Setting up Home media server again, suggestions?

[2013]

Hi I'm about to setup my media server again and I thought it would be a good time to take a fresh look.
taking a look online and a lot of things have changed since I originally set it up.

Im going to be using my HP Microserver gen8

I wanted to get get your thoughts and suggestion.

First of all the OS -
Should I still use Windows ? I was thinking of using windows + docker.

I've always used windows due to the simple everyday use, I've rarely used Linux and I never used the terminals because I've never needed to (maybe controversial on here).
I know a lot of tutorials and setups suggest using Linux, but I would prefer to use something simple which I can understand, instead of learning something I would rarely use, other than the one off and will likely forget between uses.

What is the best raid option for me ?
Don't know much about raid so hopefully someone can help.
In the past I used raid1 which mirrored both drive, it did secure the data but it also gave me the least space and cost the most.
if I upload a movie I don't want the data split between 2 drive, so I need to have both drive installed to read the full data for the movie.
From what I can remember the server did give me a warning before the drive started failing,
Should I still use Raid 1 ? what do you use ?

Media service - Plex/Emby/Jellyfin
Is Plex still the best ?
I used plex for my media server before, it was simple and I could find a app for most things including my Samsung TV.

Im thinking of installing other apps like Pi-Hole

Do you have any other suggestions ?

 

[2013]

Thanks, Ill check out unraid but my issue is using Linux but ill check it out,
Ill also stick with Plex for now then,

also

What is the best raid option for me ?
Don't know much about raid so hopefully someone can help.
In the past I used raid1 which mirrored both drive, it did secure the data but it also gave me the least space and cost the most.
if I upload a movie I don't want the data split between 2 drive, so I need to have both drive installed to read the full data for the movie.
From what I can remember the server did give me a warning before the drive started failing,
Should I still use Raid 1 ? what do you use ?

 

[2013]

Raid 1 as you mentioned mirrors a whole drive to another, essentially using 1 drive to protect another ("wasting" half of your space).

Raid 5 spreads the data across multiple drives, and also stripes some redundant parity information across the drives, so in the event of a single drive failure, the missing drive's data can be calculated from what remains + the parity data. In terms of space - this means you only "waste" 1 drive's worth of space to provide recovery information for all your drives.
The disadvantages are that it's complicated, and if a drive fails, then although the drive can be replaced and rebuilt, because of the complexity of this (it takes a while), and the extra reading/writing can often cause one of the remaining disks to fail.

Unraid is similar to Raid 5 in that it uses parity to protect data. The difference being that the parity data isn't striped - it's just stored on the single largest drive in your system. All the other drives are essentially independent (e.g. they can be lifted and read in another machine independently). Again Unraid is only "wasting" one drive of space for recovery information for all your drives.
Compared to RAID5, Rebuilds are slightly less risky, as even if an other drive fails during a Rebuild, you only lose data on that drive, whereas on Raid5 because the data is striped, the whole array is lost.
The only limitation with Unraid is that because each drive is independent, you are only ever reading/writing to a single drive and so are limited to the speed of that drive (unlike Raid5 which will read a stipe across 3 or more drives, potentially trebling read speed) - this can however be offset with an SSD cache if needed (but for things like media storage it's a none issue)
Unraid also allows you to mix drive sizes to maximise space (as long as the parity drive is larger than all other drives), something no other RAID mode can do

What is Unraid? | Unraid Docs

Unraid® is an embedded operating system that is designed to provide you

docs.unraid.net

Thanks, I've Only had 2 large drive in the past and still 2 drive at the moment and the SSD, so I'm not sure which option would be best, I may add more drives.
I'm assuming the Microserver will allow Unraid,
What about Raid 6 and Raid 10 ?

 

[2013]

Unraid is an OS (as well as being the name of the data protection), so you'd use it instead of Windows. It is paid-for software ($53.10 for up to 6 drives at the minute)


Raid10 is like Raid1, but the data is striped across each mirrored pair. You need at least 4 drives, and you still waste half the capacity. Like RAID1 it's advantages are that it's simple (quick) to rebuild if a drive fails as it's just a case of reading and mirroring a single drive. (Raid10 can tolerate multiple drive failures - as long as they aren't in the same mirrored pair)

Raid 6 is like Raid 5, but uses an additional parity stripe, so can tolerate up to any 2 drives failing without data loss. Because you lose 2 drives worth of space, it needs at least 5 drives to make any real sense (as at 4 drives you get the same space with RAID10 and it's faster/less complicated)

No great options, Could I run the drive without raid like I do on the desktop but still get early notification ?

 

[2013]

Yep you can still run it without parity.

Storage Management | Unraid Docs

To assign devices to

docs.unraid.net

i'm not sure on which option. Any suggestion on what could be best for me ? to start I will have 2-3 HDD drive and a SSD

also any other options other than Unraid ? I dont think I want to pay for something I dont know I will use

 

[2013]

Well with that hardware you aren't really limited on OS choice. It depends what your priorities are. If it is to run Plex with the least hassle possible, then yeah probably Windows 10 or Windows Server then install plex on top. You can use hardware RAID as you speak of if it's built in with that HP box, if not buy a cheap RAID card for it. If you use something like Unraid or FreeNAS, then it performs software redundancy options for you built in using ZFS/parity. Windows can do software RAID too.
But then if you are just going to run windows with 2/3 Hard disk drives, you could just as easily run Plex on your main PC (if you own one) as a service without having to run a whole separate server. Depends on your needs, usage requirements and setup.

Sorry for the delay, yes, its a HP Gen8 Microserver, so it already has basics built in, Ive never really used anything long term other than windows, ive used linux but only for basic stuff.

I have a main pc but I thought since I have the hp micros server i could just use that and use it around the house instead of turning the PC on each time I want to use it, I have 3x 3TB SATA drive, I was originally just going to use 2 and mirror them like I did time but it seam like a waste of money and space, so I was looking for some suggest, what does everyone else do ?

I do have a drive in my pc which I backed up all the files to when my server drives started failing last time but I was just wondering what the best option would be.

To start with i was thinking of just setting up Plex so I can watch movies on other devices, but I started think if im setting it up I could run docker and have other option like Pi-hole and other things runing.

As a long term Windows user, recent Mac user and complete Linux luddite, I found Unraid really quite straightforward to get into. Everything is done in the GUI pretty much and there's tutorials and videos on everything available online. Its app store for docker images and addons is dead easy to use and it just works. It's very fit for purpose as a media server. One of its biggest weaknesses, slow write performance to the array, can be mitigated with a cache drive to an extent but in a media server it's much less of an issue. It's implantation of VMs is easy to work with and there's a docker container in the app store for most things including your choice of Plex, Emby and Jellyfin.

If you've three HDDs you'd set the largest as parity and the other two as data drives. You only lose the capacity of the largest drive in total usable space and have some protection from any one disk failure. An explanation as to how parity works is available here: https://docs.unraid.net/legacy/FAQ/Parity/ It isn't the same as RAID (hence the product name). It's also not a replacement for a good backup regime but then neither is RAID.

I'm biased of course because I use it but I did try Windows as a "server" , OMV and something else I forget and this is just really easy yet you can dive deep and do more funky stuff if you want (I once had my unlimited Google storage as a backend treated just like local storage). Now with one 136TB server and one 48TB backup server I guess I am really invested in it but I have no regrets despite still being much more comfortable running Windows and MacOS on my desktop daily drivers.

Has anyone tried things like casaos ?

I have 3x 3TB SATA drive, I was originally just going to use 2 and mirror them.
You say

If you've three HDDs you'd set the largest as parity and the other two as data drives.

but would that not be the same as mirroring.

I still thinking to keep things simple just run windows and docker or windows and plex

 

[2013]

It would not. Did you read the link I put in the post explaining parity? nothing is mirrored. Your array drives hold data in a pretty ordinary way (you can even take the disks out and put them in another machine) and the parity disk basically holds the results of logical bit level calculations to be able to emulate any disk if it goes bad in the array. Lose an array drive and it’ll emulate until you replace. Lose the parity disk and you’ve not lost any data and just replace it. You can cover a single disk failure with a single parity drive no matter how many disks in your data array.

With 3x3TB drives you’d have 6TB of usable space.

Sorry I must have missed the link, Ill check it out.
Can I do the same even if I have 4x 3tb drive ?
Is it possible to do this in windows or via raid in the hp ?

 

[2013]

4x3TB drives with single parity would give you 9TB usable space. You can’t do this in Windows that I know of. And this is definitely not something you do with a RAID card - the clue is in the name of the operating system “UnRaid”

Thanks, I should have paid attention to the name

the clue is in the name of the operating system “UnRaid”

RAID 5 - 4x3TB drives would give you 9TB usable space

Thanks, but Im still not sure how raids work, could you explain please ?
I'm assuming in RAID 5 if one drive fails or it I remove one all the data would be a mess ? and All drive would need to be the same ?

Like @Armageus said

Raid 1 as you mentioned mirrors a whole drive to another, essentially using 1 drive to protect another ("wasting" half of your space).

Raid 5 spreads the data across multiple drives, and also stripes some redundant parity information across the drives, so in the event of a single drive failure, the missing drive's data can be calculated from what remains + the parity data. In terms of space - this means you only "waste" 1 drive's worth of space to provide recovery information for all your drives.
The disadvantages are that it's complicated, and if a drive fails, then although the drive can be replaced and rebuilt, because of the complexity of this (it takes a while), and the extra reading/writing can often cause one of the remaining disks to fail.

At the moment RAID is not making real sense.

 

[2013]

RAID 5 needs a minimum of 3 disks to work. You lose the capacity of one disk (in the same way that unraid does) for the privilege of using RAID 5. Both unraid and RAID 5 allows for one disk to completely fail, be replaced, and you do not lose anything. So either unraid or a RAID card will give you the same cover.

HOWEVER, neither unraid nor RAID is a backup system, it is a method of redundancy. You can have RAID 5 working wonderfully but if your house burns down with the PC inside then you have lost everything. RAID and BACKUP are different things.

RAID explained: https://www.booleanworld.com/raid-levels-explained/

Thanks for that, that clears up a few bits also, If my house burns down with my pc and mircoserver inside, I don't think anything would make a diffrence unless I have a private cloud

also Armageus did say

Raid 5 spreads the data across multiple drives, and also stripes some redundant parity information across the drives, so in the event of a single drive failure, the missing drive's data can be calculated from what remains + the parity data. In terms of space - this means you only "waste" 1 drive's worth of space to provide recovery information for all your drives.
The disadvantages are that it's complicated, and if a drive fails, then although the drive can be replaced and rebuilt, because of the complexity of this (it takes a while), and the extra reading/writing can often cause one of the remaining disks to fail.

Unraid is similar to Raid 5 in that it uses parity to protect data. The difference being that the parity data isn't striped - it's just stored on the single largest drive in your system. All the other drives are essentially independent (e.g. they can be lifted and read in another machine independently). Again Unraid is only "wasting" one drive of space for recovery information for all your drives.
Compared to RAID5, Rebuilds are slightly less risky, as even if an other drive fails during a Rebuild, you only lose data on that drive, whereas on Raid5 because the data is striped, the whole array is lost.

The only limitation with Unraid is that because each drive is independent, you are only ever reading/writing to a single drive and so are limited to the speed of that drive (unlike Raid5 which will read a stipe across 3 or more drives, potentially trebling read speed) - this can however be offset with an SSD cache if needed (but for things like media storage it's a none issue)
Unraid also allows you to mix drive sizes to maximise space (as long as the parity drive is larger than all other drives), something no other RAID mode can do

 

[2013]

The difference is that if a 2nd drive fails in an actual RAID5 array you lose all data on the array (as data is striped across the discs). In unraid data on any remaining discs is still readable (as Unraid is essentially just "indexing" what's on each separate disc and using another disc to store this "index")


As above though - Raid/Unraid are just ways to improve the availability of your data. If it's important it should be backed up (e.g to the "cloud" or to a separate usb drive).

For media files Unraid makes a lot of sense - they take up a lot of room (so you want to maximise the space you have), aren't critically important if lost (unlike say family photos), but it's inconvenient to have to rerip or redownload.

Unraid therefore pools whatever drives you have to consolidate space, and offers a degree of data protection with only a single additional drive (compared to mirroring that essentially requires double the number of drives for the same space).

Thanks again, I'm still a little hesitant towards unraid as its not something ive used or comfortable with , is anything else possible ?

in raid 5 is the data spread evenly across all 3 drives or is drive 1 & 2 used as the storage and 3 as the backup ?

So I would have a total of 9TB and if one drive I can replace, is there a high chance of failure when restoring ?
also if 2 drives fail im out of luck ?

 

[2013]

Comparison Table

Feature	UnRAID	RAID 5
Total Usable Capacity	6TB	6TB
Parity Drive Size	3TB (dynamic)	3TB
Performance	Slightly lower due to overhead of managing different drive sizes	Slightly higher due to hardware-based data protection
Flexibility	More flexible, can use drives of different sizes	Less flexible, requires drives of the same size
Scalability	More scalable, can easily add more drives	Less scalable, expanding with different drive sizes can be complex
Complexity	Slightly more complex setup	Simpler setup

Recommendation


The choice between UnRAID and RAID 5 depends on your specific needs and priorities. If you prioritize storage utilization and flexibility, UnRAID is a suitable option. However, if simplicity and performance are your primary concerns, RAID 5 might be a better choice.


Additional Considerations

• Data Protection: Both UnRAID and RAID 5 provide data protection against drive failures. However, UnRAID's parity drive can be regenerated even if two drives fail, while RAID 5 can only tolerate one drive failure.
• Performance: RAID 5 typically offers slightly better performance than UnRAID, especially for read operations. However, the difference in performance is often minimal for most home and small business needs.
• Cost: UnRAID is a software-based solution, while RAID 5 typically requires a hardware-based RAID controller. This can make UnRAID a more cost-effective option, especially if you already have a compatible server.

When considering the use of three 3TB drives and one 1TB drive in a storage configuration, both UnRAID and RAID 5 offer viable options with distinct advantages and limitations.

UnRAID

UnRAID's flexibility in drive size management allows you to utilize all four drives, resulting in a total usable capacity of 7TB. The 1TB drive serves as the parity drive, protecting data from loss in case one of the 3TB drives fails. UnRAID dynamically allocates parity space based on data needs, ensuring efficient storage utilization.

RAID 5

In a RAID 5 configuration, the usable capacity is determined by the smallest drive, which is the 1TB drive. This means that the total usable capacity would be limited to 3TB. However, RAID 5 offers slightly better performance due to hardware-based data protection.

Comparison Table

Feature	UnRAID	RAID 5
Total Usable Capacity	7TB	3TB
Parity Drive Size	1TB (dynamic)	1TB
Performance	Slightly lower due to overhead of managing different drive sizes	Slightly higher due to hardware-based data protection
Flexibility	More flexible, can use drives of different sizes	Less flexible, requires drives of the same size
Scalability	More scalable, can easily add more drives	Less scalable, expanding with different drive sizes can be complex
Complexity	Slightly more complex setup	Simpler setup

It seam Raid5 can only use the same size drives also a little harder to expand the storage

 

[2013]

Has anyone used TrueNAS, CasaOS or OpenMediaVault they are free and seam similar to Unraid,
Would it be too much for me ?

Just use a windows pc with shared network drives. Since its just media dont need raid either just keep a backup of the important stuff.

That maybe my choice, I just wanted to get the most out of the NAS this time with some help for you guys.

So far you have not let me down, replying to my silly questions and helping me understand.

 

[2013]

The below picture from Wikipedia shows how data is laid out on a 4 Disk RAID5.
Data is striped across all the disks - in simple terms if a file is in the orange stripe, it's data is spread across Disk0, Disk1 and Disk2. Parity (Recovery) information about that stripe is then stored on Disk3.
To read a file from the orange stripe, then all disks are needed to read the entire stripe.
If Disk2 failed for example then the file in the orange stripe can still be read as it uses the data from disk0 and disk1, and then uses the parity data "Ap" combined with the data from disk0 and disk1 to regenerate the missing data.
If 2 disks fail, e.g. Disk 2 and Disk 3, then all data is unrecoverable, as in the case of the orange stripe you only have 2 remaining pieces of data (A1, A2), A3 is lost and the parity (recovery) information is also lost.

I've created a diagram to try and show how Unraid lays data out with 4 disks.
Data is stored on Disk0,1,2 as normal - files are stored in their entirety on a single disk. Disk 3 is used as a dedicated parity drive.
To read a file e.g. the Red "word.doc", then the only disk needed is disk 1.
If Disk 2 failed in this Unraid example, then files on disk 0 and disk 1 can be read as normal (with no performance loss). Files that were on Disk 2 can still be read, as it will compare the parity data on disk 3 against what is on disk0 and disk1, to reconstruct the missing data.
If 2 disks fail on Unraid e.g. Disk 2 and 3, you would lose the data on Disk3, and lose the parity information, but files on Disk 0 and Disk 1 would still be fully accessible.

Thanks, that clears up a few things for me.

I don't really feel like spending as much for new linux OS at this time. So it will need to be a free option or something I own.


Are any of other NAS OS similar to Unraid,
If I've missed something again, please let me know, it can sometime take me a little longer to understand things and running on fumes at night which does not help.


Any suggestion on what OS to use?

 

[2013]

There are other options that will get close, but none are as easy or as well supported.

Snapraid is a free option that will do "sort of" data parity on Windows https://www.snapraid.it/ but it requires a lot of configuration and isn't necessarily automatic
Stablebit Drivepool will help pool drives under Windows and can do file duplication/balancing https://stablebit.com/DrivePool/Features but again it's a paid for option
Windows Storage Spaces in Windows 10/11/Server will do Parity storage spaces, but I'd be hesitant to recommend it for any data you care about - like much of Windows 10/11 lately, it isn't well tested, and updates frequently change behaviour or cause issues


Note that while Unraid is the recommended option for ease of use and the benefits of the Unraid parity format, for Media RAID5 on any NAS operating system (Truenas/OpenmediaVault/Proxmox etc) is normally still a good enough option (it still maximises space whilst maintaining some degree of redundancy)

Not having any RAID/redundancy is also a valid option - ultimately it depends how big your media collection is, and how much you value your time if you were to have to re-rip/re-download it.



That's only relevant for RAID0 (Striping with no data protection), regardless of drive sizes RAID1/10 is still very much common, and RAID5/6 still has a couple of use cases.

Plex (or Emby/Jellyfin only transcode if the client doesn't support a format or something is set up wrong - e.g. you've manually restricted bandwidth somewhere).
If you aren't using Plex etc, then surely you are missing out on metadata (e.g. movie descriptions etc) and it must be a very basic experience

Thank you again,
I guess Raid 5 would be the best option, most people use Linux for home servers (must be a reason) and since I want to get the most out of mine, ill be doing the same.
Which OS would be best for someone like, me who is using it for the first time like me, Truenas Core/Truenas Scale/OpenmediaVault/Proxmox etc

I'm thinking Truenas But I'm not 100% sure yet.

 

[2013]

Could someone help me, I've been trying to setup my hp microserver gen 8 which has a b120i raid card, after all this It seam it only supports raid 1 or raid 0.

What do I do now ?

 

[2013]

Don't set up the raid on the b120i, just leave them as individual drives.

Then set up the raid under whatever os you are using

Would that work ? I thought software raid was less reliable ?
Should I also leave the SSD instead of setting the array or would I need to set it up?
Im going to use OpenMediaVault as it needs less resources, would that be find ?

 

[2013]

Thanks again

 

[2013]

i have installed omv 4-5 time, the OS load i completed the setup 4-5 time, the ssd is detected i installed from start to finish, it then asks to reboot and remove the usb but on reboot it does not load the os, i have now re istalled for the 6th time removing all other drives, but still the same i used stable omv 6.5 should i try another vertion or OS

 

[2013]

After multiple attempts and trying different thing I finding out I need to set the SSD up as a array to get the OS to work I finally got OMV to work,
I tried to install Truenas but i cant even get the install setup to load.
So ive gone back to OMV but every time I tried to install the available updates the I reboot and it gives a message no working init found. So I can install the latest update for some reason.

 

[2013]

You could be right, If used UnRAID it may have saved me a lot of time and would have been easier to use. but its more of a learning curve for me, with not knowing what im doing, with us SSH and command prompts and waiting for things, Im use to windows so Im learning as I go along the way so nothing is 100% guaranteed but I do agree would have been a little easier.

installing OMV 4-5 was fixed after setting up the array for the SSD, issues last night, I tried again today and managed to update OMV to the latest version and added docker.