Taking DNA from birth

hurfdurf · 26 Sep 2013 at 12:51

TFleming said:
Really? Imagine a close family memeber being murdered and they had the killers DNA but it didn't match any in the database...

You're focusing on such a tiny part of what could happen. Is the 1 in a however many million chance of you getting arrested for a crime you didn't comit really the biggest concern here?

"It is better 100 guilty Persons should escape than that one innocent Person should suffer".

"It is more important that innocence should be protected, than it is, that guilt be punished; for guilt and crimes are so frequent in this world, that all of them cannot be punished.... when innocence itself, is brought to the bar and condemned, especially to die, the subject will exclaim, 'it is immaterial to me whether I behave well or ill, for virtue itself is no security.' And if such a sentiment as this were to take hold in the mind of the subject that would be the end of all security whatsoever"

hurfdurf · 26 Sep 2013 at 12:52

TFleming said:
You must be a 9/11 conspiracy believer? Some of these arguments are quite funny, as if the state is ran by robots destined and programmed to ruin the world... but... they can only do it with your DNA!

Whilst I think 9/11 truthers are some of the worst people on the planet, it is not unreasonable at all to not trust the current or future governments.

AdladUK · 26 Sep 2013 at 12:56

TFleming said:
You must be a 9/11 conspiracy believer? Some of these arguments are quite funny, as if the state is ran by robots destined and programmed to ruin the world... but... they can only do it with your DNA!

Yeah sure buddy, whatever you say :rolleyes:

Typical counter argument by a troll. Take a valid post and respond to it with an extreme accusation (of which it has no relevance) and totally fail to actually mention any of the points raised. Well done!

AdladUK · 26 Sep 2013 at 12:58

hurfdurf said:
Whilst I think 9/11 truthers are some of the worst people on the planet, it is not unreasonable at all to not trust the current or future governments.

Some of the worst people on the planet? Really? So you compare someone who thinks 9/11 was an inside job with a child molester, rapist, murderer, war criminal etc?

I have no belief in 9/11 being an inside job, but perhaps you should think a little more before you type?

hurfdurf · 26 Sep 2013 at 13:09

AdladUK said:
Some of the worst people on the planet? Really? So you compare someone who thinks 9/11 was an inside job with a child molester, rapist, murderer, war criminal etc?

I have no belief in 9/11 being an inside job, but perhaps you should think a little more before you type?

Yup, the voluntary stupidity is offensive to human kind. We will have monsters like you have mentioned and the occasionally mentally ill person, but to willfully take advantage of something like 9/11 to profit and take advantage of people is disgusting.

AdladUK · 26 Sep 2013 at 13:12

hurfdurf said:
Yup, the voluntary stupidity is offensive to human kind. We will have monsters like you have mentioned and the occasionally mentally ill person, but to willfully take advantage of something like 9/11 to profit and take advantage of people is disgusting.

How did you make the link between people who believe 9/11 was an inside job with taking advantage of others and profiting?

I'm willing to bet most people who say 9/11 was staged probably don't make a single penny from that opinion (of which they are fully entitled to have)

AdladUK · 26 Sep 2013 at 13:15

My God man! You have an entire industry (the industrial military complex) in all it's glory making countless billions at the cost of untold innocent lives and you're worried about a tiny majority of people who trust their cats more than their governments. Wake up!

TFleming · 26 Sep 2013 at 13:15

AdladUK said:
Yeah sure buddy, whatever you say

Typical counter argument by a troll. Take a valid post and respond to it with an extreme accusation (of which it has no relevance) and totally fail to actually mention any of the points raised. Well done!

Becuase what you wrote isn't worth replying to because it's so absurd. But if you insist.

First of all, who cares if 90% of CCTV footage isn't used? Does it really impact on your life? When does being caught on a CCTV camera impact on your life? I can't think of one negative occasion where CCTV has been involved.

Forced vaccinations of what? Really, even if this were to happen, what on Earth do you think they're going to inject you with?! It would be for your own benefit if it were to ever happen. I bet you're not complaining about children having to have preventative injections?

Do you think the government secretly look into all your conversations becuase they're so juicy and useful to them? No, they will never have even read one of your e-mails or listened to one of your phonecalls. Just how much time and resources do you think they posses? Really you need to stop watching CSI and Homeland and wake up. I've never heard such outlandish and illinformed claims.

hurfdurf · 26 Sep 2013 at 13:18

Did you miss how the NSA was reading everyone's emails and how staff members were repeatedly caught spying on family members and love interests?!

Even without that, look how often police officers are caught abusing their power to invade the privacy of people they are personally interested in.

TFleming · 26 Sep 2013 at 13:21

hurfdurf said:
Did you miss how the NSA was reading everyone's emails and how staff members were repeatedly caught spying on family members and love interests?!

Even without that, look how often police officers are caught abusing their power to invade the privacy of people they are personally interested in.

And just what percentage of people do you think this happens to?

Do you think a vast minority of misuse outweighs the positives that come from it? Preventing terrorist attacks, for example.

hurfdurf · 26 Sep 2013 at 13:25

TFleming said:
And just what percentage of people do you think this happens to?

Do you think a vast minority of misuse outweighs the positives that come from it? Preventing terrorist attacks, for example.

"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

AdladUK · 26 Sep 2013 at 13:26

TFleming said:
First of all, who cares if 90% of CCTV footage isn't used? Does it really impact on your life? When does being caught on a CCTV camera impact on your life? I can't think of one negative occasion where CCTV has been involved.

You might not care about being recorded 300 times a day, or how the police have wasted hundreds of millions on a system that is 90% useless (when they could have used that money in far more productive ways), but others do.

TFleming said:
Forced vaccinations of what? Really, even if this were to happen, what on Earth do you think they're going to inject you with?! It would be for your own benefit if it were to ever happen. I bet you're not complaining about children having to have preventative injections?

Great! Forced vaccination by the government will be for my benefit? Who knew! Really nothing to say to that mentality.

TFleming said:
Do you think the government secretly look into all your conversations becuase they're so juicy and useful to them? No, they will never have even read one of your e-mails or listened to one of your phonecalls. Just how much time and resources do you think they posses?

This statement just shows how clueless and narrow minded you are on the issue.

Firstly, I'm not selfish enough to think it's just about me. There are untold ramifications by giving someone a window into any person's life they so desire.

It's not just the general populous, it's people in power, people with the ability to make decisions, now with a severe vulnerability because of the actions they decide to take in their private lives.

Secondly, you give this South Park like notion that the NSA has thousands of people in a room listening to individual calls. No, they have rooms and buildings FULL of computers running millions of calculations a second filtering this information, building a full timeline of as many people as they like. And then when they please, or when someone becomes of interest to them, they go and pick up that data and analyze it.

TFleming said:
Really you need to stop watching CSI and Homeland and wake up.

Only show I watch is Boardwalk Empire

dirtychinchilla · 26 Sep 2013 at 13:28

Bootlegging isn't really an issue any more.

AdladUK · 26 Sep 2013 at 13:30

TFleming said:
Do you think a vast minority of misuse outweighs the positives that come from it? Preventing terrorist attacks, for example.

You really are a brain washed fool that just laps up what his daddy the government tells him. Good luck man, you'll need it!

TFleming · 26 Sep 2013 at 13:30

hurfdurf said:
"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

Quote Franklin all you like, the world is a completely different place to what it was in the 1700s. I don't see how giving our DNA is giving up essential liberty?

Schlong&Stable · 26 Sep 2013 at 13:32

AdladUK said:
You might not care about being recorded 300 times a day, or how the police have wasted hundreds of millions on a system that is 90% useless (when they could have used that money in far more productive ways), but others do.

But WHY do they care? If they have a rational reason, then it is a fair comment. If the argument is just 'mah libartyy!!!' then these people should be ignored.

Great! Forced vaccination by the government will be for my benefit? Who knew! Really nothing to say to that mentality.

Vaccination only works if everyone is vaccinated. If someone is not, then it means we're all vulnerable. Vaccination should absolutely be forced.

I don't want to die because of 'mah libartyy!!!'

This statement just shows how clueless and narrow minded you are on the issue.

Firstly, I'm not selfish enough to think it's just about me. There are untold ramifications by giving someone a window into any person's life they so desire.

It's not just the general populous, it's people in power, people with the ability to make decisions, now with a severe vulnerability because of the actions they decide to take in their private lives.

Well if you're so clued in, you can surely give some meaningful examples.

Secondly, you give this South Park like notion that the NSA has thousands of people in a room listening to individual calls. No, they have rooms and buildings FULL of computers running millions of calculations a second filtering this information, building a full timeline of as many people as they like. And then when they please, or when someone becomes of interest to them, they go and pick up that data and analyze it.

And...?

hurfdurf · 26 Sep 2013 at 13:32

TFleming said:
Quote Franklin all you like, the world is a completely different place to what it was in the 1700s. I don't see how giving our DNA is giving up essential liberty?

Right to privacy is a pretty important liberty m8.

TFleming · 26 Sep 2013 at 13:35

hurfdurf said:
Right to privacy is a pretty important liberty m8.

And would you say now that we're more free or less free to do what we please and get on with things without interference than we were 100 years ago, all things considered? And what difference does that make to our quality of life?

Schlong&Stable · 26 Sep 2013 at 13:36

hurfdurf said:
Right to privacy is a pretty important liberty m8.

The right to privacy does not necessarily include your DNA, especially when you shed it all over the place.

AdladUK · 26 Sep 2013 at 13:36

Thompson_NCL said:
And...?

I honestly don't have the time to debate with another narrow minded, brain washed ninny.

You make no valid points whatsoever, other than we should just accept what the government tells us and everything they do is for our benefit, be it constant surveillance, forced vaccinations, or total withdrawal of personal liberties.

Have fun living in that World.