Upgrade from 6600k

[Bergkamp]

Gigabyte B550 AORUS Elite V2 £140
https://www.overclockers.co.uk/giga...2-amd-am4-b550-atx-motherboard-mb-593-gi.html

Ryzen 5600X £260
https://www.overclockers.co.uk/amd-...hz-socket-am4-processor-retail-cp-3cc-am.html


£400 Total, more than enough for you 6800XT, buy something else with the change

But that is tempting too. Too many options and by the time I've researched them all the next gen stuff will be out

 

[humbug]

But that is tempting too. Too many options and by the time I've researched them all the next gen stuff will be out

6 months for that yet, minimum, probably 8.

 

[q974739]

I went from a 6600k to a 3600, and the difference was In Your Face big.

My intent is to pick up the last, best AM4 before the new socket - and use that for years.

 

[humbug]

That's a good point, AMD's next CPU is still AM4 so you don't have to change the motherboard.

 

[Bergkamp]

How big a performance gap are we talking between the 5600x and 5800x? The extra cores and threads would be nice but for gaming does it have much impact given there is only 100MHz between the core boosts?

I think I'll maybe maybe go with the 5600x and use the saved money to get one of these monsters ▷ be quiet! Dark Rock Pro 4 CPU Cooler | OcUK (overclockers.co.uk) which should offer enough cooling for whatever options might be available after Zen 3 comes out.

Bit wary of the RAM clearance with that cooler though.

 

[humbug]

How big a performance gap are we talking between the 5600x and 5800x? The extra cores and threads would be nice but for gaming does it have much impact given there is only 100MHz between the core boosts?

I think I'll maybe maybe go with the 5600x and use the saved money to get one of these monsters ▷ be quiet! Dark Rock Pro 4 CPU Cooler | OcUK (overclockers.co.uk) which should offer enough cooling for whatever options might be available after Zen 3 comes out.

Bit wary of the RAM clearance with that cooler though.

There is little difference between them for the vast majority of cases.

 

[Joxeon]

There is little difference between them for the vast majority of cases.

Tbf for gaming there's very little between those two and a 11400F price aside especially at 1440P+ And personally I would take the 11400F over a 5600X for a gaming build any day of the week.

£260+ for a 6 core in 2021 is madness especially when you consider its only 10% faster in games and £100 cheaper than the original price of the 8700K which released in 2017.

 

[humbug]

Tbf for gaming there's very little between those two and a 11400F price aside especially at 1440P+ And personally I would take the 11400F over a 5600X for a gaming build any day of the week.

£260+ for a 6 core in 2021 is madness especially when you consider its only 10% faster in games and £100 cheaper than the original price of the 8700K which released in 2017.

Why is it suddenly slow by relative standards CPU's are good for the highest end CPU's? Oh no its not an Intel vs AMD thing, i made the same argument that those looking for CPU's to power their very high end GPU's should be looking at the 9900K, not the Ryzen 3600.

The Ryzen 5600X is significantly faster than the 10400F FFS, how many Youtube videos are out there of people with high end GPU complaining about lag and microstutter and they are running a lower end CPU? because "oh this bar is the same as this bar and this one costs less" you can't see microstutter and lag on ###### bar charts.

And 6 moths later some game comes out that puts even more strain on the CPU and now not only does your game run like a bath tub full of rusty nails but your CPU on that bar chart is looking like its standing in a cold shower, oh so now you get the £250 CPU anyway, no ####### off you should have done that in the first place.

You wouldn't run a £35 PSU with SuperMaxTurboPower1000 Bronz written on the label? Don't pair lower end CPU's with very high end GPU's.

 

[Joxeon]

Why is it suddenly slow by relative standards CPU's are good for the highest end CPU's? Oh no its not an Intel vs AMD thing, i made the same argument that those looking for CPU's to power their very high end GPU's should be looking at the 9900K, not the Ryzen 3600.

The Ryzen 5600X is significantly faster than the 10400F FFS, how many Youtube videos are out there of people with high end GPU complaining about lag and microstutter and they are running a lower end CPU? because "oh this bar is the same as this bar and this one costs less" you can't see microstutter and lag on ###### bar charts.

And 6 moths later some game comes out that puts even more strain on the CPU and now not only does your game run like a bath tub full of rusty nails but your CPU on that bar chart is looking like its standing in a cold shower, oh so now you get the £250 CPU anyway, no ####### off you should have done that in the first place.

You wouldn't run a £35 PSU with SuperMaxTurboPower1000 Bronz written on the label? Don't pair lower end CPU's with very high end GPU's.

The 11400F is absolutely fine to run with a high end GPU as its faster than a 3950X in games and many on these forums have this combo running perfectly well, sure you'll get an extra 10% out of a 5600X for the 70% price increase if your gaming at 1080P on a 3090 class card but at 1440P or above it's basically equal and these are the resolutions people generally game at with high cards.

 

[LePhuronn]

There is no upgrade path with the 11400F. If you want to build a cheap one-off gaming rig that'll last you a couple of years then yes, there is no argument for anything other than the 11400F. But if you want to give yourself a little bit of breathing room for the future, B550+5600X is the only way to go. Ryzen 5000 will not suddenly start being slow in a couple of years, but the ability to drop in 16 cheap cores in a few years is arguably worth an extra 100 notes now.

 

[Joxeon]

There is no upgrade path with the 11400F. If you want to build a cheap one-off gaming rig that'll last you a couple of years then yes, there is no argument for anything other than the 11400F. But if you want to give yourself a little bit of breathing room for the future, B550+5600X is the only way to go. Ryzen 5000 will not suddenly start being slow in a couple of years, but the ability to drop in 16 cheap cores in a few years is arguably worth an extra 100 notes now.

Yeah I totally agree about the upgrade path and would just treat it as a one time fixed build but as a cheap hold over for a couple of years till DDR5 systems get going its a great option.

Sure with the 5600X you can drop 16 cores in but those 16 cores will almost certainly get well beaten by 6~8 cores for gaming on a AM5 build in 2 or 3 years time.

I think if your going to go with AM4 then you should pass over the 5600X and go straight for a 5800X/5900X as upgrading to one of these in the future will probably end up costing around the same net spend as just going with them right away.

 

[Bug One]

I went 5800x over 5600x purely for the single core performance as I mostly play KSP.

 

[EsaT]

How big a performance gap are we talking between the 5600x and 5800x? The extra cores and threads would be nice but for gaming does it have much impact given there is only 100MHz between the core boosts?

I think I'll maybe maybe go with the 5600x and use the saved money to get one of these monsters ▷ be quiet! Dark Rock Pro 4 CPU Cooler | OcUK (overclockers.co.uk) which should offer enough cooling for whatever options might be available after Zen 3 comes out.

Bit wary of the RAM clearance with that cooler though.

If you want to keep same CPU long without upgrades, then 8 core would be the choise.
But if you're looking to upgrade to 3D stacked L3 Zen3 refresh, then 5600X lasts until untill those can be gotten at better prices.

With lot more honest TDPs than Intel, AMD doesn't need those absolutely biggest coolers.

If you have room inside case, Alpenfohn Brocken 3 would be very good with flat direct contact heatpipe base being best fit for shape of Ryzen's heatspreader.
Alpenfohn Brocken 3 CPU Cooler - 140mm= £42.95

Though Scythe Mugen 5 is actually little heavier with mid density fin stack giving lots of surface area for reasonable size.
And Fuma 2 gives almost top performance while still maintaining good DIMM/PCIe clearances.
Scythe SCMG-5100 Mugen 5 Rev.B CPU Cooler= £43.99
Scythe SCFM-2000 FUMA 2 Dual Fan CPU Cooler - 2x120 mm= £49.99
Though both have Intel concave heatspreader optimized convex base (just like that BeQuiet and most others) and basically need to deform IHS down to start making wider contact with it.
(that could be solved by grinding/lapping base flat)

 

[Wahzy]

There is little difference between them for the vast majority of cases.

Agreed.

 

[Bergkamp]

If you want to keep same CPU long without upgrades, then 8 core would be the choise.
But if you're looking to upgrade to 3D stacked L3 Zen3 refresh, then 5600X lasts until untill those can be gotten at better prices.

With lot more honest TDPs than Intel, AMD doesn't need those absolutely biggest coolers.

If you have room inside case, Alpenfohn Brocken 3 would be very good with flat direct contact heatpipe base being best fit for shape of Ryzen's heatspreader.
Alpenfohn Brocken 3 CPU Cooler - 140mm= £42.95

Though Scythe Mugen 5 is actually little heavier with mid density fin stack giving lots of surface area for reasonable size.
And Fuma 2 gives almost top performance while still maintaining good DIMM/PCIe clearances.
Scythe SCMG-5100 Mugen 5 Rev.B CPU Cooler= £43.99
Scythe SCFM-2000 FUMA 2 Dual Fan CPU Cooler - 2x120 mm= £49.99
Though both have Intel concave heatspreader optimized convex base (just like that BeQuiet and most others) and basically need to deform IHS down to start making wider contact with it.
(that could be solved by grinding/lapping base flat)

I'm currently using a Brocken 2 and had an original back in the day as well, had glanced at the Brocken 3 elsewhere and it didn't have AM4 listed as compatible so I just ruled it out without looking into it, but it obviously is compatible so I'd be happy to go down that route again. Useful tip about the heat spreader shape too, I was unaware of there being differences.

 

[EsaT]

I'm currently using a Brocken 2 and had an original back in the day as well, had glanced at the Brocken 3 elsewhere and it didn't have AM4 listed as compatible so I just ruled it out without looking into it, but it obviously is compatible so I'd be happy to go down that route again. Useful tip about the heat spreader shape too, I was unaware of there being differences.

Heatspreaders of Intel desktop CPUs are concave with "crater" in them:
https://www.igorslab.de/en/cpu-heat...asures-now-at-amd-and-intel-rethink-basics/4/
And with centered monolithic die contact there is the most critical for cooling.
So many makers have optimized their cooler to guarantee best contact at center.

Again AMD uses mostly smoothly convex heatspreaders and obviously two convex surfaces make good contact only in small area.
While modern chiplet design heat heat producing dies off center:
https://www.igorslab.de/en/cpu-heat...asures-now-at-amd-and-intel-rethink-basics/3/

High mounting pressure cooler can flatten heatspreader some amount over time.
But flat heatsink base is still the best.
Here's article of experiences of one user finding bad contact:
https://www.igorslab.de/en/kuehlerb...amd-and-conkav-reader-test-and-picture-story/
https://www.igorslab.de/en/kuehlerb...-and-conkav-reader-test-and-picture-story/20/
Pretty major difference in quality of contact before and after lapping heatsink's base.

This might have been that having cooler with more convex than average base:
https://www.overclockers.co.uk/foru...-matching-or-beating-scythe-mugen-5.18902588/
Flat bases are easy to manufacture.
But with non-flat surfaces fast and cheap doesn't go well with accuracy and there's likely variation in convexity of bases.

Though straightening and lapping heatsink's base is rather easy.

 

[opethdisciple]

snip

 

[Supernova]

Really useful thread this as I’m a bit out of the loop on CPUs. Pondering an upgrade from my 7700k (running @4.8) as it is limiting me over cities and large airports in MSFS 2020. It’s not the avg frames that’s the issue - but the stuttering and frame times dropping. Though my GPU is also an issue elsewhere. 5800X is a worthwhile upgrade I hope? Looking to pair with a 6700 XT (replacing a Vega 56).

 

[Joxeon]

Really useful thread this as I’m a bit out of the loop on CPUs. Pondering an upgrade from my 7700k (running @4.8) as it is limiting me over cities and large airports in MSFS 2020. It’s not the avg frames that’s the issue - but the stuttering and frame times dropping. Though my GPU is also an issue elsewhere. 5800X is a worthwhile upgrade I hope? Looking to pair with a 6700 XT (replacing a Vega 56).

What resolution are you running?.

 

[Supernova]

What resolution are you running?.

1080p on MSFS 2020. But 1440p on a different monitor for my racing sim.