Speeding notice

[jpaul]

isn't the 14days just a reasonable period of limitations ... yes you could be prosecuted for a murder years afterwards, wiki leaks guy eluded his prosecution.

but, if its a regular route, you'd know if you had driven past a speed camera at 37mph No? everyone glances at the speedo ?

my money is on a date error, which they will correct ... are their responses delayed during covid ?

 

[smr]

Put it this way, when I drove to the shops this morning and drove back along the 30mph road in my village before the turning for my house, I looked at the speed of the cars passing, around ten cars passed by on the other side, I could visibly tell at least 8 of them were definitely going over 30mph.

 

[smr]

isn't the 14days just a reasonable period of limitations ... yes you could be prosecuted for a murder years afterwards, wiki leaks guy eluded his prosecution.

but, if its a regular route, you'd know if you had driven past a speed camera at 37mph No? everyone glances at the speedo ?

my money is on a date error, which they will correct ... are their responses delayed during covid ?

Well the last time I saw a mobile camera van was well before the lock down in March...

 

[jpaul]

Put it this way, when I drove to the shops this morning and drove back along the 30mph road in my village before the turning for my house, I looked at the speed of the cars passing, around ten cars passed by on the other side, I could visibly tell at least 8 of them were definitely going over 30mph.

I would think the radar and 'auto-drive' on teslas, could log telematics on the speed of approaching vehicles, potentially useful, in any prosecutions - an expert witness ?

 

[Nasher]

I would think the radar and 'auto-drive' on teslas, could log telematics on the speed of approaching vehicles, potentially useful, in any prosecutions - an expert witness ?

Nowhere near accurate enough. You would get readings all over the place trying to measure the speed of something else from a moving car.

 

[Frozennova]

Nowhere near accurate enough. You would get readings all over the place trying to measure the speed of something else from a moving car.

How do you propose all of the other technologies currently featured on cars like Radar guided cruise control and automatic braking work if you can't accurately measure the speed of an object from a moving car?

 

[Nasher]

How do you propose all of the other technologies currently featured on cars like Radar guided cruise control and automatic braking work if you can't accurately measure the speed of an object from a moving car?

They don't need to, they only need to know their own speed and the distance to things. All they do is process each frame as they come and follow a procedure depending on what's in it. Stopped or moving is no different to the AI.

 

[MagicBoy]

More Nasher opinion presented as fact...

 

[Frozennova]

They don't need to, they only need to know their own speed and the distance to things. All they do is process each frame as they come and follow a procedure depending on what's in it. Stopped or moving is no different to the AI.

Then calculating the speed of another object is very simple. If you know your own speed and you know the distance of the object you can track the speed of the other object too.

E.g: You are travelling at 100km/h or 27.7778meters/second

The distance between you and the car in front increases from 20 to 25 meters in one second you know that car is travelling 5 meters/second faster than you. Net result car in front is travelling at 32.7778meters second or 118km/h.

Not rocket science.

Edit: Then remember how fast even an Embedded processor in an ECU works and instead of calculating that once every second and it's being done every few milliseconds. Suddenly we have incredible accuracy as if by magic!

Also accuracy of describing

 

[Nasher]

Then calculating the speed of another object is very simple. If you know your own speed and you know the distance of the object you can track the speed of the other object too.

E.g: You are travelling at 100km/h or 27.7778meters/second

The distance between you and the car in front increases from 20 to 25 meters you know that car is travelling 5 meters/second faster than you. Net result car in front is travelling at 32.7778meters second or 118km/h.

Not rocket science

No, it's not that simple.

You can get an estimate, but unless the car coming towards you is on a perfectly straight and level roads you will get a false reading.

 

[Frozennova]

edit: nope im better than that

 

[Nasher]

Meh, can't beat stupid at it's own game

I think I just did.

 

[ezekial]

I would argue about the time scale for sure. Especially as the letter was dated so late it isn't like it was a postal problem.

 

[stoofa]

I'm hoping there is some follow up to this.
The police know the 14 day rule as well as anyone - Pepipoo have some anecdotal stories of NIP's turning up ridiculously late - almost as if the police found a NIP behind a filing cabinet 3 weeks later and decided to post it anyway, but rare and in most cases unsubstantiated.

You have to ask why did the NIP take so long to arrive. The only sensible explanations being that the OP is not the owner - the number of people over at Pepipoo who would swear on their mother's life they are the owner of the vehicle until suddenly the V5C shows a lease companies details etc.
Or for some reason the details on the V5c are incorrect - enough so that the NIP hasn't arrived at the correct destination.

If all the above checks out then slam dunk win for OP. Return the S172 with a covering note saying this NIP is outside of the 14-day rule. In most cases the ticket will be cancelled and if, for any reason it wasn't - you've got all the evidence you need.

 

[Mr_Sukebe]

If you drive for let's say 50 years, and you drove an average of let's say 15-20 thousand miles per year for work during those years, you're telling me that there would be at least one person who never went over the speed limit not even once in all those years? Not having that at all. Everyone has been over the speed limit at some point,whether that's 90 on a motorway or 33mph in a 30 zone.

Happy to debate this point.
When I was much younger, yep, I certainly did break the speed limit.
Then not only did I grow up and become a more responsible person/driver, but I also accepted that the roads have changed.
When I was 20, we had no speed cameras, 20mph speed limits didn't exist, and more importantly, the traffic was nothing like as bad and the level of road curtesy and politeness seemed to be significantly better.

What you now have his a scenario of far too many drivers acting in an incredibly impatient and impolite manner.
"Let someone out of a sideroad? You must be kidding".
Nope, drive like they're superglued to the vehicle in-front is the norm and I'm sure that many of the drivers on the road don't break the speed limit because they expect to get anywhere faster, rather they feel the need to follow the heard, lemming style.

What I've learned as I've got older is that breaking the speed limit invariably has NO benefit worth speaking of, as the driver breaking the speed limit simply ends up catching the driver queue infront of them faster. That means that you burn more fuel maintaining the concertina style of driving, increase wear on the vehicle and reduce the opportunities to be polite to other road users.

It's utterly counterproductive, as it sets the "selfish git" example to others and encourages it.
If drivers could just take a step back, chill a bit more, keep to the speed limit as often as is viable, the roads would be a far more pleasant place.

 

[Dis86]

Happy to debate this point.
When I was much younger, yep, I certainly did break the speed limit.
Then not only did I grow up and become a more responsible person/driver, but I also accepted that the roads have changed.
When I was 20, we had no speed cameras, 20mph speed limits didn't exist, and more importantly, the traffic was nothing like as bad and the level of road curtesy and politeness seemed to be significantly better.

What you now have his a scenario of far too many drivers acting in an incredibly impatient and impolite manner.
"Let someone out of a sideroad? You must be kidding".
Nope, drive like they're superglued to the vehicle in-front is the norm and I'm sure that many of the drivers on the road don't break the speed limit because they expect to get anywhere faster, rather they feel the need to follow the heard, lemming style.

What I've learned as I've got older is that breaking the speed limit invariably has NO benefit worth speaking of, as the driver breaking the speed limit simply ends up catching the driver queue infront of them faster. That means that you burn more fuel maintaining the concertina style of driving, increase wear on the vehicle and reduce the opportunities to be polite to other road users.

It's utterly counterproductive, as it sets the "selfish git" example to others and encourages it.
If drivers could just take a step back, chill a bit more, keep to the speed limit as often as is viable, the roads would be a far more pleasant place.

Agreed. Loads of lovely country roads near me but absolutely no point speeding because you'll either get caught or stuck behind Doris doing 35mph. Chill more and it's far more relaxing. Then overtake that stupid cow as soon as space allows.

 

[Mr_Sukebe]

Agreed. Loads of lovely country roads near me but absolutely no point speeding because you'll either get caught or stuck behind Doris doing 35mph. Chill more and it's far more relaxing. Then overtake that stupid cow as soon as space allows.

Another reason why my toy car is an MX5, i.e. a car that is fun/enjoyable to drive at sane speeds.

 

[SonicSW20]

I'm hoping there is some follow up to this.
The police know the 14 day rule as well as anyone - Pepipoo have some anecdotal stories of NIP's turning up ridiculously late - almost as if the police found a NIP behind a filing cabinet 3 weeks later and decided to post it anyway, but rare and in most cases unsubstantiated.

You have to ask why did the NIP take so long to arrive. The only sensible explanations being that the OP is not the owner - the number of people over at Pepipoo who would swear on their mother's life they are the owner of the vehicle until suddenly the V5C shows a lease companies details etc.
Or for some reason the details on the V5c are incorrect - enough so that the NIP hasn't arrived at the correct destination.

If all the above checks out then slam dunk win for OP. Return the S172 with a covering note saying this NIP is outside of the 14-day rule. In most cases the ticket will be cancelled and if, for any reason it wasn't - you've got all the evidence you need.

Sometimes its just bone idleness on the authorities part. A couple years ago a PCN (different laws involved) turned up from a local authority alleging that I had performed a prohibited right turn. In this case, the PCN must arrive within 28 days of the alleged contravention. This can be extended if the DVLA are late in supplying the local authority with keeper information, but this exemption only applies if the local authority applies for the information within 14 days of the contravention date. In my case, they applied for keeper details 27 days after the contravention date, and as such the PCN was illegally issued.
They're also a bunch of lying ******** - they rejected my initial appeal where I had appealed on the basis it was outside of the 28 days as at that time I did not have the DVLA access records. They rejected the appeal stating that the PCN was issued in full compliance with the relevant legislation, yet must have known the date they requested keeper information from the DVLA. Once I had the access records I took it to Tribunal, where the local authority did not contest it. Waste of everyones time.

 

[Nasher]

Sounds like pretty much every council :/

They are a bunch of chancers and once you question them on it they back off without even an apology.

 

[SonicSW20]

Sounds like pretty much every council :/

They are a bunch of chancers and once you question them on it they back off without even an apology.

In some ways I would have preferred them to try and fight the Tribunal case, at least then its a matter of public record and anyone else in a similar situation would be able to find my case and use it for reference.