Steam Subscriber Argeement
- Thread starter Tobes
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Man of Honour
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1. Retail boxes...
2. Offline mode. Heard of it?
3. Well it happens, but then usually there is an easy fix/remedy. It is not part of Steam's design.
Why are people so hostile towards one another on these forums, I've never seen somebody politely say 'Hold on good sir for I merrily disagree!' etc etc.
Its always sarcastic, hostile and rude awkward comments.
Silly posts attract such replies.
Nobody is forcing him into Steam purchases so why bloody whine about it?
WAAAAH STEAM SUXX0RZ
*Buys Steam game*
WAAAAH STEAM SUXX0RZ
*Buys Steam game*
WAAA... rinse and repeat.
Pointless.
Even ignoring the digital distribution issues online gaming (read - entitlement to play online/ownership of the game) is never like it once was.
Back in the day (TM) any serial key could be installed any number of times but only 1 person could play with it online at any one time. Now that's not the case. You either redeem your serial key onto a personal account and that is that or you have to do online checks against it and have limited activations.
Even without Steam, you cannot easily, if at all, sell on your ability to play online or in some cases - Install the game at all.
Steam isn't perfect but its the best at what it does, still it'd be nicer if everyone got along.
The whole industry we are discussing would be a lot better, if people weren't so out for themselves and desperate to get one over anything, whether its their competition or their customers, and focused more on quality and teamwork, it'd be much better.
Imagine if AMD, Intel and Nvidia all merged? No more hardware biasing, no more stupid competitions and lame, hyped up medicore, high price hardware.
Imagine if all the big named developers merged? No more lame, rushed titles, pathetic attempts at mimcry and downright underhanded business tactics.
That's livin' in a dreamworld, though. Cannot expect people to be that foresighted.
The whole industry we are discussing would be a lot better, if people weren't so out for themselves and desperate to get one over anything, whether its their competition or their customers, and focused more on quality and teamwork, it'd be much better.
Imagine if AMD, Intel and Nvidia all merged? No more hardware biasing, no more stupid competitions and lame, hyped up medicore, high price hardware.
Imagine if all the big named developers merged? No more lame, rushed titles, pathetic attempts at mimcry and downright underhanded business tactics.
That's livin' in a dreamworld, though. Cannot expect people to be that foresighted.
Will Steam be able to prove in a court of law that it's subscription based given that you simply pay a one off up front fee for each game? surely a subscription based service would be monthly or annual fees?
Steam are basically a retailer selling games but instead of handing over the product that people have payed for they're saying "we'll keep it but allow you to use it and we can take it away from you any time we want", I can't see the EU liking that.
Another thing, several games (ie. Skyrim) purchased physically in shops will not run without a Steam account, so as far as the game devs are concerned even if you buy the game physically you never truly own the game? the EU won't like that at all.
I don't see how Steam can argue it's rental when the price is often the same as retail and the product is identical, the only difference between Steam and buying the product in retail is that Steam are forcing a EULA on people saying that you don't actually own the game... and the EU court has ruled that they can't do that.
Steam are basically a retailer selling games but instead of handing over the product that people have payed for they're saying "we'll keep it but allow you to use it and we can take it away from you any time we want", I can't see the EU liking that.
Another thing, several games (ie. Skyrim) purchased physically in shops will not run without a Steam account, so as far as the game devs are concerned even if you buy the game physically you never truly own the game? the EU won't like that at all.
I don't see how Steam can argue it's rental when the price is often the same as retail and the product is identical, the only difference between Steam and buying the product in retail is that Steam are forcing a EULA on people saying that you don't actually own the game... and the EU court has ruled that they can't do that.
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Doesn't do any good, most games use Steam or another account based system.
See above.
Not the kind of service you would expect from one of the biggest online distribution systems?
Seriously I think a few posters are just trolling... I'd rather buy from GOG these days.
If any of those things merged we'd lost competition. Competition breeds innovation breeds excellence. If AMD, Intel and Nvidia merged we'd have absurdly high prices and no new tech.
You cant log on to steam without agreeing to the new agreement, so it is definitely out of order. Holding the account to ransom unless you agree.
That also makes its legality very dubious. You cant retroactively change thew terms of a contract. If they provided a system where: you could refuse to agree to the new terms, and lose the ability to buy new games, but still keep the old ones, that would be acceptable. But the current system would likely be overturned by any reasonable court if it ever got to one.
While i understand "buying a licence not a copy" thus the EU ruling does not apply blah blah blah.
I think that is bullpoo. They are just looking for terminology loopholes. And now they changed their agreement if you were to refuse to sign their new one. You would loose access to the games you previously purchased "access" to.
I think the EU should clarify what the payment actually entitles you to. And make it so when you purchase a game. You purchase 1 copy. Not just a licence to play it. All this game trading rules is going to be a pointless rule if nobody is abiding by it by changing the word copy to the word subscription.
I think that is bullpoo. They are just looking for terminology loopholes. And now they changed their agreement if you were to refuse to sign their new one. You would loose access to the games you previously purchased "access" to.
I think the EU should clarify what the payment actually entitles you to. And make it so when you purchase a game. You purchase 1 copy. Not just a licence to play it. All this game trading rules is going to be a pointless rule if nobody is abiding by it by changing the word copy to the word subscription.
Your insight is correct. Especially since the EU ruling being discussed actually directly addressed that, and said such terminology was indeed incorrect and was disregarded by the court.
No need for them to clarify it further. This is indeed exactly what this ruling said.
Why are people so hostile towards one another on these forums, I've never seen somebody politely say 'Hold on good sir for I merrily disagree!' etc etc.
Its always sarcastic, hostile and rude awkward comments.
its the effect of being hidden behind a computer and not real life
kind of like road rage im terrible i will scream,be aggressive and so on if someone does something wrong to me would i do that if not in a car(walking and so on) the simple answer is no..
the internet is great and all but some people use the anonymity to be just plain a holes others are just a holes
awaits the trolls
Awful idea.
If they merged there would be no competition, no innovation, and we'd be stuck with very expensive badly performing products.
Associate
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If all the big name companies in a market merged the quality of the products within that market would fall while the price would rise. It's competition that drives companies to make better products and affordable prices. That's why as the amount of small developers that get bought by large companies like EA rises, the quality of the games these developers have produced has fallen while prices have risen.
Caporegime
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Except that happens with retail games and you can't sell them on.
DOWII, can't sell it on, have to be on GFWL and Steam and I've had it unavailable before.
it makes me laugh all the people defending the EULA saying well its a contract blah blah blah, they could put in there that they can rape your wife and your mother, but if a court rules its illegal then they have to comply with the court, its only going to take one person to take this to the EU courts, and the whole you cant bring a class action clause was already deemed illegal in the US when sony did it, doesnt mean squat
It's pretty clever the way the entertainment industry has steadily brought in the "you only own the license not the software" thing to the point where people will actively defend it, but at the end of the day it's now crumbling after having been challenged legally. The entertainment industry may be able to lobby certain national governments to support their cause but the EU don't appear to like customers being stripped of their legal rights of ownership just because an item is virtual.
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I'm guessing the "User Generated Information and derivative works" is related to user submitted things such as items and maps, things like what we see in the TF2 workshop.