Spec me...a new boiler

[Angilion]

My central heating boiler is a bit broken again and I'm getting to the stage where I'm thinking I might be better off in the long run getting a new boiler. This one is ~12 years old and breaking down more often. I've spent ~£700 on repairs, mostly in the last few years, and repairing it is starting to look like a waste of money.

I don't have any spare money, but I can draw on the overpayments I've made on my mortgage. I'd rather not, but it's an option and it's cheaper than a loan. So I'm looking for long-term cost-effectiveness, which means buying good quality.

As far as I can tell, all the major companies are a rip-off. They won't even give me a quote without sending someone round to sell me as much as possible and I've seen no end of people online stating that they were quoted £2K-£3K to replace a boiler. Am I wrong about this?

I'm aware of the scrappage scheme, but I doubt if it will be of any use. My boiler doesn't appear on the official rating lists, but I expect it qualifies. However, I expect that the scrappage scheme will only be available through big companies, which appear to inflate the price by more than £400 anyway.

So...advice, please. I'm intending to hire an engineer to buy a boiler (it will cost them less than it would cost me, right?) and fit it on a parts+labour basis, but I have no idea what boiler to get them to buy or what a reasonable cost would be for labour. I've no idea whether it's a two hour job or a ten hour job.

Essentially, I haven't a clue.

 

[m4cc45]

Why not have the british gas homecare thing? Basically you pay £10-15 a month and they repair your boiler free of charge including parts.

Alternatively isn't there a boiler scrappage scheme coming in soon? They may inflate the prices a little but probably save a few quid.



M.

 

[Cyanide]

Worcester Greenstar. Usually £1-1500 for the boiler plus fitting but it's pretty much the best boiler money can buy

 

[Eddmac]

It's not totally simple mate.
Is it an oil boiler or Gas for example?
Is it a pressurised system or do you have a tank in your attic?
How old are your pumps?
How old are your radiators?
Has the system had rust inhibitor in it or not?

If you are lucky, you could simply buy a Gas condensing boiler for around £400-£600 and swap it straight in, with minor modifications, it will be more efficient, use less gas and actually save you money in running costs.

Heres an example http://www.screwfix.com/prods/44477/Plumbing/Boilers-and-Accs/Biasi-Riva-Compact-24HE-Combi-Boiler

 

[Cyanide]

Heres an example http://www.screwfix.com/prods/44477/Plumbing/Boilers-and-Accs/Biasi-Riva-Compact-24HE-Combi-Boiler

Not a great example when he's looking for quality that'll save money in the long run. That'll be dead within a couple of years. If you want quality stick to the big brands. Worcester, Baxi, Glowworm (to an extent, not their combis though), Vailliant. You'll pay more initially but you'll save in the long run with the longer warranties and the fact that they're made to a much higher standard and don't go wrong very often.

 

[Eddmac]

It was an example of price, to show how little he could pay, not a recommendation of what to buy.

Buderus, Ferroli, Potterton, Keston = All big quality brands also

Oh I forgot Veissmann, another quality brand

 

[V4NT0M]

Stay clear of isar just to be on th safe side.

 

[Cyanide]

Stay clear of isar just to be on th safe side.

The Eyesore?

Staying clear of Ideal in general is a much better idea

 

[V4NT0M]

The Eyesore?

Staying clear of Ideal in general is a much better idea

That's what I meant to say but it came out wrong =/

 

[HexElffilter]

My dad had a new combi boiler fitted in the house at the beginning of last year.
He did get British Gas to come out to give him a quote, and can confirm that his quote was over £5k, I was

We ended up getting a local plumber to fit a Worcester Bosch combi boiler, and he quoted around £2,200.
That was including a new gas fire and thermostatic controls on all but one of the radiators.

 

[a1ex2001]

All modern boilers without exception are unreliable cheaply made rubish, yes some might be slightly better but in a market of mediocrity the best doesn't need to be very good at all.

You will never save back the cost of the new boiler in bill reductions before it needs replacing so don't even factor this in.

Get a local independant to come round and quote, avoid the big names.

 

[Angilion]

Why not have the british gas homecare thing? Basically you pay £10-15 a month and they repair your boiler free of charge including parts.

Within limits. Obviously, they run that scheme to make a profit, so most customers will lose money on it.

Alternatively isn't there a boiler scrappage scheme coming in soon? They may inflate the prices a little but probably save a few quid.

Given how much they seem to inflate the prices, the £400 scrappage won't matter.

If the scheme applies to any boiler change from G to A rating, then it will save me money. If it only applies to changes done by approved companies, then it will probably cost me money because getting an engineer to fit a boiler apparently often costs a lot more than £400 less than getting a big company to do the same job. See HexElffilter's post for an example - the big name company added £3000 to the bill, so the £400 scrappage would still have left them £2600 out of pocket.

 

[Angilion]

It's not totally simple mate.

I was hoping it was, but expecting it wasn't.

Is it an oil boiler or Gas for example?

Gas.

Is it a pressurised system or do you have a tank in your attic?

No tanks. The whole lot was replaced ~12 years ago, with a then-new combi boiler fitted and the tanks removed, plus whatever else needed to be done.

How old are your pumps?

Probably the same age. Having said that, I don't know even know where the pumps are. I thought they were in the boiler.

How old are your radiators?

No idea. Why does it matter? Could I find out?

Has the system had rust inhibitor in it or not?

No idea. Could I find out?

If you are lucky, you could simply buy a Gas condensing boiler for around £400-£600 and swap it straight in, with minor modifications, it will be more efficient, use less gas and actually save you money in running costs.

I've looked at the realistic gas saving costs. They're not much. I'm more interested in the cost of repairs over time, hence looking for good quality.

Heres an example http://www.screwfix.com/prods/44477/Plumbing/Boilers-and-Accs/Biasi-Riva-Compact-24HE-Combi-Boiler

That's certainly cheap, but would it work out cheaper in the long term than a boiler costing twice as much? £400 is only two and a half flat fee repairs, so if an £800 boiler would require 3 less repairs over the years than a £400 boiler, the £800 boiler is cheaper in the long run.

A coworker had a Baxi boiler fitted by a local engineer for £800 parts and labour last year. I thought that was cheap, because it can't be that quick a job to change a boiler and £80/hour is normal for labour costs.

 

[Angilion]

Not a great example when he's looking for quality that'll save money in the long run. That'll be dead within a couple of years. If you want quality stick to the big brands. Worcester, Baxi, Glowworm (to an extent, not their combis though), Vailliant. You'll pay more initially but you'll save in the long run with the longer warranties and the fact that they're made to a much higher standard and don't go wrong very often.

All modern boilers without exception are unreliable cheaply made rubish, yes some might be slightly better but in a market of mediocrity the best doesn't need to be very good at all.
[..]

Well, that clarifies things

 

[ca9phoenix]

I had a Worcester combi fitted 7 years ago and other than a plastic bit falling off due to my ham fistedness it's been problem free, cost me 2.5k for a whole central heating system to be fitted, rads the lot and that was a local independent.

shop around but i's say go for Worcester/bosh

 

[Admiral Huddy]

Labours pledge is to give you money to change an old boiler.

The Torys pledge is to reinstate the married persons allowance which is effectively is the opposite to the above

 

[Kona*]

We had a Vaillant ecoTEC plus 831 w/ VRT 360f Wireless Controller fitted in December and I have to say, it's a beast. We pay £10 per month direct to Vaillant for a support contract; this includes overnight shipping of parts (pre 9am delivery) direct to our house and an engineer visit before the end of the next working day - it also includes a SIM card w/ data plan so we can control the boiler over the internet and they can remotely diagnose faults.

£2800 for the boiler, controller, 3 radiators and 6 thermostatic valves - it was a bargain compared to all of the other quotes

 

[a1ex2001]

We had a Vaillant ecoTEC plus 831 w/ VRT 360f Wireless Controller fitted in December and I have to say, it's a beast. We pay £10 per month direct to Vaillant for a support contract; this includes overnight shipping of parts (pre 9am delivery) direct to our house and an engineer visit before the end of the next working day - it also includes a SIM card w/ data plan so we can control the boiler over the internet and they can remotely diagnose faults.

£2800 for the boiler, controller, 3 radiators and 6 thermostatic valves - it was a bargain compared to all of the other quotes

So either they are expecting this brand new boiler to go wrong an awful lot or they are fleecing you? You wouldn't expect any other brand new appliance to need a permanent conection to home base and a monthly contract for repairs. Imagine if Dixons tried that next time you went in to pick up a new TV or cooker!

 

[Kona*]

So either they are expecting this brand new boiler to go wrong an awful lot or they are fleecing you? You wouldn't expect any other brand new appliance to need a permanent conection to home base and a monthly contract for repairs. Imagine if Dixons tried that next time you went in to pick up a new TV or cooker!

Well it's under warranty for 3 years (2yr manufacturer, 1yr extra from the installer) so we didn't need the support contract but I'm a gadget nerd so I had to have the internet control - the support contract is a bonus

 

[a1ex2001]

Well it's under warranty for 3 years (2yr manufacturer, 1yr extra from the installer) so we didn't need the support contract but I'm a gadget nerd so I had to have the internet control - the support contract is a bonus

So still they are fleecing you or they expect the boiler to fail, obviously you are of the opinion that they are fleecing you but you maybe surprised!

I wonder what else people can sell with utterly pointless internet control, maybe a camera in the fride to check the light goes out!