The Next Generation of Graphics APIs

[LtMatt]

If Mantle was "Open" to be used as a "standard" it'd have more than just AMD's backing vendor wise (I don't just mean Nvidia here)

But obviously you'll take Barczak's word over mine, no worries, and you'll probably continue to do so 2 years in the future as only AMD are peddling Mantle (still).

Mantle will become open, in time.

To be quite honest, I'm not really fussed whether you agree with him or not - that's up to you - but I explained my position quite clearly from information that has been provided to the general public by AMD and other parties involved with Mantle; and that is that it is an architecture specific API (GCN-based) with no evidence so far that it has been coded for any more architectures (for a start that would require heavy Nvidia involvement for them to be able to program Mantle in order for it work on Nvidia hardware).

But we have multiple devs, not amd, saying that is not the case. I see no reason to doubt them.

 

[LtMatt]

I do not have the time to contact him nor am I that bothered about the whole situation to do so, rather I have just taken issue with his statements for good reason (as explained above).

As i thought.

 

[LtMatt]

From here ; http://www.techradar.com/news/compu...g-api-to-become-the-industry-standard-1218560

About going "Open"


It's almost too easy to extrapolate Nvidia need to make technical changes.
Unless Bazza knows more than Hallock?

That neither confirms nor denies though Martini. I can dig up several different sources from AMD that state the future plans for Mantle and they all involve it being open and standardised once its finalised. I can probably get a reply from Robert Hallock as well if needed.

 

[LtMatt]

Quite simply because AMD say its not tied to GCN and they along with game developers created Mantle. Why would they say this if its not true? Who knows more, ocuk forum experts or people that created the API? It makes no sense. Multiple game devs using Mantle say the same. It can be adopted by other vendors. Its only GCN at the moment because Mantle is still in beta.

Slide from the Mantle presentation

 

[LtMatt]

There's a lot of speculation in this thread, so let me clear the air by stating the cold, hard facts:

1. Mantle is not specifically tied to Graphics Core Next, though it's obviously optimized in this direction.

2. Mantle has a meaningful, though thin, layer of abstraction that would permit it to be compatible with any modern, programmable (e.g. DX11-11.2) graphics architecture.

4. While Mantle is currently in closed beta for the purposes of rapid development, our intention to release a public SDK by the end of the year would open Mantle to the same extent as any other graphics API. Further adoption beyond that point would be limited only by a hardware vendor's willingness to do so.

We fully support, and intend to pursue, any action that would broaden the adoption of Mantle and its philosophy of low-overhead game development. It is clear from the comments by Oxide, Firaxis, EA and other developers this is a worthwhile pursuit with clear and positive ramifications for the overall simplicity and robustness of game development.

The facts.

Thanks for clearing that up.

 

[LtMatt]

What are you doing about Multi GPU support ?

None available in Thief

Quadfire is a mess in BF4

Come on Kaap, ive explained both of those questions to you already in this thread. Do you think he will say anything different to what i did? Crossfire in Mantle cannot be implemented at driver level, its up to the game developer. As for quad fire problems in Mantle in BF4 at 4k, that's down to Dice as well. As you already said though, DX works perfectly, does it not? AMD were responsible for the multi gpu support in DX11, btw.

 

[LtMatt]

There is no harm in asking the question as Thracks will be able to give a more informative answer.

Fair enough.

 

[LtMatt]

I see, thanks for explaining the reality of the situation

From previous information I was under the impression that Mantle was a graphics API currently tied to the GCN architecture unlike DirectX which is a generalised API. This new information is interesting and I look forward to see where Mantle goes from here, I see now that it does definitely have good potential.

I'm glad Thracks came and explained it a hell of a lot better than i could. I was going off the many slides and presentations ive seen from AMD, Oxide, Dice and others. However its always more helpful to hear it from someone in the know and straight from the horses mouth. Thanks for popping by Robert.

 

[LtMatt]

This is the first time we've ever had information like this

Drink it in, this is gold.

 

[LtMatt]

In the past few days, two noteworthy game developers have even expressed how and why DirectX 12 and Mantle should coexist, and why they will use both.

Would be great to see that in an article or blog with more information.

 

[LtMatt]

Next week.

Will post it here then once it hits twitter.

 

[LtMatt]

Question time with Orangey. More questions please.

 

[LtMatt]

Perhaps you'd be able to clear up why the SDK is still exclusive?

That's already been explained to you rather clearly.

While Mantle is currently in closed beta for the purposes of rapid development, our intention to release a public SDK by the end of the year would open Mantle to the same extent as any other graphics API. Further adoption beyond that point would be limited only by a hardware vendor's willingness to do so. This would also permit a software vendor to optimize a Mantle render backend for other microarchitectures.