The Great Big FFP Debate

dannyjo22 said:
Never going to happen sadly because then some of the teams that have been at the top for years would end up dropping down the leagues when it was found out how badly run they were for bringing in players and developing them rather than buying them. The only way they would go for it would be with no relegation. It would cure so many problems with the game and all but eradicate big transfer fees even without a draft. Too much money changing hands and palms being greased in those transfer dealings for it ever to stop happening.

I mean since the start of the EPL we have had only 7 winners and once has that team not been a top 2-3 spender. In that time the NHL has had 17 different winners and the NHL has had 16 different Cup winners and 7 from 1992-98. That's competition and actual hope for fans rather than the system we have now. No I don't think the answer is to let the teams spend or cheat however they want but no one apart from players and agents win with the current system. Then the fans have to pay for a Rashford to get 350k per week and 100 million transfer fees with ever increasing sky subscriptions to not even watch every game.
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So many issues in football from a fan perspective
 
Lets be honest the best days of the premier league are behind us. It is just way too messy with everything now. The PL got too greedy and now they can eat it.
 
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the wopster said:
Correction one breaks the rules, NUFC haven’t broke any rules, so please don’t tar us with the same brush
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My post was more correct than yours. The rules were made by the PL under the orders of a majority of PL clubs, not just a few American owners.
 
BaZ87 said:
My post was more correct than yours. The rules were made by the PL under the orders of a majority of PL clubs, not just a few American owners.
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You’re naive if you think the likes of Manu. Liverpool and Arsenal don’t “guide” the voting how they want.
 
the wopster said:
You’re naive if you think the likes of Manu. Liverpool and Arsenal don’t “guide” the voting how they want.
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I'd love an explanation as to what this means. How have Liverpool, Utd & Arsenal guided at least 11 other clubs to vote for these rules if they didn't want them?

I've said it time and time again, these rules get voted through because the smaller clubs want them as much as Utd or Liverpool, because clubs losing 10s if not 100s of millions per year is not sustainable. Whether it's Steve Parish at Crystal Palace or when Mike Ashley was at Newcastle, these clubs want rules put in place that stops them having to lose a fortune in order to compete.

I know you don't care and your sole focus is on what suits Newcastle but there are very valid reasons for having these rules in place. They're not perfect and I've given my views on changes I think could be made but the current situation is better and fairer than what you want, allowing sports washing states to just spend whatever they like.
 
BaZ87 said:
Those weren't the rules I'm suggesting that club broke.
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Making illegal rules or breaking rules are all from the same playbook.

Only the fans do this for the love. Everyone else is out to exploit that whether it be the premier league execs on one side or the owners on the other.
 
I don't think it's anything to do with greedy american owners. This football inflation existed well before they were owners on mass. Man United were spending at levels not seen before or since, before Americans took over.
 
DavieJG said:
Making illegal rules or breaking rules are all from the same playbook.

Only the fans do this for the love. Everyone else is out to exploit that whether it be the premier league execs on one side or the owners on the other.
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Not really as you'd have had to know that the rules were illegal and until they were tested by the tribunal, they didn't know that. City on the other hand knowingly broke the rules. There's literally 1000s of leaked documents showing them consciously breaking the rules.

And the PL execs are doing what? I always find these attacks on Richard Masters & co a bit strange as if people believe they're calling the shots. They're employed by the League carrying out the wishes of the clubs. The clubs wanted these rules, the execs are just tasked with trying to make the clubs wishes possible.
 
BaZ87 said:
I know you don't care and your sole focus is on what suits Newcastle but there are very valid reasons for having these rules in place. They're not perfect and I've given my views on changes I think could be made but the current situation is better and fairer than what you want, allowing sports washing states to just spend whatever they like.
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I don’t want us to be able to spend vast amounts of money, but I do want us to be able compete, as soon as we were taken over all the PL clubs panicked and brought in illegal rules, those rules are now going to come back and bite the PL in the ass.

Even the new “squad cost cap” will stop teams wanting to compete, because as soon as anyone but the established “big clubs” qualified for European competition they would have to cut their wages and transfer’s from 85 to 70% of club turnover, meaning at a time when a club needs to spend more money to compete, it will have to make cuts and spend less.
 
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the wopster said:
I don’t want us to be able to spend vast amounts of money, but I do want us to be able compete, as soon as we were taken over all the PL clubs panicked and brought in illegal rules, those rules are now going to come back and bite the PL in the ass.

Even the new “squad cost cap” will stop teams wanting to compete, because as soon as anyone but the established “big clubs” qualified for European competition they would have to cut their wages and transfer’s from 85 to 70% of club turnover.
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I'm not sure I believe that first comment but as the tribunal said themselves, APT rules (which were the rules that were brought in) are required in order to make PSR (and the future squad control ratios) work. For all the hysteria, the fact they were found unlawful is going to make little to no difference. I'd be amazed if anybody was able to claim compensation for any meaningful amount of money and a variation of those rules is now in place. As I said last night, even if City were to successfully challenge the amended rules, the sticking point is ultimately meaningless. Worst case the PL will have to reassess PSR calculations (for previous seasons) based on a fair market value on shareholder loans - Everton end up with bigger breaches, Brighton might breach and maybe 1 or 2 clubs more but these clubs will be given mitigation due to the fact that the rules weren't in place at the time. End result nothing changes. And once we move to squad control ratios then directors loans aren't even calculated.

As for your second paragraph, it never ceases to amaze me that people forget that UEFA already have squad control ratios in place. If a side qualifies for Europe then they have to hit that 70% target regardless of any rules the PL have in place. The reason why the PL is moving to squad control rules is because these are the rules in place for clubs in Europe and it makes sense to mirror their rules with UEFA's.
 
BaZ87 said:
Not really as you'd have had to know that the rules were illegal and until they were tested by the tribunal, they didn't know that. City on the other hand knowingly broke the rules. There's literally 1000s of leaked documents showing them consciously breaking the rules.

And the PL execs are doing what? I always find these attacks on Richard Masters & co a bit strange as if people believe they're calling the shots. They're employed by the League carrying out the wishes of the clubs. The clubs wanted these rules, the execs are just tasked with trying to make the clubs wishes possible.
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I'm glad you have faith that they didn't know they were creating illegal rules. They did whatever suited the agenda at the time.

I by no means condone Man city's actions. They deserve what's coming to them.
 
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