Texas air show crash

[Terminal_Boy]

It's usually highly experienced pilots flying these warbirds, with decades of experience. That also can make then fairly old though, so I would put it down to pilot error, not a malfunction.
Names and pictures of the crews released now. The Kingcobra pilot had been flying for the airlines since 1982 and had over 34000 hours.

Bit of a difference between flying a single seat fighter and flying a 737 etc.

For a start, airliners don’t fly in formations or close to other aircraft. ATCs start yelling at them if they get within miles of each other on converging tracks.

 

[Uther]

Bit of a difference between flying a single seat fighter and flying a 737 etc.

For a start, airliners don’t fly in formations or close to other aircraft. ATCs start yelling at them if they get within miles of each other on converging tracks.

That's true, but the vast majority of warbird pilots seem to also be airline pilots.

 

[ci_newman]

Some new high-res photos have been released today showing the pilots in the bomber cabin were alive and clinging on outside the windows prior to hitting the ground I was hoping they died in the initial impact and didn't know their fate

 

[Harlequin]

The airboss on a carrier is a completely different thing to one at a private airshow - I've watched the video and had a quick google and I can find nothing to suggest an airboss at that kind of show has to have any kind of ATC qualification or has any legal authority to issue clearances or instructions. A better analogy would probably be the conductor at an orchestra. When the narrator in the video states the airboss gives an instruction to do this that or the other, that instruction, as far as I am aware this is simply guidance and comes with no authority.

As I said - we have ATC guys on this forum, hopefully one will come along and clear that up.

Investigation underway over midair crash at Dallas air show

Transportation investigators are trying to determine why two historic military planes were seemingly in the same place at the same time just before they collided at a Dallas air show, killing six people

abcnews.go.com

Air shows must obtain special waivers from the FAA and all of the pilots have to demonstrate their skills in low flying and other maneuvers used in air shows, said John Cox, a former airline captain with more than 50 years’ experience. Cox is also founder of Safety Operating Systems, a company that helps smaller airlines and corporate flight services from around the world with safety planning.

Each air show is overseen by an air boss, Cox said.

“If there’s any adjustments that have to be made, it’s the air boss that makes those calls and the pilots comply with that,” he said. In addition, any pilot with a mechanical problem would announce it to the air boss, he said.

Different role and terminology

from another company -

Multi-Venue Airbosses -

David Schultz Airshows has FOUR FAA Recognized Multi-Venue Airbosses on staff for airshows worldwide. Trust David Schultz Airshows as we have true international experience, have worked with all the Major Jet Teams, single ship tactical demo teams, and major parachute… Read More Multi-Venue Airbosses

schultzairshows.com

 

[Zenduri]

Some new high-res photos have been released today showing the pilots in the bomber cabin were alive and clinging on outside the windows prior to hitting the ground I was hoping they died in the initial impact and didn't know their fate

surely not, It was 3 seconds from the in air crash to the plane hitting the ground. They wouldnt have even realised what happened before it was all over

 

[Jokester]

3 seconds is more than enough time to realise you’re going head first into the ground at 200mph.

 

[imtoooldforthis]

definitely enough time to realise you are screwed

 

[ci_newman]

surely not, It was 3 seconds from the in air crash to the plane hitting the ground. They wouldnt have even realised what happened before it was all over

I'm not going to link the photos, but they are easily found if you want to look for them

 

[OspreyO]

Bit of a difference between flying a single seat fighter and flying a 737 etc.

For a start, airliners don’t fly in formations or close to other aircraft. ATCs start yelling at them if they get within miles of each other on converging tracks.

I've no idea what point you're trying to make.

If someone is flying a warbird they would have been chosen for their experience with that type of aircraft. That pilot has experience on (North American T-6 and P-51 Mustang, Bell P-63 and P-39, Curtiss P-40 Warhawk) then a vast amount of commercial experience. Vastly experienced pilot and some 13yrs with the Commemorative Air Force alone.

 

[OspreyO]

He`s also not 100% correct ; whilst the pilot flying is in charge in the air, an aircraft hitting the ground is the end of a chain of events. The video above makes a very good point - 500 feet, with zero altitude separation leaves no margin for any errors. Wheres the escape route in case of emergency? It would have been under the B17, which at 500 feet isnt going to happen. The airboss cleared the 3 aircraft, 2 P51`s and the P63 to overtake the B17 and fly ahead; the P63 did this in a turn and at a much higher speed than the B17. Did the P63 lose situational awareness? Yes. However safety minimums were not accounted for and would have been discovered in the practise, which was cancelled.

From watching the video and reading the comments below it. It would seem the air plan and instructions were flawed and put the pilots in a poor position relative to each other, and in doing so breaking formation flying principle's. Which caused the B17 and P63 to lose sight of each other, bit like the blind spot in a car/truck. By the time the crews realised there was an issue it was too late to react to it. The default is always pilot error. But you'd have to say poor planning of the formation was a strong contributory factor.

 

[Scougar]

Watched the footage. OMG. There was no-way to come back from that. Plane slams into bomber right at the junction of the hull and the wings, completely slicing off everything behind the wings. 3 seconds and it was on the floor. Horrific. Absolutely awful.

 

[Flibster]

Seen a couple of clips of this. It's not good.

Very much looks like the P63 pilot lost sight of the B17

 

[Harlequin]

 

[Harlequin]