Telephone socket - Need advice *PICS*

[panyan]

Basically we have two telephone lines to the house:

1) used for calls etc

2) used for the internet ONLY

the second line (internet) comes through the wall in my parents room, and then into my room where we have a telephone socket

i thought that the socket in my room was the master socket

Anyway, wind up the story and now my mother wants to redecorate her room and asked if the telephone socket in her room could be removed as it is no longer needed

now i thought that the telephone socket in her room has nothing to do with the internet so i initially said yes... but then i sent and had a look...

It looks to my untrained eye that what the guy has done is to split open the second telephone line and wire it so that both the telephone lines ring on that phone

now the problem is - can anyone shed some light on this as my mother wanted to completely remove the box as we dont use a telephone in that socket any more (but we still need the secondary cable intact for internet)

 

[Tealc]

Looks like a pretty old socket. I assume that's a master because of the ringing capacitor and resistor in the body. It also has the cable joins that BT always use. It looks like your secondary line, as you call it, may just be an extension off pins 2 and 5 of the connector.

So if you were to remove this socket you'd lose your whole telephone line and BT would charge you to fix.

 

[johnyt]

The master socket should be the one where the drop wire from the telegraph pole terminates. The sokect in your picrure is not a nt5e master socket and looks a complete mess.

If that socket is where the main line comes in you can really remove it on your own. You would need a BT engineer to move the dropwire so it comes in somewhere else.

If you do have 2 seperate lines coming in to the building the best practice would be to have a seperate nt5e socket for each

 

[panyan]

Looks like a pretty old socket.

the primary line was installed 30 years ago

the secondary line for internet is about 10 years old

the socket in the photo is 30 years old, the socket connected in my room (on the secondary line) is the newer nt5e socket

I assume that's a master because of the ringing capacitor and resistor in the body. It also has the cable joins that BT always use. It looks like your secondary line, as you call it, may just be an extension off pins 2 and 5 of the connector.

so pins 2 and 5 are for calls, so the internet is along which pins?

So if you were to remove this socket you'd lose your whole telephone line and BT would charge you to fix.

which line would I lose? both lines?

thanks Tealc

The master socket should be the one where the drop wire from the telegraph pole terminates. The sokect in your picrure is not a nt5e master socket and looks a complete mess.

the socket is 30 years old, were nt5e sockets used back then?

the secondary line goes to a socket in my room which is an nt5e socket

If that socket is where the main line comes in you can really remove it on your own. You would need a BT engineer to move the dropwire so it comes in somewhere else.

that is where the secondary line comes into the house but i dont think it is where the primary line comes into the house

If you do have 2 seperate lines coming in to the building the best practice would be to have a seperate nt5e socket for each

and a BT Engineer would have to do this for me correct?

thanks john

 

[johnyt]

Might be worth going outside/in the loft (maybe) and seeing where the cables from the telegraph pole come into the house. Those cables in the pics are a right birdsnest so its hard to clearly see whats connected to what from here. But yeah its a BT engineer job if you want to change anything thats attached to a drop wire I'm afraid.

 

[Tealc]

Pins 2 and 5 are for voice and internet.

If you have an NTE5 socket in another room and you do have two physical lines coming into your house then disconnecting this one shouldn't affect your internet.

So you pay for two lines?

 

[panyan]

Might be worth going outside/in the loft (maybe) and seeing where the cables from the telegraph pole come into the house. Those cables in the pics are a right birdsnest so its hard to clearly see whats connected to what from here. But yeah its a BT engineer job if you want to change anything thats attached to a drop wire I'm afraid.

i have actually just been having a look:

It seems that the secondary line does come into the house there, so the socket in the picture is the primary socket for that line

but the primary line has its primary socket elsewhere in the house, the socket in the photos is an extension of that primary line

(confusing or what )

So basically what we want to do is:
- remove that primary line extension cable and socket (as seen in the photo)
- patch the secondary line so that the master is in my room (is that correct?)

Pins 2 and 5 are for voice and internet.

If you have an NTE5 socket in another room and you do have two physical lines coming into your house then disconnecting this one shouldn't affect your internet.

So you pay for two lines?

yes, two lines coming into the house (long story )

but how would i know if the socket in my room is a master socket?

if i remove the socket in the photo:
- remove socket and primary line extension cable
- id have to patch up the secondary cable
- and replace the socket in my room with a "master" version?

 

[johnyt]

Is the secondary line the one thats terminated with those 2 grip connectors rather than on the face plate? Could be that its just connected there then cabled off to that other socket you mentioned.

So you have 2 drop wires coming into the back of the socket. 1 of them is conected to the face plate of that socket and also runs another socket juntioned from there

The other drop wire is not actually anything to do with that socket but juts has its terminations leading to another socket insdie there to be tidy.

This is my best guess of whats going on there but as to what lines is going where exactly only you or some one visiting you home with a bit of knowhow can find out.

If you remove that socket in the bedroom and patch it up then that would be a bit of a bodge job. Really if that socket has to be removed completly you'll have to get a BT engineer to move the 2 drop wires.

 

[panyan]

Is the secondary line the one thats terminated with those 2 grip connectors rather than on the face plate? Could be that its just connected there then cabled off to that other socket you mentioned.

I dont know, are those brown things the grip connectors?

So you have 2 drop wires coming into the back of the socket. 1 of them is conected to the face plate of that socket and also runs another socket juntioned from there

Nope, three drop wires into the back of the socket, nothing is connected in the faceplate (the angle of the photo makes it look different)

The other drop wire is not actually anything to do with that socket but juts has its terminations leading to another socket insdie there to be tidy.

This is my best guess of whats going on there but as to what lines is going where exactly only you or some one visiting you home with a bit of knowhow can find out.

If you remove that socket in the bedroom and patch it up then that would be a bit of a bodge job.

yep

Really if that socket has to be removed completly you'll have to get a BT engineer to move the 2 drop wires.

that fine, i just wanted to understand whats going on before i do anything

 

[johnyt]

A drop wire is the wire coming in from the telegraph pole any other wires conected to that socket is known as an extension so you actually have 2 drop wires and 1 extension wire.

There is clearly 2 cables connected on that faceplate in the 2nd pic

Those 2 brown things on the top left of the socket are grip connectors, they might well be known professionally as something else but it escapes my memory what that is at the moment

 

[panyan]

A drop wire is the wire coming in from the telegraph pole any other wires conected to that socket is known as an extension so you actually have 2 drop wires and 1 extension wire.

right, ok, ive got that bit

There is clearly 2 cables connected on that faceplate in the 2nd pic

so either line would ring on a phone connected to that faceplate?

Those 2 brown things on the top left of the socket are grip connectors, they might well be known professionally as something else but it escapes my memory what that is at the moment

and those are meant to be terminated in the faceplate not in the grip connectors - is that right?

 

[johnyt]

Well in an ideal world it would be better to not use those grip connectors and have it terminated right onto an NT5e socket if indeed a dropwire is whats connected to them. But if you open up a bt cabinet you'll see a load of those grip conectors and they do look like the propper ones at least. Again it looks like it was done like that to keep thinngs looking tidy.

 

[johnyt]

yes both phone lines conected to that face plate would ring. well any phone conected to that socket in the picture and any one thats conected to where ever that other cable junctions off to from the faceplate

 

[Deleted member 77746]

It just looks like a normal extension to me. I'm fairly sure it can be just cut. Put a phone into each socket and see if you get a dial tone. That would indicate they are just normal extensions.

EDIT: Unless they are both lines going outside.

 

[johnyt]

Just looking back Tealc made a good point are you paying for 2 seperate lines? it might be case that you only have 1 drop wire and 2 extensions. 1 of the the extensions maybe routed back outside the houes and back in to another room rather than pulling up floorboards or messing about in the loft.

But if you are paying for 2 seperate lines eveything we have discussed still rings true

 

[panyan]

Well in an ideal world it would be better to not use those grip connectors and have it terminated right onto an NT5e socket if indeed a dropwire is whats connected to them. But if you open up a bt cabinet you'll see a load of those grip conectors and they do look like the propper ones at least. Again it looks like it was done like that to keep thinngs looking tidy.

right, ok

yes both phone lines conected to that face plate would ring. well any phone conected to that socket in the picture and any one thats conected to where ever that other cable junctions off to from the faceplate

right, im getting it now

It just looks like a normal extension to me. I'm fairly sure it can be just cut. Put a phone into each socket and see if you get a dial tone. That would indicate they are just normal extensions.

EDIT: Unless they are both lines going outside.

one line does outside, the other is an extension

Just looking back Tealc made a good point are you paying for 2 seperate lines? it might be case that you only have 1 drop wire and 2 extensions. 1 of the the extensions maybe routed back outside the houes and back in to another room rather than pulling up floorboards or messing about in the loft.

But if you are paying for 2 seperate lines eveything we have discussed still rings true

yep, two different lines, two bills etc etc

 

[johnyt]

On a closer look there only seems to be one black & green wire termination (usual drop wire colours) though a bit hard to see to be 100% sure. CAn you have a look and see if its the case that the black and green wires are terminated with the grip connectoers and these then feed the faceplate?

EDIT* juts saw your reply about 2 seperate bills so yeah as before then lol

 

[Deleted member 77746]

yep, two different lines, two bills etc etc

So why not cancel one line then pull the cable back through and leave it bundled next to the other box for now? At least you can remove the box from the room.

 

[johnyt]

The drop wires BT's propery it's against their T's&C's to adjust it yourself.

 

[panyan]

CAn you have a look and see if its the case that the black and green wires are terminated with the grip connectoers and these then feed the faceplate?

ill try and open it up later

So why not cancel one line then pull the cable back through and leave it bundled next to the other box for now? At least you can remove the box from the room.

we use both lines