getting all that much hate...

Hatter The Mad · 14 Jun 2012 at 12:55

C.R.A.Z.Y said:
Yeah provided you have loads of money

You mean a job?

Hatter The Mad · 14 Jun 2012 at 12:56

So is the NHS still around, or has it been destroyed by whatever I was supposed to 'save it' from?

danielanthony · 14 Jun 2012 at 12:58

C.R.A.Z.Y said:
Not surprised that the NHS is getting so much hate here considering this forum is full of right-wing selfish, greedy and un-empathetic people!

Or people with jobs who don't like paying 42%+ tax on their income and don't seem to get a lot back for it.

Craterloads · 14 Jun 2012 at 13:01

Like i said earlier

Yes there are improvements to be made and savings to be made, but in essence what the NHS stands for is perfect.

Free health care for all is a beautiful thing.

piggeh · 14 Jun 2012 at 13:05

Craterloads said:
Free health care for all is a beautiful thing.

I don't get how the current reforms change that.

Hatter The Mad · 14 Jun 2012 at 13:07

piggeh said:
I don't get how the current reforms change that.

Because most people are stupid, irrational, over-emotional and reactionary?

Irish_Tom · 14 Jun 2012 at 13:12

Milkybk said:
Good way of putting it and I suppose I haven't looked at it that way. As is the same with the UK though the harder you work and the more ambitious you are the better chance you have of putting yourself in good sted for events such as moving job etc. If you have worked hard, then just as in the UK, employers will be looking to employ you therefore offering incentives that pull you away. I prefer a system that rewards those who work harder.

So healthcare should be a 'reward'?

Milkybk said:
I'd have to agree with RDM here, I'm not hating on it at all. Simply saying I would prefer private health care if given an option.

You do have the option — go out and pay for private health care in this country.

Just don't begrudge the people who can't afford to have that option.

Irish_Tom · 14 Jun 2012 at 13:30

Milkybk said:
No not at all. However if I've worked hard to achieve more than others then I should be able to reep the rewards.

I would if I didn't have to pay tax for an imperfect obligation i.e. the NHS.

I don't understand.

You can 'reap the rewards' of working hard by paying for private health care in this country now.

You're cutting off your nose to spite your face if you refuse to pay for private health care (which you can afford) simply because you also have to pay tax which in part funds a National Health Service.

It's like refusing to use the M6 Toll because you're paying taxes which go towards maintaining the M6... if you want the benefit of the private road, pay the extra.

Hatter The Mad · 14 Jun 2012 at 13:45

Milkybk said:
Why should I pay for something twice? What a stupid concept.

I do refuse to use the M6 toll.

It isn't just twice, because private health care is paid out of net income (even when you get it as a 'company' perk, you get taxed on the BIK).

Irish_Tom · 14 Jun 2012 at 14:06

Milkybk said:
Why should I pay for something twice? What a stupid concept.

I do refuse to use the M6 toll.

Because the 'first' time you're not actually paying for it directly for yourself – you're paying a small amount so that everyone can enjoy the benefits of state services (not just the NHS).

It's bigger than just you.

However, if you want a level of service above-and-beyond what the state provides you're more than capable of accessing it.

You still haven't addressed the point that RDM raised which was if you're paying for health insurance but not using the services you're still paying for *nothing*.

The only difference is you're making a small number of individuals rich, rather than helping the rest of society.