Sold a horse, turns out he has cataracts and the buyer wants their money back

Sirrel Squirrel

Sirrel Squirrel

Sirrel Squirrel

Soldato
Joined
5 Aug 2003
Posts
8,535
Location
Essex
Just after a bit of legal advice here, I sold a horse the other day and to the best of my knowledge he had a clean bill of health, he had been in work for the 6 months I had owned him but I decided to sell him because he was a bit too short for me.

I was after a quick sale so a lady up north agreed to buy him after several email conversations and pictures were sent to her, she asked if she could have a vet check him out and I said that wasn't a problem but in the end she just sent for a lorry to pick him up and deliver him. A few days after she got him she decided to get him vet checked and this is when it was discovered that he had cataracts and since these take a while to develop he must have had them when I bought him 6 months earlier.

Now understandably this lady is very upset and she wants her money back but the sale agreement clearly states that the horse was sold as seen and that to the best of my knowledge he was healthy and I've been nothing but honest with her in my description of the horse.

Now the honorable thing to do would be to give her the money back but I don't have it and I don't know what has happened to the horse whilst it has been in her care. Have a look at the sale agreement below, does she have a leg to stand on (I've taken out the seller, buyer and horse details)?

SELLER Warrants
The SELLER covenants that he/she is the lawful owner of said HORSE; that he/she has the right to sell said HORSE; and that he/she will warrant and defend the HORSE against lawful claims and demands of all persons.
The SELLER makes no other promises, express or implied, including the warranties of fitness for a particular purpose unless further provided in this Agreement.
BUYER waives any claim for damage should the HORSE fail to meet the above warranties at the time of delivery.
To the best of the SELLER’s knowledge, the HORSE has no unsoundness or health problems on date of sale which would cause the HORSE to be unfit for regular training.
The HORSE is sold as seen
Disputes
Legal disputes shall take place and be governed by the laws of the UK.
Declaration
The BUYER and SELLER agree with the above Agreement of Sale and the total amount has been received by the SELLER.
Click to expand...

Here what was agreed in an email conversation.

Hello Buyer,

As per agreed in yesterdays e-mail the monies have now been transferred and
received in my account. I will now of course proceed with the arrangements
and load him on the lorry as per arrangements and agreement.

I trust this is all good.

Many thanks
Seller

-----Original Message-----
From:Seller
Sent:
To: Buyer
Subject:


Hi Buyer,


I can confirm as per our conversation earlier that the sale of "xxxx" has
been agreed at £xxxx with tack and rugs.

The sale of Black part bred TB standing at approx 15.1 (As per passport).

14years of age.

The horse is sound and good for work as to my knowledge. There are no defects
or vices known to me. He is fully functional for the
purpose he has been sold for as a schooling/hacking/jumping/ridden horse.

I can confirm that he has never been ill or lame in my care.

I will receive the monies due as direct transfer on the 11th December 2008.
to the account details below:

****

He will then be transported to his destination by a transport company
arranged by you.

I will of course enclose a signed agreement for the horse for this and hand
over to the transport attendant with his passport and microchip details.

I can confirm he comes shod and his teeth were done in october. His
vaccinations are up to date and the due date is May.

Many thanks

Seller
Click to expand...

She has threatened me with trading standards who are siding with me on this after I spoke to them and she also wants to sue me if I don't give the money back so I'm just trying to establish exactly where I stand.
 
This advice is not from anybody legally qualified and I take absolutely no liability to the result of any decisions made based on this advice.

From my (very) basic understanding of contract law, you are in the clear. By collecting to horse in knowledge that it had not been checked by a vet she would have accepted that the horse was sold as seen and waived any previous request that she wanted it checked by a vet first.

But even I wouldn't trust me. Go and see a solicitor.
 
Are you a registered trader or a private individual?

In your e-mail you say that the horse has never been ill in your care, however if she can prove the cataracts has developed over time when it was in your care, you may be liable for refund and other associated court costs.

If you are a dealer, you may find you fall foul of the distance selling regs.
 
skeeny said:
Poor horse :(
Click to expand...

Yeah, agreed with that, no-one wants him now :(

And you just know someone's gonna come along with that **** meme floor horse. It's rubbish. In fact, first person to post the image gets a kicking.
 
sod them. every horse owner nows you do not buy a horse with out a proper medical.
My sister had to pay for 3 medicals before finally buying a horse.

It is not something that will be obvious to you.
 
Would it be reasonably expected of you to notice a cataracts without a vets opinion?
Either way she does not have a leg to stand on, as Gilly put it Caveat emptor. :)
 
That is why people pay to have horse's vetted.

Her fault for skimping out on the cost.

Would you buy a car without even seeing it yourself first?

And there can be lots of problems or potential problems which a horse owner selling it may not be aware of which is even more reason to spend the money getting it vetted.

Unlucky for her but no sympathy.
 
Im no expert, but if you have e-mails of her saying she would send a vet, but never did. Then she does not have a leg to stand on. Sold as seen she did not make arrangements to do this.

Have you ever had the horse checked by a vet for anything. If yes did they ever look in its eyes. If yes ask the vet for a letter.

Just state to her that she chose not to send a vet as she said she was going to. And she never came to see the horse.

"The horse is sound and good for work as to my knowledge. There are no defects
or vices known to me." Are you a vet or qualified to check a horse.

So I wouldnt worry to much, just keep all your e-mails etc.

Wow 11 replys while I was typing, im slow. lol
 
mejinks said:
Are you a registered trader or a private individual?

In your e-mail you say that the horse has never been ill in your care, however if she can prove the cataracts has developed over time when it was in your care, you may be liable for refund and other associated court costs.

If you are a dealer, you may find you fall foul of the distance selling regs.
Click to expand...

ALthough I agree about the dealer stance, even if she can prove the cataracts occured over time, so long as a non professional could not be expected to have seen it then you will be fine.

It's like selling a car and next week the engine blows up due to a problem which occured over a long period of time. If it was running fine when you sold it and running fine for a week with the new owner, why should the previous owner be made to pay for it?
 
^^ Indeed Greebo.

To the OP, as said, did you get the horse checked recently at all? Eye wise or anything? Or something saying a vet looked at the eyes and nothing was wrong...

If you have anything stating that, especially if it is recent-ish, it will help you a lot I would have thought.
 
It isn't recommended that you treat it and if you did it'd be expensive but he'd never get his normal vision back. Cataracts in horses is very difficult to detect and it would usually only be detected by a vet as in this case. Obviously you'd know something was wrong if the horse was bumping in to things, was startled easily or stumbled a lot but I saw none of these signs when I had him so when I say there were no known defects that is true. Because he obviosuly hasn't totally lost his vision he can still be used for riding but it just needs to be checked every few months to make sure it hasn't gotten worse.

If I had the money to have him back and could afford stabling for him (bought a 3 year old to train up) I'd have him back, he was an excellent horse.

edit/ wow lots of replies, I'm not a dealer or horse professional and this was a private sale, when I bought him I did not have him vet checked as he was only £500 so wasn't worth the check as everything about him seemed fine and as said it is difficult for a non professional to spot cataracts in horses, it isn't obvious like in humans. He had been vaccinated by the vet a few times in my care but he was never actually checked over by the vet.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom