The Faith FAQ

Raz · 31 May 2007 at 15:33

semi-pro waster said:
Once you are finished or have a bit that you need read over I'd be happy to have a quick look to see if there is anything that I can help with but I can't guarantee much with my limited knowledge of religion. I don't really have any particular questions to ask either because I'm not that curious beyond the knowledge I have now and if I was ever that curious again I tend to just look it up for myself.

Thanks, appreciate the offer

Felix E · 31 May 2007 at 15:33

Mat said:
I think this is a very important and sensible question and needs further in depth analysis. It might point towards an answer as to why muslims are so frustrated with the western world...

Not all Muslim's are frustrated with the Western world. I think you'll find there are plenty of Christians/Jews/Atheists etc from both the West and the East who are frustrated with the western world.

iCraig · 31 May 2007 at 15:34

jcb33 said:
We live in a free will universe, if a heigher being were to step in and stop us, they would be violating our free will afaik... Not that I beleive in god, nor that I dont, im undecided I just read a lot

Unlikely, free will is a human concept designed by us and our own perception of what and how we actualise our lives. It's unlikely a God would hold value in a human's opinion of what they think a life deserves.

cleanbluesky · 31 May 2007 at 16:04

iCraig said:
Did God create himself?

No, God is the concept of Creation

iCraig · 31 May 2007 at 16:14

cleanbluesky said:
No, God is the concept of Creation

So if he didn't create himself, he was either:

a.) Created by something else.
b.) Has always existed.

Now, if he was created by something else, to me that would trump God and if he's always existed did he come into existence at the same time as the universe, or did he exist before the universe and he simply created it?

*brainfart*

Psyk · 31 May 2007 at 16:28

Raz said:
I was hoping to include something on Atheism and agnostism as well, but thanks for reminding me - I'll edit my op.

There's not really much to say about atheism and agnosticism apart from what they mean. I suppose you could go into humanism, but that would probably be straying away from faith.

Sinizterguy · 31 May 2007 at 16:36

Explain faith to me in a fashion that integrates logic into the explanation. I dont want holes in the logic through which I can drive a Hummer through. Or just let me know if thats impossible.

iCraig · 31 May 2007 at 16:39

Sinizterguy said:
Explain faith to me in a fashion that integrates logic into the explanation. I dont want holes in the logic through which I can drive a Hummer through. Or just let me know if thats impossible.

In my experience logic doesn't have a place within religion in many places. However this doesn't necessarily undermine it. Logic is a human concept, who's to say a deity cannot overrule what we consider logic?

For instance, it's logical to assume Noah never lived until he was 300, however if a God with his infinite power wanted Noah to live that long, logic is soon overshadowed by divine power. After all, God created everything so it would be logical to assume he can change his own rules.

Raz · 31 May 2007 at 16:43

Keep going I, I'll just copy and paste your answers

Raz · 31 May 2007 at 21:38

Sorry to drag this up, but just in case I get some more 'feedback'

Anim · 31 May 2007 at 21:59

How did Noah fit a billion species in to the ark ?

Why do people kill others in the name of faith when every religion promotes kindness?

Azagoth · 31 May 2007 at 21:59

I always like to fall back on the wise words of Father Dougal McGuire, a man of the cloth.

Come on, Ted. Sure it's no more peculiar than all that stuff we learned in the seminary, you know, Heaven and Hell and everlasting life and all that type of thing. You're not meant to take it seriously, Ted!

God Ted, I've heard about those cults. Everyone dressing in black and saying our Lord's going to come back and judge us all.

So, if God has existed forever...you know, what did he do in his spare time, like, before he made the Earth and everything?

semi-pro waster · 31 May 2007 at 22:01

Psyk said:
There's not really much to say about atheism and agnosticism apart from what they mean. I suppose you could go into humanism, but that would probably be straying away from faith.

Well, you can expand on them, a lot of people use science as a justification for their disbelief in religion when in fact the two are not inherantly incompatible. Also atheism is based on a form of faith, you have to believe there is no god (small "g") to be an atheist and that does mean you get nutbars like Dawkins who proclaim there cannot be a god (in fairness he acknowledges his position is not the most logical which agnosticism would be because we simply cannot know for definite).

Why, you could even have a famous atheists in history section in the FAQ to debunk the myth that Hitler was, although Stalin and Pol Pot were both atheists.

cleanbluesky · 31 May 2007 at 22:08

iCraig said:
So if he didn't create himself, he was either:

a.) Created by something else.
b.) Has always existed.

Now, if he was created by something else, to me that would trump God and if he's always existed did he come into existence at the same time as the universe, or did he exist before the universe and he simply created it?

*brainfart*

To create something, you need to use the power of creation. That power is God. Anything done must be within His nature.

cleanbluesky · 31 May 2007 at 22:11

semi-pro waster said:
Well, you can expand on them, a lot of people use science as a justification for their disbelief in religion when in fact the two are not inherantly incompatible. Also atheism is based on a form of faith, you have to believe there is no god (small "g") to be an atheist and that does mean you get nutbars like Dawkins who proclaim there cannot be a god (in fairness he acknowledges his position is not the most logical which agnosticism would be because we simply cannot know for definite).

Why, you could even have a famous atheists in history section in the FAQ to debunk the myth that Hitler was, although Stalin and Pol Pot were both atheists.

Before we go any further into a quagmire of misinformation, 'science' and 'religion' are both faith based positions but they are competing faith based positions as they content that different methods should be used, and neither is willing to concede to the other at present, nor are either showing any sign of any give.

Science and religion as in faith are two different theories, science and creeds are two different things as creeds are about obedience and conformity, not knowledge.

Also, bear in mind that many/most religions are self-contradictory or their teachings vague. Some religions defy what we understand from observation (through science) hence are incompatible or hypocritical.

Psyk · 31 May 2007 at 22:15

semi-pro waster said:
Also atheism is based on a form of faith, you have to believe there is no god (small "g") to be an atheist

I think a good definition of atheist is either belief there is no god, or the lack of belief in any gods. They are two subtly different meanings.

Azagoth · 31 May 2007 at 22:16

You want a laugh?

http://www.answersingenesis.org/

semi-pro waster · 31 May 2007 at 22:36

cleanbluesky said:
Before we go any further into a quagmire of misinformation, 'science' and 'religion' are both faith based positions but they are competing faith based positions as they content that different methods should be used, and neither is willing to concede to the other at present, nor are either showing any sign of any give.

Hold the phone a second. Science and religion are not incompatible or at the least you would have to explain this incompatibility to a number of pre-eminent scientists both past and present. Science doesn't try to explain god or a lack of one, it tries to explain natural phenomena by creating laws to do this. If you want to make science your 'god' then you can do so but one does not automatically replace the other and both can apparantly co-exist quite happily in the minds of men far smarter than I.

cleanbluesky said:
Science and religion as in faith are two different theories, science and creeds are two different things as creeds are about obedience and conformity, not knowledge.

Also, bear in mind that many/most religions are self-contradictory or their teachings vague. Some religions defy what we understand from observation (through science) hence are incompatible or hypocritical.

It is true that some religions have parts or tenets that contradict what we understand as scientific fact but that does not mean that all religion does (contradict) or even that the religion is wrong.

cleanbluesky · 1 Jun 2007 at 00:08

semi-pro waster said:
Hold the phone a second. Science and religion are not incompatible or at the least you would have to explain this incompatibility to a number of pre-eminent scientists both past and present.

Take Galileo as an example of this incompatability, although I suspect a simple rebuttal to this example which will lead to the question of what we are describing when we say religion.

Science doesn't try to explain god or a lack of one, it tries to explain natural phenomena by creating laws to do this. If you want to make science your 'god' then you can do so but one does not automatically replace the other and both can apparantly co-exist quite happily in the minds of men far smarter than I.

Science does try to explain God because any definition of the concept of God maintains that 'God' represents ultimate reality, the Authority beyond all other Authorities - the aim of science is to discover each of these rules.

The concept of a God is a nebulous one, so a 'scientist' can also be religious - but I think you'll find that religious scientists have to be very selective with what they profess to believe to avoid one contradicting the other.

It is true that some religions have parts or tenets that contradict what we understand as scientific fact but that does not mean that all religion does (contradict) or even that the religion is wrong.

Again, it depends on what you consider to be religion?

Personal religion - i.e. the relationship between an individual and the gods

Creed - the obedience and compliance to your pastor/preacher and religious peers

Spirituality - belief in one's own spirit

When a part of a religious text is shown to be contradictory, it casts doubt upon an entire religious text. This does not preclude that God does not exist, just that he has left inaccurate records therefore no record is guaranteed. We then know nothing about him, or that He exists at all.

Arcade Fire · 1 Jun 2007 at 00:30

Psyk said:
I think a good definition of atheist is either belief there is no god, or the lack of belief in any gods. They are two subtly different meanings.

Wow, you really don't understand anything, do you?