TTIP

Caporegime
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I'm surprised this isn't being discussed. I know very little on this subject so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but from what I understand this is an agreement which is effectively a race for the megacorps to find the cheapest labour they can under the disguise of "investing in people" or something. Now some documents have been leaked which show the true nature of this beast and loads of people have egg on their faces. I'll read up on it this evening but I'm curious to see if anyone here can actually point me to a positive effect of a trade deal like this.

EDIT: Just had a quick look around and jogged my memory a bit, wasn't this all organized behind closed doors with no input from us regular Joes? Effectively a case of "none of your business, go away and do as you're told" kind of thing?

Very murky waters.
 
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just an EU trade deal with 'murica... of course totally within our interests, unelected EU bureaucrats always have our interests in mind when negotiating these things so why worry about it?
 
Yeah, it stinks to high heaven. It's not covered by mainstream media, it gets hidden away and covered up as soon as it emerges, there's something very fishy going on here. It's no wonder the David Icke fans are having a field day.

Russia's propaganda channel news station did a video which erm.... has info I suppose. Take it with a pinch of salt though, RT always has an agenda.





I dunno. I have much research to do.
 
The whole deal is shady as hell. It's the main reason I'm voting out.

DC has said he would have had TTIP two years ago. He is all for it. In the EU some of the Germans and French are putting up resistance to it. German judges apparently said that the unelected panel making decisions in secret was not needed as current law provided enough protection.
 
Tldr version?

This is what I'm trying to figure out as well. Seems I've stuck my head in to a rabbit hole which goes on for miles and has loads of freaks along the way. Separating facts from fiction is going to be a mission I think.
 
You think leaving the EU the most pressing matter, the TTIP makes it look like a small matter and very little is know about how Corporations are signing our lives away from under our feet by bribes and back room deals where we are sold off as commodities by the rich.
 
DC has said he would have had TTIP two years ago. He is all for it. In the EU some of the Germans and French are putting up resistance to it. German judges apparently said that the unelected panel making decisions in secret was not needed as current law provided enough protection.

Right. But America don't want it if it's just us. So no Europe, no ttip.
 
Does TTIP allow corps to sue the government for any loss of money... Due to new laws etc. Now I know the EU are in talks about this... But the UK want this deal to. If we were to to leave the EU and get this deal.... It sounds like the corporations will be running the country even more to than they are now. Effectively, it will be them who decide what laws pass.

This sounds incredibly worse than the EU 'taking sovereignty... So why do we not hear kippers moaning about this? Or are they just following what's the 'in' thing to hate at the moment.
 
The EU seems quite a dangerous thing when you look at it from this point of view, who do we hold accountable for TTIP democratically?
 
Does TTIP allow corps to sue the government for any loss of money... Due to new laws etc. Now I know the EU are in talks about this... But the UK want this deal to. If we were to to leave the EU and get this deal.... It sounds like the corporations will be running the country even more to than they are now. Effectively, it will be them who decide what laws pass.

This sounds incredibly worse than the EU 'taking sovereignty... So why do we not hear kippers moaning about this? Or are they just following what's the 'in' thing to hate at the moment.

This is a conspiracy theory. TTIP is nothing of the sort. It promotes free trade and enterprise and backs fair practice in law. TTIP is a good thing indeed.
 
The original thread discussing it is here.

https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/showthread.php?t=18720969&highlight=ttip

Have a look through there and realise that it's nothing like it's being portrayed in some parts of the media. It's seen as some kind of secret lizard people agreement, when it's just not anything like that. Of course the drafts are going to be negotiated away from the public eye, with the oversight of officials you elected into office, it's politically and commercial sensitive.

Once final drafts are agreed on, if they are agreed on, then they become public and go through the rigmarole of the parliamentary/electorate system with public access to drafts and many changes by elected officials and other interested parties.

Many of the most "controversial" parts are more to do with governments not backing out of legal deals with commercial entities, and if they do then the government may have to pay back any money the commercial entity spent in good faith. Just as you would have to pay back the remainder of a phone contract if you decided to pull out half way through and kept the free phone.

There are many questions and worrying parts to it, from the parts we know little about (until the leaked draft is properly read through and reported*), but considering the stance of the UK government on many of these issue (such as use of certain pesticides, GM etc) I'm more convinced the EU negotiations would stop those over any negotiations the UK government would have.

*The independent is not a reliable source on this matter - they seem to have gone downhill a lot in the last few years, they are now more akin to the Mirror and Sun than traditional broadsheets on these matters. :(
 
Right. But America don't want it if it's just us. So no Europe, no ttip.

What makes you believe any post brexit trade deal with the US and UK wont look like TTIP when the current leaders of both countries support that trade deal?
 
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Right. But America don't want it if it's just us. So no Europe, no ttip.

One of the main arguments from Brexiters is that we would have our own trade deal with the US in short order. Remember the uproar about Obamas speech and being at the "back of the queue"?

The Conservatives are pro many of the most controversial parts (such as environmental issues) of the TTIP, why do you not think the TTIP would not be similar to what we would accept if the UK got a separate trade deal with the US?

Basically, either we don't get a trade deal with the US for a long time (in which case the Brexit argument gets another hole), or we do, and we end up with something very similar (quite possibly worse) to the TTIP.
 
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