Smart Motorways

[Deleted User 298457]

Has a nightmare with one on M25 the other week

When a lane is closed and a speed limit enforced are you meant to get an all clear running lane re-opened and confirmation of speed limit back to national speed limit, or is a blank sign all needed ?

Left running lane suddenly was stating was shut, variable speed limit went down to 50 then 40, then a fair way later a sign saying vehicle broken down in lane followed by a blank set of signs further on, queue me finding myself stuck in 2nd lane not knowing if lane was re opened or not and or if speed limit had been removed and before I knew it i had lorries undertaking in running lane at 50+ and finding it difficult to get across

If blank sign good enough how do you know it's not just faulty and not working you could shoot though the next speed camera 500 yards on at 70 and find actually still 40 just that sign was broken.

Same with knowing if lane has reopened or not you'd think there would be a positive confirmation all clear

...you want a sign that says whether the sign is working? What if that sign breaks?

If you're getting undertaken by lorries I think you need a look in the mirror lol.

 

[Conscript]

Has a nightmare with one on M25 the other week

When a lane is closed and a speed limit enforced are you meant to get an all clear running lane re-opened and confirmation of speed limit back to national speed limit, or is a blank sign all needed ?

Left running lane suddenly was stating was shut, variable speed limit went down to 50 then 40, then a fair way later a sign saying vehicle broken down in lane followed by a blank set of signs further on, queue me finding myself stuck in 2nd lane not knowing if lane was re opened or not and or if speed limit had been removed and before I knew it i had lorries undertaking in running lane at 50+ and finding it difficult to get across

If blank sign good enough how do you know it's not just faulty and not working you could shoot though the next speed camera 500 yards on at 70 and find actually still 40 just that sign was broken.

Same with knowing if lane has reopened or not you'd think there would be a positive confirmation all clear

A friend of mine used to work as an electronics engineer with responsibility for some of these systems on parts of the M25 and told me about this. The signs which have cameras attached are monitored by CCTV cameras. If the camera flashes someone, it also saves a CCTV image of the sign being displayed at the time - if there are any faults with the sign, then it won't even bother issuing a FPN. In fact, this is one easy way to tell if a gantry actually has cameras on it - look at the verge as you approach the gantry and you'll see a mast with several CCTV cameras attached rigidly pointing at the face of the variable signs.

The limit for what constitutes a faulty sign is actually very strict; if I recall, he said that even if just a few of the LEDs forming the sign were inoperative, that would be enough for the system to abort processing a fine. So if the sign is not showing anything at all, I think you should be safe.

 

[jpaul]

you could say there is some ambiguity on signage on the dynamic version
The hard shoulder must not be used if the signs over it are blank or display a red X, except in the case of an emergency. Other variable message signs will say ‘hard shoulder for emergency use only’.
two ways to show don't use it -
I don't know if foreign implementations have the same stratgegy? or some have permanently illuminated sign to reinforce not to use it