Sony 4D statement explained

Soldato
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A few years back at E3 crazy Ken spoke about Games being in 4D on the PS3! The worlds media and gamers kinda went huh? what is on about ! Well i was just having a sunday morning look about and saw this article
http://gamers-creed.com/?p=99
Its quite Sony biased (not why I posted it!), but it gives an insight to what 4D gaming is supposed to be about. Not sure about some of the facts giving in the article but like I said it least its been explained to a degree.

Does 4D exist? …………………………..Yes we live in a 4D world. Therefore it has to exist for us to be alive, here and now reading this thread.
What is the 4th Dimension?…………..The 4th Dimension is expressed as Space (here n now), proceeding through Time, in the Time Space Continuum.

Therefore time could be stated as 3D (height, width, depth) space always in motion within Time (aging, progressing in motion). In life, you are either dead or you are alive!

So 4D is the progression of Life through time.

If you run one of these videos of procedural 4D textures, and you pause it, it then becomes merely 3D. You can still manipulate it (zoom in, rotate it, etc in an editor), but the 4D doesn’t start until Kutaragi says it does. No! Just Kidding. Until you start the video again. Now remember these are just videos of 4D in action. Not 4D that is rendered live in Real Time.

What follows are some Procedurally Rendered Graphics videos. Nothing new in that we have been able to use this technique for some time. But they took sometimes days to render. So they were Dead 4D = 3D. hehe Until now we couldn’t render graphics like these in real time.

It’s not even that they can’t be rendered in real time by many platforms. It’s that some platforms still render these type of graphics very slow. The bottom two would be so slow on most platforms that it makes them not worth it. Now let me add that the bottom videos could be only rendered in real time, on two platforms today. High end PC’s and the PS3. This is one of the things that sets the Cell powered PS3 above most other HOME computing devices. The reason follows!

It has been said that the PS3 is like a mini render farm with it’s Multi-core Parallel Asymmetric cores. Many distinct computers on a chip. From this we can say the PS3, is the ideal platform for procedurally generated and rendered content. With around 2 TFLOPS of computational power the PS3 outclasses even most home PC’s for this task in rendering this kind of 3D and most assuredly the 4D content.

Check out the videos in the link i think it seems quite intersting idea. Not sure how this would/could be implemented in games,but didnt Fable do something like it with your main character? It sounds like it would have a use in RPG MMOs ie leave some food out and watch it go mouldy,
 
I'm sorry but the 4D explanation is a load of tosh.

Basically they're saying if it's pre-rendered it's 3D if it's rendered in realtime it's 4D? :confused:
 
PiKe said:
I'm sorry but the 4D explanation is a load of tosh.

Basically they're saying if it's pre-rendered it's 3D if it's rendered in realtime it's 4D? :confused:

Yeah thats what i thought but when you read into what i think it means is that all objects will age/decay with age ie in time. So with "4D" gaming the whole enviroment will be "alive" ie age in real time rather than be "dead" pre rendered. At least i know where this 4D business is coming from now, not that i can see how much or if ever it will be used in the current gen of consoles.
 
Surely if the 4th dimension is time, games have been 4D for ages?

Still, procedurally generated content is a pretty interesting idea.
 
my understand of 4D is as follows:

when i play tiger woods 2007 on my xbox360 the game is 3D.
yes the tree's blow and the leaves fall ect.
If the game was 4D then whilst playing the game (remember 4D when the video stops its 3D) if im experiencing 4D them tree's are going to age and the grass should grow.

so the benefits of 4d in my golf game is the terrain would alter over time giving me a different kind of experience over a set number of (years/days/months?) time scale.

would the user benefit form this? well im sure but why not simulate the growth of the golf course? am i really going to notice the difference.

another quick example is of a car rusting in forza motor sport 2. but this would take years surely and whats the point?
 
I think its a great idea and yes in the examples above in regards to a golf course and forza, yeah 4D wouldnt be much good - while my brain cant think of anything (no wonder one reason Im not a developer lol) much shorter time scale wise things could work well

Saying that it could be a load of marketing spin - but I have always thought the 4D idea was worth running with, it does make sense to me (if developers can get a handle on it)
 
I can see it an RPG for example you leave some food out on the table in a non 4D enviroment come back in a few days its the same. With a 4D game when you come back it will have started to go mouldy infact you could probably sit and watch it, same thing for plants/ flowers not look after. Something like this may have been done before but in this case if you could sit and watch it (paint drying!) and it would affect everything. Thinking about a bullet hole in a car would rust quite quickly in comparrison to the rest of the car so you would see a difference. It would be quite cool if a building that has been set on fire would burn initally then smoke/ smoulder for a while then the beams would start going black and eventually building would collapse this could be classed as 4D.
 
This "4D" use of technology would be very useful in golf and racing for weather ... for example on a real golf course when the rain comes on it tends to gather in parts of the course as puddles in hollows, run-offs etc which affects gameplay in real time ... this could be good fun.

The same would go for racing games ... standing water gathering creating tricky parts rather than just a shiny wet road.
 
SS-89 said:
So basically 4D in their terms is that the environment will age...

pffft don't buy it at all either. How does aging make something 4D. Loads have games have seasons/time. Yes it adds to the realism but thats all, its still 3D.
 
Nanoman said:
So adding 3D ageing characteristics to terrian is 4D?? Doesnt make sense really, but it would benefit games.
Well they're saying the 4th dimension is time, but games have always had time passing. I'm not sure you can make a game without the 4th dimension.
 
Nanoman said:
So adding 3D ageing characteristics to terrian is 4D?? Doesnt make sense really, but it would benefit games.

Without gettin bombarded with hate

Arent current games 3D? 3 Dimensions

And isnt Time a dimension?

So adding real time to games that are 3D...Should that then make them 4D?

Kinda makes sense lol
 
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