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So if your a normal user and hate GPU mining,get over it.Try this

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henson0115 said:
funny enough i know real hard coin miner who went big and lost there family house etc so yea. I'm sure all of these millionaires are among us :D hate to break it to you, but your talking about the people who know how to work the system the 1%.

he started when it started fyi.

he wasnt mining eitehr, the money isnt in the actual mining anymore, its the trading where you make the big money.
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That's why its a ponzi scheme. People doing it now are unlikely to get stinking rich I agree. But in hindsight, the opportunity was there even fairly recently. Due to its volatility, its still there. Lets say I manage to mine 1 eth over the next couple months with my lowly gpu. What if it then goes to $10,000 for some inexplicable reason? Ok that isn't stinking rich but its still a lot. May as well be in it even though its wasteful.



ljt said:
I'm a normal person, but I put the betterment of mankind above making $150 extra month by wasting energy. I'll take helping to find cures for diseases over gaining a few extra pounds a month thanks
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That's great, its your personal choice, but as I get older I realise that this betterment of mankind thing is just bullcrap. Hardly anyone cares, people just want money.
 
henson0115 said:
funny enough i know real hard coin miner who went big and lost there family house etc so yea. I'm sure all of these millionaires are among us :D hate to break it to you, but your talking about the people who know how to work the system the 1%.

he started when it started fyi.

he wasn't mining either, the money isn't in the actual mining anymore, its the trading where you make the big money and ofc can loose it. mining is small change.
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A lot of people who mined in those early days sold Bitcoin for £400 (etc). Plucking a number out of thin air, but people back then actually used whole Bitcoin to buy (eg) a GPU, or a holiday.

Today that same Bitcoin is trading at (I won't say "worth") $30k.

To have become a millionaire (through mining) you would have needed almost clairvoyant power to realise that, by holding your Bitcoin for 5-10 years, you could make returns in the tens or hundreds of thousands. At least from the mining perspective.

The other way to make money on crypto is just to buy and sell. Buy low, sell high, if you can. Like any other gamble, tho, it might pay off or you might buy at the wrong time and lose money.
 
danlightbulb said:
That's why its a ponzi scheme. People doing it now are unlikely to get stinking rich I agree. But in hindsight, the opportunity was there even fairly recently. Due to its volatility, its still there. Lets say I manage to mine 1 eth over the next couple months with my lowly gpu. What if it then goes to $10,000 for some inexplicable reason? Ok that isn't stinking rich but its still a lot. May as well be in it even though its wasteful.
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oh i agree with you you can get lucky. and make a small chunk quickly. :)
 
FoxEye said:
A lot of people who mined in those early days sold Bitcoin for £400 (etc). Plucking a number out of thin air, but people back then actually used whole Bitcoin to buy (eg) a GPU, or a holiday.

Today that same Bitcoin is trading at (I won't say "worth") $30k.

To have become a millionaire (through mining) you would have needed almost clairvoyant power to realise that, by holding your Bitcoin for 5-10 years, you could make returns in the tens or hundreds of thousands. At least from the mining perspective.

The other way to make money on crypto is just to buy and sell. Buy low, sell high, if you can. Like any other gamble, tho, it might pay off or you might buy at the wrong time and lose money.
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i think its partly volume too, and the volatility actually helps imo. im no expect but if you remove the random aspect of it, it becomes predictable and a lot harder to make serious cash. just like for example roulette. but yes i again agree with all of what you are saying pretty much.
 
Just a point on the wastefulness of mining.

On the AMD livestream right now, Lisa pulled up some numbers saying 40% of the world's population plays computer games. Mining is wasteful, sure, but imagine what all those 40 million people could do if they didn't waste hours gaming! What could we achieve then?

Mining isn't the only thing in this world that is wasteful by a long shot.

We, humans, have literally no purpose. When you realise that, it doesn't matter what you do.
 
danlightbulb said:
Just a point on the wastefulness of mining.

On the AMD livestream right now, Lisa pulled up some numbers saying 40% of the world's population plays computer games. Mining is wasteful, sure, but imagine what all those 40 million people could do if they didn't waste hours gaming! What could we achieve then?

Mining isn't the only thing in this world that is wasteful by a long shot.

We, humans, have literally no purpose. When you realise that, it doesn't matter what you do.
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it isnt but we have to start somewhere and using excuses doesn't fix the problem does it? mining is a very easy target for people to use as you can clearly see the impact on the planet (energy charts etc). the problem is also in data centres, big corps, you name it its everywhere. we aint getting those ice caps back. not that many people care about that right now since people dont directly see it everyday on the news.
what have we lost as a planet since the industrial revolution 60% of wildlife, 70% of the icecaps, 60-70% of the worlds soils ability to absorb carbon to name a few. my numbers are likely wrong but its not far off.
mining only adds to those issues in a fairly big way.

its not hard to see why people get upset.ergh sorry i mean its because we cant buy gpus to game on :D:D
 
Doobedoo said:
Death and taxes. Your role in life is to become “productive citizens” or another brick in the wall. That being said some rare humans have done extraordinary things.
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Extraordinary things for what? Other humans. What has any human ever done that benefits something other than other humans or solved problems created by humans in the first place.
 
Doobedoo said:
Death and taxes. Your role in life is to become “productive citizens” or another brick in the wall. That being said some rare humans have done extraordinary things.
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I see it slightly differently. Our lives might be pointless, but we have a duty not to **** the bed.

That means not to destroy our home or negatively impact other life on the planet.

You don't have to find some higher purpose, you just have to have empathy for the environment, and a desire not to destroy it purely for selfish reasons.
 
danlightbulb said:
Which is fine but only works if everyone else does the same?
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No everybody has to decide to do something themselves.

Not everyone will. Some don't care.

If everybody blames someone else, or waits for someone else to take the lead, we'll never do anything.

Everybody has a choice to make, and must answer for their own actions.
 
FoxEye said:
No everybody has to decide to do something themselves.

Not everyone will. Some don't care.

If everybody blames someone else, or waits for someone else to take the lead, we'll never do anything.
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But the problem is that most people can't make a big difference to make a living from it. You can do all the right things but no food on the table. No, most people are worker ants and whilst that is true, you cant blame people for doing whatever it takes to better their lives. If mining is what can do that, then so be it.
 
I wouldn't really care if people wanted to self-indulge in some stupid libertarian fantasist's cyberpunk themed ponzi scheme if it weren't for the fact that collectively all those people doing it are now burning more energy than the entire sovereign nation of Switzerland - probably far more given this was in 2019 and now many more will be engaging with it as the price rises - when we've got a big climate problem knocking on our door.
 
danlightbulb said:
But the problem is that most people can't make a big difference to make a living from it. You can do all the right things but no food on the table. No, most people are worker ants and whilst that is true, you cant blame people for doing whatever it takes to better their lives. If mining is what can do that, then so be it.
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If 9 billion people make a change individually, that's a huge difference.
If only 8 billion do so, still a huge difference.
If only 1 billion make any change, it will still have an effect.

Additionally, people don't all reach the same conclusion at the same point.

People with old attitudes die, and a younger generation with different attitudes replace them.

People also respond to peer pressure and act with herd mentality. If the environment is pushed hard enough, some people will just go along with it, like pebbles in a stream, even if they don't really care.

But ultimately if you value money over all else then you *won't* make any change that impacts your wallet, unless forced to.

That's why I'm generally pretty pessimistic about the future.
 
FoxEye said:
If 9 billion people make a change individually, that's a huge difference.
If only 8 billion do so, still a huge difference.
If only 1 billion make any change, it will still have an effect.

Additionally, people don't all reach the same conclusion at the same point.

People with old attitudes die, and a younger generation with different attitudes replace them.

People also respond to peer pressure and act with herd mentality. If the environment is pushed hard enough, some people will just go along with it, like pebbles in a stream, even if they don't really care.

But ultimately if you value money over all else then you *won't* make any change that impacts your wallet, unless forced to.

That's why I'm generally pretty pessimistic about the future.
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Im not justifying the way it is, and I don't disagree at all with your points, I just have come to the conclusion now (probably too late in life), that nothing really matters. There is literally no positive or negative impact that we (humans) make to the world let alone universe. Even the arguments about us destroying the planet, well yes we are, but the planet will be here after we're gone, and eventually it will get absorbed by the sun. So it doesn't really matter does it.
 
danlightbulb said:
Im not justifying the way it is, and I don't disagree at all with your points, I just have come to the conclusion now (probably too late in life), that nothing really matters. There is literally no positive or negative impact that we (humans) make to the world let alone universe. Even the arguments about us destroying the planet, well yes we are, but the planet will be here after we're gone, and eventually it will get absorbed by the sun. So it doesn't really matter does it.
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Well there is a difference between leaving a desolate rock drifting in space, and a living planet teaming with a multitude of living creatures. A healthy planet, a living planet.

It just requires that people empathise with other beings. Both those alive today and those they will never meet (of the far-distant future).

If people just want to maximise their own pleasure in the ~70 odd years they personally are alive, that is somewhat sad, but understandable.
 
FoxEye said:
Well there is a difference between leaving a desolate rock drifting in space, and a living planet teaming with a multitude of living creatures. A healthy planet, a living planet.
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But why? Why does it matter? When the earth gets boiled by the sun, why does it matter whether the planet has been looked after or not? In the long term, what difference does it make?

I think having a healthy living green planet is great too, but Im under no illusion that ultimately, it doesn't make any difference.
 
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