The problem with the England team

Loki

Loki

Loki

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I have been thinking about this for a few days now, what is wrong with the England team ???? For as long as I can remember England have always had two or three decent players. More so from the 90's onwards. How can a nation who is blessed with players Robson, Platt, Shearer, Lineker, Adams, Gascoigne, Scholes, Gerrard, Lampard, Rooney et-al fail on such a regular basis.

Is it a case that the players are over-rated. As a nation do we put a burden of expectation too high for the players to deliver on ? I really do beleive that we have a good group of players at present but are not performing to their capabilities or realising their potential.

The only times where we have really looked like achieving something was Italia'90 and Euro 96. On any other occasion we have always looked like we are missing something from the team. There was a real togetherness in the squad. Good players came out of it looking world class as they were relaxed in a formation they could play in. Moreover they were played in positions natural to them.

You can draw comparisons to the succesfull Liverpool teams of the 70's & 80's. The reason for their consistent success in that team was having a team that is more than the sum of its parts. All of them good players with one or two world class players but because of their team ethic they were more than that. No prime donnas or ego's.

I see the exact opposite certainly with the current England team. Lots of very good players and some who are world class but can't gel into a winning XI. With the exceptions of Italia '90 & Euro '96 I think we have failed to deliver a real cohesive team where everyone knew their place and role.

Thoughts, opinions, criticism's on a postcard
 
The problem i see is that neither Sven or Mclaren were or are brave enough to sacrafice the "star" players for the sake of the team. We're playing Gerrard down the right just so we can play both him and Lampard in the same team, its going to be great when Joe Cole comes back, we'll have him playing on the left and coming inside and the same from Gerrard on the right.

For now i think we have to drop one of Lampard or Gerrard (no prizes for guessing who i would drop) and play them alongside Parker (while Hargreaves is injured), not because i don't rate Carrick just that i don't think he's good enough defensively and then play Lennon or SWP down the right and Cole down the left. Long term though i think we need to find a system that allows us to play 3 in the middle (Carrick being the 3rd, due to his passing ability) because we're not going to win a major tournement with a 4-4-2; only ways i can think would either be a 4-5-1 (but Rooney can't really play as a lone striker) or a 4-3-1-2 with Rooney off of Crouch/Owen etc.

As for the strikers, i do think Rooney and Crouch can play together but not with the current midfield playing behind them. If we played with 2 out and out wingers i think we would create the spaces for Rooney to play and also offer balls into the box for Crouch. But like ive said i wouldn't mind seeing a 4-3-1-2:
-------------Robinson-------------
Neville----Terry--Ferdinand----Cole
----------Parker/Hargreaves-------
-----Gerrard----------Carrick------
--------------Rooney-------------
----------Crouch---Owen---------
With Hargreaves or Parker sitting it will allow Neville and Cole to get forward and give us the width (well to an extent anyway), we would have the extra man in the middle and up top we would have the pace in behind of Owen (which will stop teams squeezing up) Crouch's height (which will hamper teams who sit deap) and Rooney making the most of either the knock downs from Crouch or the space between the midfield and defence that Owen will provide.
 
I don’t think any of the players are overrated, but I get the feeling that they might believe their own hype sometimes. For me they always seem to be waiting for one of the others to put in a game winning performance without putting in that much effort themselves. Giving each other the ball and gesturing to them in the hope that they will go off on a mazy run and score a wonder goal. Add that together with the fact that nobody gets dropped for a bad performance or bad form, they get comfortable knowing that they will be in the next game, performing at exactly the same level.

I’m not worried yet, though. Come March they will storm the group, finish top, get to the European Championship, perform averagely, get to the semi final and then get knocked out by a team who we would all expect England to beat comfortably. You know, the usual sort of routine.
 
Mr_L said:
I’m not worried yet, though. Come March they will storm the group, finish top, get to the European Championship, perform averagely, get to the semi final and then get knocked out by a team who we would all expect England to beat comfortably. You know, the usual sort of routine.
Click to expand...

Thats the thing that concerns me though. Why is there this routine of almost accepting or pre-empting failure surounding the national football team
 
I think we HAVE to play a 4-4-2, its the English way, and we need to stick to what we know best and fit the players in that way.

I personally think we have no brains in the team, lots of brawn, lots of skill and talent, but nobody to control it all, no conductor as such, all the big teams seem to have someone like this, Kaka (amongst others) for Brazil,Zidane for the frogs,Ballack for the krauts etc etc we need some with some vision, and i cant really see who can do this for us.

Rooney is far too volatile and plays too far up the pitch, gerrard is a driving midfielder and cant do it either, maybe just maybe Carrick but i doubt it. Crouch is just not good enough to play for liverpool, let alone England, he has scored goals, but against Jamaica,andorra and Macedonia, if only he had some pace and heading ability he would be ok.
 
Agree with Rotty's team apart from up front. Owen is past it and Crouch never had it. I think Rooney has to play but with someone quicker to play in front of him. Johnson / Defoe / Bent would do the right sort of job but they never get a chance to make an impact. Ashton looks like a good one for the future too. Lets not forget a certain Mr Walcott who will will be 19 when the Euros come around. SWP could do the same sort of job as Lennon but we have no one else to do a good job on the left if Cole is injured. Every other position has good cover.
 
The first thing is that Rooney and Crouch don't play well together, Crouch is a hold the ball up knock it to someone going forward or head it on and Rooney wants to drop deeper and work the ball forward.
 
I think it's unfair to say that Owen is past it. Sure, he's had some terrible injury problems, but he's scored an enormous amount of goals at all levels and he's still only 26 (I think). He's the one player who always looks like scoring when he's on form. If he can go on a long run of games without breaking down, get back into the pace of the game I don't see why he couldn't go on to beat Sir Bobby's goalscoring record.

Whether you could accommodate him and Rooney in the same team is a different argument.
 
----------Robinson-----------

Neville Ferdinand/King Terry Cole

Lennon/SWP Gerrard Hardgreaves Cole

---------Rooney--------
----------------Owen------------

Would let Gerrard have a free role basically.

I reckon once Owen gets a good run of games for Newcastle he will hit top form once again.

:)
 
Bitchplz said:
----------Robinson-----------

Neville Ferdinand/King Terry Cole

Lennon/SWP Gerrard Hardgreaves Cole

---------Rooney--------
----------------Owen------------

Would let Gerrard have a free role basically.

I reckon once Owen gets a good run of games for Newcastle he will hit top form once again.

:)
Click to expand...

I would be happy if England played to that formation and with those players. Lennon is a real terror down the right, and we've seen it when he comes on he causes problems to the fullbacks. I think that team with a little desire thrown in would be quite good with a good balance of attacking and defending, although I'm not sure how much flair the team would have.
 
:)

A part of me would love to see David Beckham on the bench, as i reckon for the last 10 minutes, throw him and Crouch on and it would give England a total different dimension to trouble a team.

But the baggage he reportly comes with, makes me think twice.
 
Tell you what Mr_L I would love it if England could get to the semis, that would be an improvement over sodding quarter final after quarter final track record. :D

To be any sort of contender we have to be regular semi final and finalists.

Anyone who thinks that we can go from being consistent quarter finalists to serious contender without having a track record of getting to the semis and the finals are deluded muppets. :p

I would consider getting to the semis a raging success which can be built on.
 
This current squad is too negative in play, esp. Mr McLaren. Ask any Boro fan, they watched England type performances for a couple of years whilst McLaren was there!
 
one of the reporters in the sun said it best i think


" england seem to think they have the right to win trophies "

in my book it translates to arrogance they all come over as being far to cocky but when you see the likes of argentina and brazil et al they play down there abilities
 
Maybe its better to look at how things are elsewhere. In most national teams, players are "dying" to be there, especially in the cases of countries which have less competitive domestic championships, because thats where they may shine(and be seen).

EPL, on the other hand, is constantly being poured with money. The glamour is everywhere but also the games are true battles. In that sense, I get the feeling that some players rate their club higher than their national team, thus their different performance. The championships in Italy, France, Germany and Spain are also commercial etc but there is always this impression that there football is still for the general public while here is becoming more middle class theater.

It may also to do with mentality though! The English team is a pure reflection of how England itself lost its dominance from manufacturing after the industrial revolution, thinking that it would never be caught up, thus not seeing a point in investing and so on. Similarly here, the "arrogance" from the thought of being good just because thats the "birthplace of football" can have its negative sides.
 
Mentioning '90 and '96 us an interesting point. I was too young to remember watching us in '90 (although from what I've read, weren't we actually quite poor up until the knockout stages?), but comparing our squad now relative to that in '96, bar Gascoigne and Shearer, I think we've got a far better selection of players than back then. A top notch backline, with a great selection of centre-backs, two world class midfielders (who unfortunately have problems playing together), promising young wingers (Walcott included), and the fantastic Mr. Rooney. But in '96 Venables achieved that goal of English management and actually got us playing like a team for once. Everyone bums the 5-1 drubbing we gave to Germany under Sven, but the 4-1 win over Holland in '96 was, for me, a much better result, where we bossed the game far more, and outclassed a quality team (as opposed to the shambles the german team was). It's still my faourite England performance I've seen, even now, because we really controlled that game in a way I've not seen us do since, even against the poor sides.

So yeah, it's the team ethic we seem to be lacking. IMO I think the manager needs to be more forceful with his players. It's what Sven failed to do, and it seems to be McClaren's problem too. Tell the team how to play, don't just expect them to know.

I echo the people asking for a Gerrard/Hargreaves middle of midfield though. I think Stevie deserves his chance to prove himself there now, after a few poor performances from Lamps. Stick some pacey wingers out there, and let Gerrard run the game a bit more, like he does at Liverpool, where he has the freedom to drift about more.
 
I think too many players are in the comfort zone, they know they are going to play and more than likely, start.

For me I'd start chopping away, pick some surprises and upset a few of the people there for an easy ride.

Nolan. Barton. Baines. Reo-Coker. Bent. King.
 
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