SCSI question

Associate
Joined
16 Jan 2007
Posts
196
Location
London
I'm thinking of getting a SCSI RAID array (correct terminology?) in my PC. now i'm very baffled after spending about 2 hours reading up and googling about SCSI drives and SCSI controller cards. can sum1 suggest which is the best SCSI controller card for running pair of these:
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=HD-014-FS
please sum1 knowledgeable in SCSI help me out
 
Last edited:
I personally have a LSI Logic MegaRAID 320-2X with a pair of those (the 68-pin version) and I'm very happy with the performance. To use the 80-pin SCA version you'll need some adaptors or a hotswap backplane/bay for SCA drives.
 
Before we go any further, are you sure you want to go SCSI? It's far from cheap, far from quiet and far from simple.

Anyway, standard health warning out the way, here's what you'll need:

A controller card, preferably a U320 one but here's the first problem, you'll only get one in PCI-X or if you look hard there are some PCIe 8x ones about. The PCI-X ones usually fit in a normal PCI slot but will be bandwidth limited to 133MB/s - don't even think about spending this sort of cash on an array that will run at >180Mb/s and go and stick it in a PCI slot. The usual approach is to go for a second hand Dell PERC4 card which is a PCIe 8x card and stick it in a spare 16x slot.

You could go for a U160 card which is native PCI but again you're going to be bandwidth limited.

You'll need an 68pin internal cable, it needs to be U320 compatible and have the correct terminator on it. A 4 head cable should be fine but it'll be £50 or so unless you can get it with the card.

Note the fact that I said 68pin. You can't get 80pin cables, the 80pin or SCA connector is a combined power and data connector used in server chassis to allow hot swapping of the disks. Adapters are available but you have to be careful, a lot of them are only Ultra Wide or Ultra2 Wide, you'll need U320 or U160 ones to match the card. Not only do the adapters split out the SCA connector to a molex and a 68pin plug they also provide a means of setting the SCSI ID for each disk which is missing from SCA drives (the server backplan provides it). Each drive and the controller need a unique ID (0-15)on the cable.

Once that's all done it *should* just be the same install routine as with SATA RAID but I'm told the Dell card can be a real pain to get going.
 
rpstewart said:
Once that's all done it *should* just be the same install routine as with SATA RAID but I'm told the Dell card can be a real pain to get going.

Indeed, one has to re-flash the Dell PERC4/DC with LSI Logic firmware to get XP to be friendly with it. Easy job, and worth knowing because you can find nice deals for PERC4 cards on a popular auction site...
 
ty for the quick reply, well I still didn't spend my x-mas bonus and I was thinking of installing a SCSI array for quite a while. Now those 2 fujitsu SCSI drives they are 68pin so I guess I will stick with 1st plan, don't want to mess with no 80pin SCSI. Now I was going to buy asus 650 mobo, and that one has got 16x when you operate it single and 8x pci-x when you run 2 gfx cards. Should that be enough? the mobo is asus p5n-e sli

Thanks for taking your time explaining me all that, makes more sense than what i read on most info websites.
 
Last edited:
to matja

out of curiosity how much performance boost did you get from raid scsi? how fast does windows load up and how fast do bf2 maps load up (I'm on single sata right now and the load time of bf2 maps is...well...appalling)
 
What kind of cable needed to link the MegaRAID SCSI 320 2X to fujitsu drives. Now rpstewart mentioned 4 head u320 compatible cable with correct terminator on it (you lost me on the terminator bit tbh). tried looking for one but search result were rather poor. ty
 
Last edited:
This SCSI really bugs me, I was reading up about this controller:
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=CC-021-AD
in the description it says that it will support SCSI raid, Is it going to be a good card for running 2 68pin fujitsu 15k drives in raid?? (I know its 133 Mhz but i really dont want to bid for anything over the pond on that popular auction site + I know I will get the dogz b customer support with OCuk, if only they did sell MegaRAID 320-2X)

(and yeah i know its my 4th post in a row, I've got a lot of questions :rolleyes: )
 
Last edited:
That card is PCI-X, it'll run in a normal PCI slot but to be frank you'd be daft spending the best part of £600 for a setup that won't outperform a £100 SATA RAID setup.

SCSI cables are a bit of a nightmare, it needs to be compatible with the speed you want to run at and properly terminated (a wee resistor block to stop the signals bouncing back down the cable). Most decent U320 cables will come with an appropriate terminator.
 
Does that sounds about right for the cable:
* 36 Inch Flat cable Labeled Ultra320 LVD
* With four 68 pin device connector and extra one for connect to the interface card
* Also, 1 connector fixed with terminator
* Total in 6 connector
* Maximum running speed is 320MB/Sec
* Downward compatible to LVD 160, 80MB SCSI, 40MB SCSI
* Terminator Included
ty
 
mikka84 said:
out of curiosity how much performance boost did you get from raid scsi? how fast does windows load up and how fast do bf2 maps load up (I'm on single sata right now and the load time of bf2 maps is...well...appalling)

Well i'm currently getting about 190MB/s in RAID-0 over two drives, average random seek time arround 3ms. Haven't timed how fast BF2 maps load, but suffice to say that its fast enough so that I always have first pick on any vehicle at the start of the round - I've been able to steal vehicles from the enemy base at the start of the round before people have even loaded ;)

Windows doesn't boot noticibly faster, but then most SCSI RAID drivers take some time to initialise because they scan the entire SCSI bus with modest timeouts, to make sure it picks up all the drives correctly. Ones with built-in cache RAM do a memory test too. You're likely to notice the most difference on tasks with heavy concurrent disk usage, such as making copies of files onto the same filesystem - my old raptors in raid-0 used to bog down from the head seeking but these SCSI drives take it in their stride.

rpstewart is completely right saying theres no point putting a fast RAID card in a regular PCI slot if you're aiming for speed. I specifically bought my mobo because it has 2 PCI-X and 2 PCIe slots. Sure, you'll still have the advantage of the immensly quick seek times if you run it in regular PCI, but not the high transfer rates.

Also bear in mind that the vast majority of motherboards have the PCI slots sharing the same PCI bus, whereas PCI-X motherboards usually have a seperate (non-contended) bus for each slot, effectively point-to-point, so you don't have any problems with devices sucking bandwidth away from other drives.
 
cheers mate, blimey, stealing from enemy base before they load on the map? that IS fast.
Yeah I got it, need to get and LSI Logic MegaRAID SCSI 320 2X controller.
I was looking at that popular auction site, did find a few of those, but in the description it says PCI-X 133mhz. Now I just cant find any controller that has a description LSI Logic MegaRaid SCSI 320 2x and has a faster rate than PCI-X 133Mhz. Here are a few of them:
http://img170.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lsicontrollermr2.jpg
Is that the ones you guys got or does it have sumthing else in its description. These controller cards are hard to find tbh.

On the original LSI webpage they dont have anything faster than 133Mhz PCI-X:
http://www.lsi.com/storage_home/pro.../megaraid_scsi/megaraid_scsi_3202x/index.html


I'm planning to install these on a BadAxe with a 8800gts, that theoretically run it fine, right?

I cant begin to express how helpful you guys were, thanks a lot
 
Last edited:
Oh yeah, and will a corsair 620W PSU power SCSI RAID fine? Got 1 optical drive, 1 300gig sata storage drive, badaxe mobo, e6400 core 2 duo, 2gig 6400 Team Xtreem RAM and a 8800gts(don't have it, but will buy one). Use on board sound so no audio card
 
The PCIe version seems to have disappeared from the LSI site unfortunately. There is a Dell one going in a UK auction if you hurry but I'm not sure if it's got the RAM DIMM attached, picture says yes but the text isn't clear.

Power should be OK, SCSI will suck more juice than SATA but not by a huge amount.
 
Looks like an identical card, check if it has any cache RAM installed as that makes a difference - I have 128MB on mine - they take standard DDR ECC DIMMs though, so its not hard to upgrade.

133MHz at 64bit means the card can do up to 1066MB/sec - plenty fast enough ;) ... consider that standard PCI is 33MHz at 32bit.

There's other decent SCSI RAID controllers, I wouldn't limit your search to just an LSI ... although I have had least trouble with LSI's (and the BIOS rocks, its like an old version of Windows, you can use the mouse and everything!) ... cards like the Adaptec 2200S, 2230S(LP), etc are decent... even a dual channel U160 would be fine for 2 drives, since you can have a drive on each channel with no bottleneck.

620W sounds ok, I've heard corsair PSU's are decent so I wouldn't expect a problem. Power ratings of SCSI drives aren't very much higher than 10k SATA drives.

A Badaxe doesn't have PCI-X so you're limited to 133MB/sec with that board unless you find a PCI-e SCSI RAID card (tend to be a lot more expensive)
 
ffs, stupid me, got confused between 133Mhz and 133 MB/s, but hey all are 133Mhz, couldnt find a single one with PCIe and 133MB/s
 
Last edited:
Back
Top Bottom