Space - is it infinite?

Dark_Angel said:
Feel like an attempt at a basic explanation, or perhaps nudge me in the direction of some reading material?
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I'll do better and post a picture.

galaxygrouphicksonarp50xg8.jpg


Each one of those swirling masses is a galaxy and our sun is at the edge of a galaxy. If you tooka space ship out into space you'd eventually run out of stars as you left the galaxy, but you'd eventually run into another swirling mass (of stars). By "space being infinite" I'm guessing you meant "running out of stars" as opposed to bumping into the edge of the universe? I don't know, I might be overly confused by your question. :p
 
Space is like a curved shape apparently, so yeh, you'd come back to where you started eventually, if you travelled in a perfect way, which wouldn't be possible and since space is expanding at an exponential rate, it may aswell be infinite.

also you could never reach the each, as the end has no position. How could you possibly define the edge of the universe.
 
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Our solar system --> Our Galaxy --> Other Galaxies --> Our Universe --> Other Universes(possibility) --> Nothing.

Starting in and working out. By "nothing" I mean althoug there is nothign there theres plenty of nothing to be filled. You go in a line and you keep going. You can arge that everything has to have a size then fair enough, but if it has a size then it has to have something outside it again so therefore it keeps going. Ofcourse theres no evidence to disprove anything, but the universe IS expanding and ISNT slowing down (yet) so therefore it seems most likley to continue as it is.

- Pea0n
 
p4radox said:
I've never understood what a multiverse actually is. I always thought that the universe encompassed everything in existence, so what's the need for more of them?

Unless the universe only contains the spatial and temporal stuff, in which case, what do the others contain?
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yeh i thought that the universe wasnt a place, but was a meme for describing all existence.

surely if these multi-verses exist then they are still "in" "the universe"?
 
I think it is "potentially" infinite but not "actually" infinite (according to scientific evidence).

In other words the universe can expand towards infinity but it will never actually reach an infinite size. If it was of infinite size than then the sky would be infinitely bright .... or something along those lines.
 
p4radox said:
I've never understood what a multiverse actually is. I always thought that the universe encompassed everything in existence, so what's the need for more of them?

Unless the universe only contains the spatial and temporal stuff, in which case, what do the others contain?
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A multiverse is a collection of universes. This is part of the theory of multi-dimensions.
 
rookie said:
yeh i thought that the universe wasnt a place, but was a meme for describing all existence.

surely if these multi-verses exist then they are still "in" "the universe"?
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It's all about time lines and dimensions.
 
Trying to understand everything in existence is human nature, sometimes you gotta hold up your hands and say "we don't know", although most people say "erm...God did it".
 
People find it very hard to comprehend "nothing" but thats exactly what happens at the edge of the currently expanding universe, there is .... nothing. What happens when you get there is anyones guess though.
 
Based on observation of the galaxies around us, which thanks to doppler effects we can tell are moving away from us (and eachother) the universe at least appears to be expanding. I'm not nerdy enough to know if there's actual proof it's expanding. :)

The other question is, of course, whether it will go on expanding ad infinitum or whether there is enough mass in the universe to exert a sufficient gravitational pull to eventually cause the universe to collapse back in on itself. The problem, as others have alluded to, is dark matter and exactly how much of it there is.

As to whether or not it's infinite, I'll just claim stupidity and go ask Stephen Hawking. :)
 
Berserker said:
The other question is, of course, whether it will go on expanding ad infinitum or whether there is enough mass in the universe to exert a sufficient gravitational pull to eventually cause the universe to collapse back in on itself. The problem, as others have alluded to, is dark matter and exactly how much of it there is.
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From what I have read the universe will expand forever, not sure how proven it is though.
 
Anyone else spot the contradiction in the opening line?
Some people say it isn't, but it is growing at a speed faster than light, others say it is finite, and other people just kinda shrug.
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how can something that is infinite grow?
 
Saying that there is an end to the universe where we cannot go any further is akin to saying that there is an end to the Earth where we cannot go further.
The Earth is finite, but a person travelling on its surface will never reach the end.

Space is similar, except a lot bigger and in more dimensions.
 
Dj_Jestar said:
Anyone else spot the contradiction in the opening line?
how can something that is infinite grow?
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How is it?

Picture a balloon.

Say to begin with it is this big (based on the tip to tip size)

:.................:

You expand it (it is a FINITE size, but you are simply adding air to expand it)

:...............................:

Now it is that big.

It is still not infinite, there is a limit to the size, but it is expanding.
 
Whenever I have thought about how big the universe is in the past, I always imagine a big black circle in a white area. When it expands to the size of the white area, my POV zooms out and it carries on expanding, over and over. I always feel like I need to "beat" it, and end up annoyed.
 
So if these other universes exist, and are in some way linked with multi-dimensions, then if we say space is infinite it can only be infinite within our dimensions/universe.

That doesn't sound too clear. Whether space is infinite depends upon our definition of infinite. If you take it to mean "without end" yet still accept the existence of other universes then our universe must end somewhere in order for another to begin.:confused:

edit: if anyone can understand what I've just written, congratulations.
 
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What if space is really not as big as we think it is and its an optical illiusion lol

Fact - What we see in the sky does not exsist... its a snapshop of how the universe looked billions of years ago ... what the universe is doing right now - who knows ... the light has not got to us yet or any time soon.
 
Dark_Angel said:
How is it?

Picture a balloon.

Say to begin with it is this big (based on the tip to tip size)

:.................:

You expand it (it is a FINITE size, but you are simply adding air to expand it)

:...............................:

Now it is that big.

It is still not infinite, there is a limit to the size, but it is expanding.
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You totally missed the point. The UNIVERSE is growing, but its is in no way like a balloon. The universe could be compared to it but not everything else. in order for it to be able to expand in the first place it must have something (nothing) to expand INTO.

- Pea0n

edit: imagine comparing it to a balloon in a box. You pump more air into the balloon and it gets bigger (expanding universe). Now eventually it will have to hit the box and thus cannot get any bigger. So were here with a dillema. 1 of 2 things can happen, the universe can either be constrained by the box and stay the same size, or as it happens there is no real box and it continues to expand. This leads us to the same answer. With or without the box there is still something (nothing) outside the "box" for it to either expand into or for the box itself to be contained in. If we assume the box has walls have an infinite thickness so nothing can be outside it as it HAS to be infinite, otherwise we could eventually "tunnel" through as you might say. If the walls were finite thickness then there would be something on the other side. Again both these answers lead us to see there is something/nothing outside the universe and therefore of infinite distance/size. If this isn't very clear I can try and retype and try and explain better.
 
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Pea0n said:
You totally missed the point. The UNIVERSE is growing, but its is in no way like a balloon. The universe could be compared to it but not everything else. in order for it to be able to expand in the first place it must have something (nothing) to expand INTO.

- Pea0n
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Um... I wasn't comparing it to a balloon, I was just using a balloon to explain something that is a certain size now, is finite, and is changing :p
 
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