![[TW]Fox](/data/man-of-honor/2009.png){kind=avatar}
Legally speaking they must be - but I do hope somebody decides to take the law into their own hands..
Scrappage Continued
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Legally speaking they must be - but I do hope somebody decides to take the law into their own hands..
I believe in facts, figures and scientific rigour.
As has been pointed out, the scrappage scheme is sold, in part, as a CO2 reducing scheme, when by allowing these new cars to be scrapped (and note: this isn't Nora's fault, but she did know that this would happen if she did just a tiny bit of reading, so she does have some culpability), the scheme is being unbelievably wasteful.
Without getting into a cyclic global warming debate, CO2 is a greenhouse gas, and humans are now so dominant on the face of the planet that, globally, we can be likened to our planets own natural forces. Like volcanoes and general geological activity in the past, we actively uncover trapped Carbon from the Earth's crust, and convert it, in part, to CO2, which we then simply release into the atmosphere. So yes, no matter how you want to look at it, human beings have a very definite impact on the amount of CO2 in our atmosphere (note: globally, but certainly around our most populated parts of the planet). What we are releasing will take millions of years to make it, through the carbon cycle, to being re-permeated into the crust and upper-mantle as Carbon again.
As has been said, the scrappage scheme could have so easily been turned into a positive exercise all round, sure, allow people a limited but guaranteed version of the already present benefits of simple haggling (and that's all the scrappage scheme is doing, allowing your average person who would normally pay list price to get a previously thoroughly achievable reduction), recession or no, people CAN still afford a new car, it's just that they don't feel like they should be replacing that perfectly usable vehicle at the moment. A scheme like this, gives people the excuse they need, it's as simple as that.
It's not the consumer side that bugs me, it's the fact that the companies are then forced to scrap the car. as Fox's picture shows, a good proportion of those cars are vehicles that I reckon many of us would be very happy to own, I'd take that Merc quite happily! So why on Earth are they required to scrap it. Hell, work out a scheme with a 3rd world country or something where we sell them to them very cheaply (but still for some money) and they can then sell them on to their inhabitants for very reasonable amounts, most of those cars will be much much better than some of the rubbish trundling around in India or the many parts of Africa... (and yes I realise the potential impact of transporting all those vehicles, it was just a flippant suggestion).
The scheme itself, on the surface, ticks a few boxes, but the amount of hypocrisy and frankly sheer stupidity the scheme also contains really beggars belief. How do these people get to run the country? And we aren't just talking Labour, I refuse to believe the shadow government, tasked with producing the same scheme, would have done a better job...
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[TW]Fox;16303338 said:
Fantastic post, well put.
Scrappage should have been about getting rid of £150 nails on their last legs - like my old Volvo/Civic/Supra/Nova etc etc
- instead it's got rid of tidy machinery that could have served people perfectly well for years.
The government's scrappage scheme had its intentions solely in keeping new car sales up, whilst at the same time encouraging take-up by falsely implying to consumers that they were helping the environment by getting a new, more efficient car. I can understand the reasoning for getting some of the battered old sheds off the road, but these are in the minority (I seriously can't remember the last time I saw a Ford Sierra, Vauxhall Nova, etc). Besides that, those people driving old cars will continue to do so regardless for one simple reason - they cannot afford to change, scheme or otherwise.
If the government truly had environmental intentions behind the scrappage scheme, then the age requirement would have been something closer to older than 15 years, not 10. The pic in Fox's opening post sums up just what a flawed, rushed scheme this was, and a lot of perfectly good cars are now going to be wasted for no reason at all. As it stands the only people benefiting are the foreign car manufacturers, and to a lesser extent the workers in UK car production factories (are there even any left?
). Everyone else is just saddling themselves with more debt as they feel they must change to something new and shiny before the scheme expires, or erroneously believe they are 'doing their bit for the environment'.
If the government truly had environmental intentions behind the scrappage scheme, then the age requirement would have been something closer to older than 15 years, not 10. The pic in Fox's opening post sums up just what a flawed, rushed scheme this was, and a lot of perfectly good cars are now going to be wasted for no reason at all. As it stands the only people benefiting are the foreign car manufacturers, and to a lesser extent the workers in UK car production factories (are there even any left?
). Everyone else is just saddling themselves with more debt as they feel they must change to something new and shiny before the scheme expires, or erroneously believe they are 'doing their bit for the environment'.
Soldato
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Shame the Government cant run a scheme where old cars that fail there MOT on emissions etc can be traded in for one of these vehicles.
I could have easily scrapped my P-reg megane. But I believe in PROPER re-cycling, ie. use something until it's utterly dead. It has now gone to a relation (step half-brother, I think is what he is), and he's got it for free, as long as he promises to look after it.
I actually traded in a old N-reg Primera on this scheme and tbh a lot of the dealers didn't have a clue what was going on!
All insisted my car must be taxed for me to trade it in (it was anyway) and then the dealer I actually went with did a HPI on my car and found it to be a cat d and threw a proper wobbler (I nearly cancelled) But it was ok they "sorted it out"
Stupid scheme really rushed in and not thought through at all!
All insisted my car must be taxed for me to trade it in (it was anyway) and then the dealer I actually went with did a HPI on my car and found it to be a cat d and threw a proper wobbler (I nearly cancelled) But it was ok they "sorted it out"
Stupid scheme really rushed in and not thought through at all!
[TW]Fox;16303502 said:
There was one guy a while back who had taken in a TVR that a customer had traded in on the scrappage scheme, he was selling it with no documents or history because of this.
Scrapping a TVR in place of something like a Hyundai Getz most likely
Soldato
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There was one guy a while back who had taken in a TVR that a customer had traded in on the scrappage scheme, he was selling it with no documents or history because of this.
Scrapping a TVR in place of something like a Hyundai Getz most likely
IIRC it was being sold as a track car, because it couldnt be legally put back on the road.
I have heard stories of old biddies driving into dealerships for scrappage in their pristine cars which they have kept garaged for years and taken out once a week to the shops and the guys in the dealerships have given them cash to buy the cars off them as they were deemed "classics".
Soldato
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I could be mistaken but I think the cars are a distraction.
The point about the scrappage scheme was not to revitalise the car industry in the UK, but to help the credit industry, the moneylenders, the banks; to get more people into debt.
The point about the scrappage scheme was not to revitalise the car industry in the UK, but to help the credit industry, the moneylenders, the banks; to get more people into debt.
I don't understand why they don't sell the cars on! Crushing them is just madness and such a massive massive waste of money.
So many cars there, some of them I bet worth more than £2k.
I reckon dealers could make an absolute fortune just buying the cars themselves for £2000 when approached with one of these scrappage customers, going over them with a hoover and some T-Cut and selling them on for a substantial profit.
I don't understand why they don't sell the cars on! Crushing them is just madness and such a massive massive waste of money.
So many cars there, some of them I bet worth more than £2k.
of course they are worth more.. just look at pistonheads etc etc... many of them dont sell for less than 2.5k.. and these will crushed with no use..
That's the problem though. They make more money from the finance people take out and it's much easier for them
Send it away for scrap they have already marked the car up to cover the £2k discounts then most people will buy on finance and the dealer is a winner.
The only real 'banger' in that picture was that very old Toyota Corolla with the black wheels. The rest look like, well the average car park in Tesco.
The government have cocked up big time, this could have been a genuine chance to rid the country of it's final few horrible bangers, instead a load of serviceable cars perfectly ideal for people with a small budget will be cubed.
The government have cocked up big time, this could have been a genuine chance to rid the country of it's final few horrible bangers, instead a load of serviceable cars perfectly ideal for people with a small budget will be cubed.
One of these badboys:
I am totally dismayed at seeing so many MK1 Foci in that picture, I've NEVER seen one worthy of being destroyed and they are EURO IV compliant and they have an NCAP rating of 4 stars, so what gives?!!
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Soldato
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MR2 Tbar (?)
Loads of Mercs
Loads of Passats (Woooo!)
Generally, loads of decent cars, although I expect almost all of them have damage on the exterior from being parked and possibly have been raced about when taken to being parked up.
Loads of Mercs
Loads of Passats (Woooo!
)Generally, loads of decent cars, although I expect almost all of them have damage on the exterior from being parked and possibly have been raced about when taken to being parked up.