So I think I need a V8 (man maths ahoy)

[Rainmaker]

I've gone through house moves, illness, all manner of tomfoolery and then finally settled down and got married. My wife is expecting my first baby, a daughter, and I've been taking stock of my life thus far as impending parenthood seems to encourage.

I've booked in to refresh my advanced driving already, because it's something I enjoy and being honest the thought of driving round this little helpless bundle of life is suddenly daunting. Funny it never really bothered me when it was someone else's child because I know I'm as safe a driver as I can be anyway. Anyway...

With the new arrival cooking on full gas and due in March, I've quit smoking and been saving the £50 a week in a jar. That got me thinking. Up until this last year I'd only ever driven diesels except for my first car 10 years ago, which was a Ford Sierra petrol with RWD goodness. Petrol prices are low (for now) and in the last couple of years I've gone from being obsessed with 'economy' to realising there's more to the story than the pump figures. Overall our 2.0 petrol is costing less than our previous 2.0 diesel!

I have worked out that our 2.0 runabout gets 38mpg average and that a nice E39 540i V8 or Audi A8 4.2 V8 would only really cost an extra £10 or £20 a week for much more smiles and enjoyment versus an econobox. We were wanting a second car anyway so I suggested my wife keep using the existing car as a town runabout and when we take longer trips out at the weekends we should waft in a noisy V8 for a few quid extra in fuel rather than just go in a bland box because it costs £3 less in petrol...

My wife was agreeable and liked the look of Jaguar S series cars though I pointed her towards the E39s. A quick check shows the insurance is actually cheaper for me on the 540i than on a 530i or below, so that's a bonus. The Audi is cheaper than even the 540i! Less people buying big V8s means less claims on them I guess.

We have a moderate disposable income (we tend to try to save £50 to £100 a week after everything's accounted for and we've put some money into the emergency fund) and as such man maths says do it before you're old, the V8s are gone and you regret it.

Research suggests the E39s are relatively solidly built and bulletproof provided one looks for FSH and the usual checks, and the same for the Audi A8s. Our eye has also been caught by the slightly newer (2002-2004) A4 V6 bi-turbo but that just seems like more to potentially go wrong in the longer term.

Budget is flexible and I'm only speculating here atm so, full disclosure: I'm not ready to buy so don't link me then moan when I don't post pics in two days lol. We're considering buying just after the baby gets here towards the summer, and budget would be between £2,500 and £3,500 which seems to net a 2000-2002 model with ~90k to 120k miles and FSH, full leather, all the toys etc. That doesn't seem bad for a second car / toy and by all accounts V8s are lazy and tend to last at least as long as diesels so that mileage isn't an issue if well maintained.

I'd appreciate your feedback, input, ideas, encouragement or scorn in equal measure.

 

[[TW]Fox]

You only seem to factor in fuel costs. These are old and increasingly fragile cars now, so you will need the means to repair them on a semi regular basis.

Just seems a bit pointless with moderate disposable income unless you are a skilled mechanic and can do most things yourself.

 

[Rainmaker]

You only seem to factor in fuel costs. These are old and increasingly fragile cars now, so you will need the means to repair them on a semi regular basis.

Just seems a bit pointless with moderate disposable income unless you are a skilled mechanic and can do most things yourself.

I'm not a stranger to self-servicing my cars and we have two mechanics on the outlaws side of the family who will work for beer. Does that count?

ETA: I know it's all relative but £100 savings a week + emergency fund + £50 from smoking savings equals around £250 a week spare cash. That's most people's whole earnings. Surely a early to mid 2000s car won't be THAT expensive in repairs? LOL

 

[The Running Man]

So you're buying a 2 grand v8 and in a position with a baby and unseen costs around the corner?

Say you blew a shock absorber, not unlikely or needed a clutch job, i just think it would wipe you out. A 10 year + old car is a car for an enthusiast with cash to burn to want to refresh those worn parts not wonder if you've worked the finances out to afford it that month.

Amd £20 a week is a grand a year extra in petrol (almost half the value of the car budget you have in mind).

 

[acemastr]

You only live once, enjoy it! (responsibly )

 

[Rainmaker]

So you're buying a 2 grand v8 and in a position with a baby and unseen costs around the corner?

Say you blew a shock absorber, not unlikely or needed a clutch job, i just think it would wipe you out. A 10 year + old car is a car for an enthusiast with cash to burn to want to refresh those worn parts not wonder if you've worked the finances out to afford it that month.

Amd £20 a week is a grand a year extra in petrol (almost half the value of the car budget you have in mind).

How much is a shock absorber or clutch with free labour? Less or more than the 1k spare cash we have on average each month? Just trying to account for everything.

ETA I wasn't being sarcastic I genuinely wanted advice. In that vein I've double checked our figures and we have about £800 a week income (worked out pro rata from salaries etc) and of that £300 is spare cash. Surely to high heaven no car costs more than £300 a week to maintain? LOL I could see the argument for buying a newer potentially more reliable car, but to say (Fox) that a 10 year old car may be too expensive on that level of income and spare finances was a little OTT, Shirley

 

[The Running Man]

How much is a shock absorber or clutch with free labour? Less or more than the 1k spare cash we have on average each month? Just trying to account for everything.

ETA I wasn't being sarcastic I genuinely wanted advice. In that vein I've double checked our figures and we have about £800 a week income (worked out pro rata from salaries etc) and of that £300 is spare cash. Surely to high heaven no car costs more than £300 a week to maintain? LOL I could see the argument for buying a newer potentially more reliable car, but to say (Fox) that a 10 year old car may be too expensive on that level of income and spare finances was a little OTT, Shirley

I guess my point is you don't know how much a clutch is, I'm not looking to buy but you are so you should be looking into the running costs and researching this.

Thing is its a gamble like anything. It could run fine for 3 years or it could blow up in 3 months. Being a v8 just means the cost to fix it is higher and potentially the likelyness of something going is higher (v8s weigh more, put more load on suspension, brakes, etc).

 

[Rainmaker]

I guess my point is you don't know how much a clutch is, I'm not looking to buy but you are so you should be looking into the running costs and researching this.

Thing is its a gamble like anything. It could run fine for 3 years or it could blow up in 3 months. Being a v8 just means the cost to fix it is higher and potentially the likelyness of something going is higher (v8s weigh more, put more load on suspension, brakes, etc).

I understand that but I had already looked up most common parts and consumables on ECP and found they were within a couple of quid of an equivalent Peugeot/Ford/whatever. A quick chat with one of the mechanics in the family last week resulted in a 'yeah throw me Stella and I'll fix it whenever you like, there's loads of parts about and they're not expensive really. Get something angel eyes onwards if you can and you're golden.'. You could just as easily say if I'd HAD to ask how much a clutch was I couldn't afford it. With ~£350 a week play money with free mechanics on tap I didn't think a clutch kit would break the bank on a mere BMW or Audi. A McLaren and you may have had a point!

I posted this thread as part of my research, but bar one reply the consensus seems to be I probably can't afford one because I don't know how much a clutch costs and I probably don't have enough money.

I'm all for realistic expectations and eyes wide open but I think the attitude is a little over the top for no reason. Put it another way, I have £300+ a week to play with and want something to waft in on the weekend after years of being stuck in diesels. Does your answer change?

 

[The Running Man]

No, but good luck wafting!

 

[Rainmaker]

No, but good luck wafting!

Why? My thread was started to ask about the E39 v A8 v what-have-you but quickly turned into Motors deciding I probably wasn't an enthusiast and couldn't afford parts. Both are incorrect and since I won't even pay for labour I don't understand the continued brick wall.

Not once piece of advice or enthusiasts' input on the merits of either car compared to the other etc, just a unilateral decision that since E39s cost a couple of quid more than a Pug/Ford/Vx in consumables that I obviously can't afford to run it as a weekend project/toy... Motors is so clever that this was decided before my finances were even made known!

And people wonder why Motors is so quiet compared to PH etc. :-/

 

[The Running Man]

I'd appreciate your feedback, input, ideas, encouragement or scorn in equal measure.

I'm just saying that the idea seems semi credible i guess i'm trying to talk you out of it a little for sensible reasons. The way I'd look at it is do you need the risk of a 14 year old v8 in your life at this moment in time? If it turned into a money pit could ypu walk away from it if the car becomes uneconomical in terms of viability.

If so go for it. If not and you aren't buying a car like this expecting to be replacing worn bushes or whatever then think twice.

 

[Rainmaker]

I'm just saying that the idea seems semi credible i guess i'm trying to talk you out of it a little for sensible reasons. The way I'd look at it is do you need the risk of a 14 year old v8 in your life at this moment in time? If it turned into a money pit could ypu walk away from it if the car becomes uneconomical in terms of viability.

If so go for it. If not and you aren't buying a car like this expecting to be replacing worn bushes or whatever then think twice.

OK now that makes more sense, and I appreciate it's late. As above it's throw away money to us at this moment and especially so after quitting smoking. The car's coming out of my 'rewards jar' and the I'm fully expecting to need to replace suspension/clutch/carry out servicing to get it back to the driving pleasure it's meant to be. It's a project/toy/reward to keep my mind off smoking and on motoring. The home-made sign next to my usual smoking place in the garden says '£50 a week on cancer, or on doing your daughter a favour and spending it on a fuel for a V8?'...

I was more looking for experience and advice re the differences in the E39 40i and the Audi 4.2 V8 as the internet generally throws up fanbois either way. So now perhaps you understand more where I'm coming from.

I'm fully aware I could buy or lease something much newer and potentially tastier but that kinda defeats my object. I was actually looking at a 530i the other day but ironically the six pots are not only much more expensive on insurance (I'm talking almost double!) than the V8s but the V8 is also a 'tick on the list' in my motoring history.

If it blows up and dies I have mechanics in the family to fix it for the cost of beer and the part. My wife spends more a week on clothes and makeup than the car is ever likely to cost in repairs! I was just looking for some advice on the driving/owning experience of one versus the other, as well as the usual dollop of Motor-esque charm. Don't forget we also have a brand new Mazda 6 2.0 as a daily so this is literally a weekend plaything.

Cheers.

 

[p1RATE]

These responses are odd. This isn't a bmw 850i it's a 540 that is a few grand and really not bank busting peformamce car. It might cost you a bit more on servicing and the age may mean a few items need replacing but parts are abundant and affordable.

 

[Jester*]

Buy on condition and do your research into whatever you buy.

Learn what the common issues, and go into ownership with your eyes open. Perhaps see if you have a local specialist that is recommended by forums/owners clubs that will keep potential costs lower.

Then enjoy.

 

[[TW]Fox]

Surely to high heaven no car costs more than £300 a week to maintain? LOL I could see the argument for buying a newer potentially more reliable car, but to say (Fox) that a 10 year old car may be too expensive on that level of income and spare finances was a little OTT, Shirley

But you didn't say that in your OP, you told us that you had, some weeks, £50 spare. £200 a month spare money (spare for everything, rather than just car) is not enough to consider playing with an old V8 5 Series. £1200 a month very much is, in the space of a few posts you've increased the available cash by 6 fold You need to work out how much you've actually got to play with because weirdly in the space of a few posts we've gone from probably not enough money for an old 5 Series to easily enough money to buy a brand new one!

If you've got that much to play with then neither of these cars will bankrupt you but I'm still not sure I'd bother. You cant rely on the goodwill of friends and family to fix it, you might after the 4th consecutive weekend of being upside down under your car free of charge find the goodwill expiring

I am somewhat surprised the insurance is half the price on a 540i than a 530i. This makes absolutely no sense and mirrors no quotes I've ever had, I suspect that somewhere there will be a 530i quote thats less than the 540i quote.

As for which one, I am hugely biased as I am a massive E39 fan, I think they are fantastic cars and the E39 would (and is) be my choice.

Just dont go using words like bulletproof because they are not - they've done very well but they are 12-19 year old cars and most have significant wear to pretty much everything. I love my E39 but even I got fed up with the constant stuff going wrong.

And people wonder why Motors is so quiet compared to PH etc. :-/

I doubt anyone wonders that, PH is the UK's busiest motoring forum and this forum is a side forum about cars on a computer hardware website

 

[Rainmaker]

Fox I realise the wording is bad on my OP due to the hour, but if you re-read it:

£50 to £100 a week after everything's accounted for and we've put some money into the emergency fund

That's £50 to £100 floating cash plus £100 plus my cig money of £50 so yeah. I'll come back later, the wife's in hospital today for tests.

 

[panthro]

If you were applying man maths, you'd have already bought the car and posted to show us pics and tell us about the first warning light that's popped up on the dash

 

[peterwalkley]

I think you are going have a nasty surprise when you see how fast money disappears with a new child in the house. Do the sums again when she's a year old and you KNOW what the score is - as opposed to guesswork.

You are going to be too knackered to enjoy it until the little one sleeps through anyway.

 

[geekman]

If you've got friendly mechanics and are willing to spend a bit of time on eBay/ECP you can quite easily run these sorts of cars for not that much cash. But if you take it to a main dealer for everything, you'll run out of money very quickly. As an example, I recently had to replace a wheel bearing on my car. Jaguar wanted £550, I bought the part from a local motor factors for £90 and did it myself with a friend. I'm not at all mechanically minded, but it was really very simple. I think in the past year/30k miles, I've spent less than £500 running my car. If I'd taken it to a main dealer, for everything it'd have been in excess of £2k.

 

[Jono8]

You should do it if you really think you can afford it. Just be prepared to spend hundreds a year (if not thousands if you are unlucky) in maintaining /repairing it.