Then you charge, or don't, as suits your circumstances. So do I. Charging for a couple of days, or whatever, preparing the quote is part of that. It's part of my qualifying process, avoiding time-wasters.
Sparky sent me an invoice for providing a quote
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Did you read my post? During my email correspondence before posting the mic I specifically asked them to tell me the cost of any work that would need doing before doing it.
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Comparing the specs for a new custom PC to the fixing of something is totally different.
You can quote for fixing something by just saying "I have worked out it will cost me X to fix", where speccing up a PC you have to send them the specs of it, otherwise they are going to be asking "Why does it cost that much, what does it come with? Blah blah blah.
You can quote for fixing something by just saying "I have worked out it will cost me X to fix", where speccing up a PC you have to send them the specs of it, otherwise they are going to be asking "Why does it cost that much, what does it come with? Blah blah blah.
Actually, in many cases, it's rather the other way round. It's pretty easy to spec up, and price up, a new PC. all you really need to know is what it's to he used for, and preferably, the approximate budget of the customer. Then you can spec the best hardware for that purpose, price no object, or the best for the specified purpose within the stated budget. But "fixing something" requires determining what's wrong with it in the first place. Until you start taking things apart, or down, it can be hard to be sure what's involved in fixing it.
An awful lot depends on the "project", which could be anything from replacing a washer on a dripping tap, to building a home extension, to building a bridge or a 60-storey skyscraper. On the washer replacement, I'd expect a pretty accurate estimate of time and cost from any half-competent plumber, after a one minute examination, or even over the phone. Good luck getting a fixed price quote for a 60-storey skyscraper.
However, if building a home extension, there are a number of ways of bidding for that kind of job, but a "quote" requires a careful assessment of work involved, potential risks like groundworks problems, materials required (which will depend on customers exact expectations), and as it's a fixed price, requires quite a margin of error to cope with the unforeseen. The more careful the examination pre-quote, the more time it takes but the more you can narrow down and/or eliminate risk, so the lower the risk padding element can be and the more apoealing, overall, the quote will be.
Clearly, OPs situation was more at the dripping tap end of that spectrum, and charging for that consult/quote was cheeky unless agreed in advance. But it all depends on the type of work being down, and the extent of it, because the risk element goes up exponentially as job size increases.
If the customer wants a quote, rather than a more open-ended time and materials bid, he is either going to be paying a large risk premium in a fixed-price quote, or there's going to be potentially extensive work involved prior to quoting, which takes time and, personally, I'm not doing unless it's paid-for.
Yes and your use of an exclamation mark suggests you were taken back by their decision to unrepair it. I don't see what other outcome there would be if they haven't been paid.
It is easy, but you are leaving stuff out.
I did write out like an a4 page of explaining why, but it's just blabbering on
Basically for a small island, with an economy that doesn't demand many customs PC's (average 2 built a week, 4 being quoted) and it not being my sole job (1 of 14 others) it's a very manual task. You talk to people in person, you have a nice chat with them, they often know nothing, a third of the time they don't listen and mess you around and waste time. I'm surprised how much we do get though, I'd figure everyone would go online....or here! 
I'd love to work for a company that had dedicated system builders but it does not exist here.
So I'm doing 15 jobs that most big companies hire 15 people for, but at a smaller volume - it's just chaotic and the biggest issue I have are other people wasting time I need to spend working.
Somewhat incorrect.
A quote is one thing, diagnostic work is another.
If you ask me
"Can I have a quote for a replacement waterpump"
You get the reply
"That'll be an hours labour @ £60, a waterpump at £35 and if You'd like me to do the cambelt while in there as I have to remove it to do the waterpump, I'll do that at no axtra labour but the belt is £20.
Total price if you wanted to go ahead with the work would be £115 inc vat"
That's a quote and nothing is chargable as I have done no work.
If however you have asked me to come round and diagnose a fault, I spend half an hour testing the cooling system checking for flow, checking thermostat, making sure fans work etc then I have done some work and it'll be £30 please!
This is diagnosis and you will be paying for it!
What I suggest the OP has done, is not ask for a quote as quotes can usually be done by comms only.
This guy has come round to investigate a fault, not do a quote IMO.
If when asked for a quote the tradesman said "I'll need to come round and drill a few holes, take some things apart etc" and the OP didn't think that it would be chargeable or didn't even ask whether it was, I think is a bit daft!
That being said, SOMEONE should have said it was chargeable before work commenced and any respectable tradesman should have done this, so yes, despite my main thoughts on it, I think the "invoice should not be paid as no charge was mentioned"
I cant just go fix something I see broken on a car and expect to get paid for it simply because it needed doing! Neither should this sparky.
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It centres around the guy not actually stating that he wants to be paid.
On top of that, the fact that it took him a while to get around to it, then sent an invoice when he realised he wasn't getting the job makes it look like the first guy realised he'd messed up and wanted to try and make some money back from it.
I wouldn't argue with that, but it's rather more a function of your somewhat unusual circumstances than the job of speccing a PC, in general.It is easy, but you are leaving stuff out.
I did write out like an a4 page of explaining why, but it's just blabbering on
I'd love to work for a company that had dedicated system builders but it does not exist here.
So I'm doing 15 jobs that most big companies hire 15 people for, but at a smaller volume - it's just chaotic and the biggest issue I have are other people wasting time I need to spend working.
In the same way, while I charge for quotes (but not a relatively brief initial visit, in most cases) many tradesmen, in many situations, wouldn't, and probably couldn't, if they want the work.
The point I'm making is that there's nothing inherently wrong with charging for a quote, provided the customer knows before you start any form of chargeable work, quote or otherwise, that it is chargeable and asks you, or me, to proceed on that basis.
Preparing a quote, including visiting premises, incurs time costs. Whether it's charged, or written off as a job-seeking overhead, is down to individual choice, provided the customer knows in advance, and has agreed to it, when the clock is ticking.
I have no problem with a customer that declines to pay for the time spent preparing a quote. They are very welcome to employ someone else.
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These are pretty much my thoughts on the matter, I've been a sparky for a good few years now. He came to look at a fault which imo is chargeable, but he has gone about it all wrong and I myself wouldn't be paying him either.
Keep the second guys number for future work
To the above posters saying that they charge for quotes in their industries is irrelevant. If you advertise your trade and mention that you charge £x for a quote then that's perfectly acceptable. If you don't mention that you charge for quotes then that's wholly unacceptable and likely bordering on the edge of illegal.
I think it's always a fine line to tread in deciding whether a quotation should be "1x Solution to your problem" or a detailed list of the parts that make up that solution.
I've always been of the opinion that most legit customers will want to know what your proposal is made up of, and the ones that take that list and buy the kit themselves weren't worth bothering with anyway. So yes, preparing a quotation could take half an hour of time, and you might not get the work, but that's a cost of doing business.
Actually visiting the customer and taking on a consultancy type position is totally different, and that time should absolutely be billed, though this would apply to something a bit more complicated than the job described in the OP.
I've always been of the opinion that most legit customers will want to know what your proposal is made up of, and the ones that take that list and buy the kit themselves weren't worth bothering with anyway. So yes, preparing a quotation could take half an hour of time, and you might not get the work, but that's a cost of doing business.
Actually visiting the customer and taking on a consultancy type position is totally different, and that time should absolutely be billed, though this would apply to something a bit more complicated than the job described in the OP.
Just ignore it and you probably won't hear anything about it again. Me mother had a job done and had to get the bloke back to fix his own snags and he had the cheek to send another invoice for that. It never got paid and that was the end of it. Just another scummy chancer.
Definitely don't pay it.
Though this thread reminded me that I once got charged by a pc company that 'diagnosed' my pc only to tell me they couldn't fix the problem. Was a £5 charge and I needed the hard drive, so paid it and took the drive out. This was years ago though and now I'm more computer savvy (or know how to google/ask on here
) I wouldn't take it there in the first place.
In fact 100% sure they either wouldn't charge me now I'm older, or I'd have picked it up and just walked off. But little 15/16 year old me was scared and they saw a chance to make a fiver. Never been back since lol.
Though this thread reminded me that I once got charged by a pc company that 'diagnosed' my pc only to tell me they couldn't fix the problem. Was a £5 charge and I needed the hard drive, so paid it and took the drive out. This was years ago though and now I'm more computer savvy (or know how to google/ask on here
) I wouldn't take it there in the first place. In fact 100% sure they either wouldn't charge me now I'm older, or I'd have picked it up and just walked off. But little 15/16 year old me was scared and they saw a chance to make a fiver. Never been back since lol.
Definitely don't pay it.
Though this thread reminded me that I once got charged by a pc company that 'diagnosed' my pc only to tell me they couldn't fix the problem. Was a £5 charge and I needed the hard drive, so paid it and took the drive out. This was years ago though and now I'm more computer savvy (or know how to google/ask on here
In fact 100% sure they either wouldn't charge me now I'm older, or I'd have picked it up and just walked off. But little 15/16 year old me was scared and they saw a chance to make a fiver. Never been back since lol.
I live near an indie computer shop that has been there since the late 90s. It closed down earlier this year. I suspect it was because no one goes to these places now as even the least computer savvy people are able to google problems and add extra RAM themselves these days.
He's still about out on postage, so just ignore him. I wouldn't bother complaining to Checkatrade either because they will turn a blind eye, as they only make money off charging tradesman a fee.
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It's paid-for if your quote is sufficient to win the business.
I avoid any business that wants to charge for a quote unless it requires reasonable diagnostic (ie, 'I have a weird intermittent noise in my car, please test drive it for an hour and take some parts out to work out what it is) work but then that isn't really asking for a quote, it's a stage above that.
Gathering quotes is part of the buyer decision making process - if your quote comes in on budget and you impress the client you have a reasonable expectation of winning the work.
If your quote has a charge attached to it, you can go away and offer somebody else a quote instead.
The costs involved in visiting a client and preparing a quote are just a cost of doing business - they are no different from the costs incurred in other lines of work where a product must first be advertised, or where a sales team must be employed, or whatever. A client is effectively inviting you to demonstrate how your company is the best choice for them. To charge for this is failure at the first hurdle in many peoples view.
I thought it was funny more than anything - that some guy was going to take the fixed mic apart and re-break it. I've never heard of that being done before.
The outcome should have been that they honoured my request to tell me the cost before going ahead with the repair.
Plus I would say as a matter of decent customer relations they may have tried to discuss the matter. The mic was barely used and died, they didn't seem to give a hoot about that, or longer term customer satisfaction etc. I won't buy one of their mics again, I'll advise others not to as they have the potential to crap out and repair costs are very high, and their customer service is below par.
I agree, and it's the point I've been making all along. Whether someone charges or not, and for what, is up to them provided the customer knows that they will be charged, and agrees in advance.
To everyone discussing quotes, I don't think this guy has tried to charge for a quote (which if made clear would be fine, if not wouldn't) I think he's tried to charge for his minimum rate (probably half an hour) for drilling this hole, which is completely abhorrent given that he left it in a dangerous state, not because of this work, but qualified sparkies are duty bound to make sure anything they touch/inspect is left in a safe state.