Scary moment on a flight today

[dannyjo22]

I'm not sure about the A318 being the smallest ETOPS rated aircraft, there's plenty of bizjets and whatnot which are ETOPS rated as far as I know

I reckon it will work. There are plenty of business travellers wanting to go to New York without the hassle of Heathrow. Imagine being able to check in 15-20 minutes before departure for a hop over to New York!

Yeah thats what they wanted to do with the Global Express. 14 passengers no waiting around for some chav spending his money at the bar or JJB sports.

Two major players came and looked over some ideas at my old place with a view to buying over 100 aircraft between them. One month later the towers came down. Ironically business travel on smaller private jets didnt suffer at all. Lots of people preferred it and thought it safer but the bigger comanies looking to do that lost too much money on economy to be able to fund it.

I know the Global complies with JAR OPS Etops but very few I worked on in the inital days had it or maintained the rating.

 

[Lopéz]

We use BAe 146 from CWL - LGG amongst other routes and the bloody thing is always going tech.

 

[Doran]

So what happens if there is a pressurisation problem at 40k over the Atlantic, surely you can't just fly down below 10k and not burn too much fuel?

 

[Hitman_Leon]

It extends those out to create extra drag.

I thought it was just cross dressers in big skirts who did twirls to create extra drag.

 

[iKettles]

Nah, it's a 4 engined (regarded by some as 5 APU'd ) jet.

Here's a pic -

AKA the BAE 146 right?

 

[Hitman_Leon]

So what happens if there is a pressurisation problem at 40k over the Atlantic, surely you can't just fly down below 10k and not burn too much fuel?

They do have plans for such things, extra fuel and there are runways here and there on islands where they could land if the fuel problem got a bit tight.

 

[andyp]

So what happens if there is a pressurisation problem at 40k over the Atlantic, surely you can't just fly down below 10k and not burn too much fuel?

I mentioned it in a post above.

ETOPS.

It's the rule by which a twin-engined aircraft is certified to cross large expanses of water, polar regions and expanses of non-populated areas with very little in the way of diversionary airports.

Each aircraft has to be tested to be able to reach a set diversion airfield within a certain amount of time, with one engine and maximum payload. Thus an aircraft will be ETOPS 90 certified if it can do this for an hour and half, or ETOPS 180 certified if it can safely reach a diversion 3 hours away. The CAA have to be confident of the plane's ability to reach a diversion with one engine inoperable and with no excessive undue increase in crew workload due to single-engined operation.

During transatlantic flights, diversion airfields are keyed in the flight management computer and it gives a constant read-out of distance and flight-time to the diversions if an engine were to fail at that moment.

Of course, ETOPS only applies to twin-engined planes. If you're in a 747 or an A340 and one engine goes bang, you've still got 3 more.

 

[andyp]

AKA the BAE 146 right?

BAe made those things out of a material with strength not known on earth.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5prz1Ae5QM

LCY claims another nearly.

 

[Doran]

So how many engines will most transatlantic flights have?

Also, what if all engines failed?

 

[^^Gord^^]

Also, what if all engines failed?

Errrr, are you serious?

 

[Doran]

Errrr, are you serious?

What do you mean?

How long does it glide for?

Also, I find this vid amusing:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5NhACThFI3Y&feature=related

 

[Buckster]

I fly on 146s every other week with work

one of my favourite aircrafts to fly on - they just feel like a commercial A10 !

I love the FLAP howl when the flaps go up and down - its an amazing sound

OP - sounds a bit scary that !

Mark.

 

[Doran]

Does anyone fancy doing this in a big plane?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJGVXpunZ_4

One of those was amazingly low...

 

[andyp]

So how many engines will most transatlantic flights have?

Also, what if all engines failed?

I wouldn't like to guess at the split between twins and quads on transatlantic flights.

Twins burn less fuel but carry less passengers, quads burn more fuel but can carry more people.

What if all engines failed? They don't

 

[Doran]

I've just got a inappropriate picture warning for that photo.... LOL

Is it secret or something?

 

[Lagmeister]

But, the one that sticks in mind was a landing at Milan Malpensa. I'd been delayed for 2 hours at Brum and when he had taken off the Captain comes on to say Milan is fogged in and we have left hoping it will be clear by the time we get there.

I had one in a simlar vein to that, it happened during that random giant fog that we had around a year ago when practically everything was grounded. Couldnt even see the runway until about a second before landing, it scared the bejesus out of me. Then we had the crossing runways bit of the taxiing which felt more than a bit hairy, sure it was perfectly safe though.

 

[Phil99]

I've just got a inappropriate picture warning for that photo.... LOL

Is it secret or something?

Well it is hotlinked, but I would have thought the mods would have removed it instead of just warning

 

[Blinkz]

What if all engines failed? They don't

Just to make you all scared, it has! With varied results! An A330 ran out of fuel over the Atlantic due to a fuel leak, it glided 220miles and landed in the Azores. A 747 had all 4 engines flame out after flying through volcanic ash, it descended to around 6000' or so before it got 2 of its engines running again and it diverted and landed safely. A 767 ran out of fuel again and glided to land at a disued airfield in Canada.

I could go on......Don't you love Air Crash Investigations on National Geographic

 

[andyp]

Just to make you all scared, it has! With varied results! An A330 ran out of fuel over the Atlantic due to a fuel leak, it glided 220miles and landed in the Azores. A 747 had all 4 engines flame out after flying through volcanic ash, it descended to around 6000' or so before it got 2 of its engines running again and it diverted and landed safely. A 767 ran out of fuel again and glided to land at a disued airfield in Canada.

I could go on......Don't you love Air Crash Investigations on National Geographic

2 fuel shortages and some volcanic ash

There's never been a mechanical or electrical malfunction resulting in a loss of all engines dying (ETOP twins, trijets or quads).

 

[Blinkz]

2 fuel shortages and some volcanic ash

There's never been a mechanical or electrical malfunction resulting in a loss of all engines dying (ETOP twins, trijets or quads).

I think you'll find there has been a number of 777s that have had issues with both engines not responding......