the £1000 conundrum

Fr0dders · 9 Sep 2007 at 20:23

i really dont know what to do

ive got the best part of a grand to spend on a 40" Telly, and to be truthfull, i cant find a TV that i know ill be happy with for this price.

The new Samsung F86 is 1080p / 100hz / 24p with USB slot for media playback. On paper the spec is brilliant, but the first few owners are experiencing quality problems, and several remarking the 100hz is pointless and doesnt work

i would get the M86, but thats got just as many bad reviews citing poor viewing angles , poor RGB scart performance and poor colour reproduction

i would probably be happy with the Sony 40 X3000 / X3500 but they're at least twice my budget

to get anything like what id want for the money, only thing to do is get the 40D3000. Can be had for £730 if you shop around, and then get 2.5 % quidco cash back on top. BUt its not 1080p

people say that 1080p is pointless, but then i dont want to blow £700 on TV i know deep down im not going to be happy, thinking i should have got a 1080p Telly

arrggh ! why cant i just find a perfect set and have done with it

sid · 9 Sep 2007 at 20:36

Well depending on how far away you are going to sit, 1080p 40" won't be worth much over 40" 720p

sid

badbob · 9 Sep 2007 at 20:39

I'm happy with 40" Samsung M87, colours are fine. Don't use dynamic mode, and have a play with colour temp.
1080p isn't pointless. If you're buying Blu-Ray or HD-DVD you'll want to get a 1080p screen. Also better for PC use. And a 1080p has a single instance of scaling, unlike a 1366x768 screen.

several remarking the 100hz is pointless and doesnt work

I had a feeling it would. 100hz sets require further processing, which can only be bad. It's not like the source is 100hz is it? I think people are thinking of the CRT period, when 100hz's needed to remove 50/60hz flicker...but again 100hz processing was pretty bad. I noticed pixellation on a top of the range Toshiba 100hz set.

FrankJH · 10 Sep 2007 at 05:21

the problem you are having is because all the reviews of the M86 are based on the first few firmware releases. All the people who have had one delivered since I got mine in early Aug havent had any fault at all as far as I can tell - they really are worth the money in my opinion

badbob · 10 Sep 2007 at 08:37

FrankJH said:
the problem you are having is because all the reviews of the M86 are based on the first few firmware releases. All the people who have had one delivered since I got mine in early Aug havent had any fault at all as far as I can tell - they really are worth the money in my opinion

Even then it depends, mine is 1010 so apparently has movie plus bug, but don't watch freeview, and sources are 1080p so it's always disabled (and can't be enabled, so won't re-enable itself)

cuke2u · 10 Sep 2007 at 09:27

Hi, sorry but are you suggesting the movie+ bug is confined to freeview? It will happen whilst watching scart inputs as well. I know we subscribe to the same lengthy av forums thread so you should know this.
The good news is it can ne easily fixed with a firmware update and more recent sets do not have this issue...
ChrisC

badbob · 10 Sep 2007 at 09:31

ah right sorry so all analogue inputs plus freeview then? Again not a problem for me, just use HDMI inputs.

Paul -C- · 10 Sep 2007 at 11:03

Panasonic's new PZ70 seems to be getting well received over on avforums

Thorien · 10 Sep 2007 at 11:24

Hiya,
I got a Panny PX70 (42inch) a few months ago and am dead happy with it! Excellent tv for the money , if you want 1080p get the PZ70 - but really do not think its worth it as you can only tell the difference in resolution if sitting 2ft or closer to the tv!!
I sit 11ft away and therfore went for the cheaper option of the px70.
Took ages to decide, the problem I then had was that I HAD TO buy surround sound speakers, amp, DVD player and Wall bracket and table for equipment as well! SPENT loads of money (including having to hide cables in the wall and re-decorate!) but it was all worth it in the end!!

GOOD LUCK with your decision!

badbob · 10 Sep 2007 at 11:32

you can only tell the difference in resolution if sitting 2ft or closer to the tv!!

Wrong. The difference between pixel size is quite a bit. You can see the difference of 720p v 1080p on a 40/42" from around 6' away.

Thorien · 10 Sep 2007 at 11:53

Are you sure about this, not I've read on AVforums!
Anyway as I said I sit 11ft away so for me not worth it, plus does anyone actually sit closer than 6ft away to a 42inch tv??

Thorien · 10 Sep 2007 at 11:56

Also the px70 has 1080p processing but 768 resolution perhaps this makes the difference

a1ex2001 · 10 Sep 2007 at 12:08

Thorien said:
plus does anyone actually sit closer than 6ft away to a 42inch tv??

Lots of people I've been into peoples houses where they are sitting that sort of distance from a cheap 50" plasma! They look awful and are horrible to watch but some poeple still can't get past the bigger is better argument or the 'bragging' rights down the local pub of having a 50" plasma that like bigger than the screen in the pub init!

Personally won't be going bigger than 37" in my living room, we have the room and the distance for a 42" but I really don't want my living room to look like a TV show room and I don't think I watch enough TV to warrant it. I'd love a roll down projector screen for those evenings when I sit down to watch a DVD gives you the screen size without the permanent giant piece of electronics but not sure I can really justify the expense or the hastle!

badbob · 10 Sep 2007 at 12:27

Thorien said:
Also the px70 has 1080p processing but 768 resolution perhaps this makes the difference

No not really. It'll acccept a higher than native resolution but the panel will have to downscale. It won't look as good as native resolution source on native resolution. In this case Blu Ray will look better on a 1080p screen, rather than a 720p screen.

'bragging' rights down the local pub of having a 50" plasma that like bigger than the screen in the pub init

Nothing to do with bragging rights. To get cinematic experience in your home you need a large screen.

Thorien · 10 Sep 2007 at 13:14

badbob said:
Nothing to do with bragging rights. To get cinematic experience in your home you need a large screen.

But surely you should'nt be sitting so close (<6ft away) from such a huge screen??? :eek:

Ideal viewing distance for a 50 inch should be about 12ft or more shouldn't it?

badbob · 10 Sep 2007 at 13:20

I'm 2.2m from 40" looks great, and not too close. A 50" would be too big though.
When you watch a 2:35 image is less than 40", probably around 38"-38.5"

Corasik · 10 Sep 2007 at 13:47

I believe its actually 5.5 ft where 1080p becomes 'fully visible' on a 42inch TV.. Between 5.5 ft and 7ft there is 'improvement' over a 720p. Then as you move from 7FT to 12FT, even 720p becomes less of a requirement' At 12ft from a 42inch screen you basically arnt even getting an improvement over a 576 pal screen.

60inch is the 'ideal' size for a 1080p @ 12ft... But not everyone wants their TV to dominate their sitting room.

Resolution is seriously overrated for the 'average' persons TV size V viewing distance.

Before anyone says they sit closer, or they have vision better than SUPERMAN!, I said the average person, with normal eyesight.

If the scaler is anygood in the TV... downcoverting the 1080p signal down to 720p will be no problem at all. Just dont go sitting less than 7ft from a 42inch 702p TV set and still expect good resolution.

Yep 6ft from a cheap 720p 60 inch plasma will look rubbish. But sit 15ft away, and it would probably look acceptable, it not very good. (assuming contrast/ colour purity, processing time etc are all 'ok')

Fr0dders · 11 Sep 2007 at 21:48

well HDTV test finally posted the rewview of the Samsung LE40F86

and the first batch of owners have started getting their sets on Saturday / Monday

lots of positve comments, just apparent that 100hz is a gimmick. And reading back to the Sony D3000 review, they were exactly extatic about the 100hz, just critized it less than on the samsung

however this is the same website that stated the M86 was the best thing since sliced bread and the M87 was awfull, despite them being identical ....

anyway ive taken the plump and ordered the samsung. ill let you know how i get on when it arrives.

FrankJH · 11 Sep 2007 at 22:00

really interested in what you think - and that you dont get "stung" by a model with loads of bugs initially.

Crossed fingers for you that everything arrives and tests ok for you

Fr0dders · 11 Sep 2007 at 22:04

FrankJH said:
really interested in what you think - and that you dont get "stung" by a model with loads of bugs initially.

Crossed fingers for you that everything arrives and tests ok for you

good thing about the F86 is

even if do, the firmware can be updated by the USB slot on the side. Download new firmware off the net, unzip it, extract to USB and away you go

will be just like updating the firmware on your ipod or whatever.. now thats what i call progress.