Upgrade options for peak cooling/overclocking potential

ProfitMajin

ProfitMajin

ProfitMajin

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Hi All,

I'm looking to upgrade my existing case & CPU cooler in order to maximise the overclocking potential of my i7 4790k
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Background:

I have an older pc setup (4790k) in a Fractal Design Core 2300 case. I'm using an Arctic Liquid Freezer 240 (the 1st, not 2nd) upfront, but the tubes are at the top, and the front panel is enclosed, which are both limiting potential (and I can now hear pump/exchange whine).

Mobo is Asus z97 Pro Gamer
Ram is Kingston Beast 1866
GPU is Sapphire VEGA 56 Pulse

Desk space limits the new case to H475mmxD480mmxW230mm.
Desk space is open, other than the top of course (Ikea Fredde).

Cases
I've been looking at the following mid cases, which should fit in the space:
Phanteks p400a
Fractal Design Meshify C
Be Quiet dx500

And with potential issues:
Corsair 4000d Airflow (part-picker says the front panel won't work with mobo).
Lian Li 215 (potentially slightly too tall).

Cooling
I'm looking at:
Arctic Liquid Freezer II (240/280 depending on compatibility).

Big Air:
Noctua NH-D15 Chromax
Dark Rock Pro 4
(Although some cases state 160mm cooler limit, I've seen reddit posts of noctua d15 (165mm) in phanteks p400a)

Other smaller 'big air' coolers.

Question
Which of the following would provide the best/optimal solution:

1. Arctic 240mm in 'best' airflow case, such as Phanteks p400a (seems easiest/most compatible, but is it 'best'?).

2. Arctic 280mm in Lian Li 215 (case squeezed into the desk, ~20mm space for exhaust).
-280mm would limit me just to Lian Li 215 in order to install at the top of the case, to keep tubes on the bottom of the radiator.

3. Big Air squeezed into any of the mid cases (I've seen it fit, but would it limit airflow for GPU?)
-Also, would a Big Air cooler fit on an older board like mine? Looks like it would, but I'm not certain...

Ideally, I'd go with Big Air so that the cooler will last longer, and so be useful in a future upgrade, but it seems as though it'd have more compatibility issues, ironically.

TL;DR
looking for the 'best' cooling upgrade option for an aging setup, and it would be nice to also have it compatible with a future upgrade to Ryzen, for example.

Ta much!
M
 
Last edited:
Hi,

Thanks for the reply - I am leaning more towards Big Air, but how would it affect GPU thermals for squeezing in such a massive block in a smaller case?
Vega is already quite a hot chip, would I be trading GPU thermals for Big Air? (ie 10C hotter GPU for using Big Air due to airflow etc)

All of the scenarios above would be 'good', but I'm wondering which would be objectively best in a mid-case.

Thank you,
M
 
mickyflinn said:
As long as there's enough air flow the temps will be fine.
Click to expand...

That's the part I'm concerned about - If I squeeze Big Air into Phanteks p400a as an example, would there be sufficient airflow to allow the Vega to keep cool?
Would my CPU temps be higher for having the Vega card right up against it as seen in the pic?

It's been a long time since I've used Big Air coolers, and I'm open to using them again, just wondering if I'd be foolish to squeeze one into a mid-case.

Thank you,
M
 
Thank you for the replies, it seems to me that Big Air in the Phanteks p400a will be one of the better options to go for then.

I think it's safe to say that any of these solutions would be better than my current setup in the Core 2300 case, as I'm likely seeing higher temperatures on the Vega due to the front-mounted radiator as you say.

Last question - Is there any potential conflict with the higher heat spreaders on the Kingston Beast RAM? Where the mobo is older, I was looking for some empirical evidence that the Noctua wouldn't cause me issues.

Thanks again,
M
 
The p400a comes with 3 rgb fans that GN said are the same as the none rgb versions, with it coming with 3 120s would you recommend still switching out to 2x140s?

If so, I've got a couple corsair ml140s I could use up front, how would they compare against the ones you linked?

I'll have a read of the airflow article now.

Edit: Just read the article, I was planning on using 2x Corsair ML140s up top as well, I have 4 total so this would leave me with 2 to use up front if that's the better setup.

Should I also buy a 120 fan for the rear exhaust slot due to the D15's high CFM?

Thank you,
M
 
Last edited:
Ross Thomson said:
P400a with the arctic 360
Click to expand...
I didn't have this as an option as this would require having the tubes up top, which unfortunately reduces effectiveness, lifespan, and creates whine like in my current setup.

P400a has been getting a lot of positive attention though, so I think it's got to be that case really.

Thanks,
M
 
Ross Thomson said:
you can put the tubes at the top - I did this for years with my AIO's and never had an issue with performance, lifespan or whine. You can always put them at the bottom as well in the P400a can you not?

or go for a 280mm if you are that worried about space below the shelf.

or go for the p500 or p600 for a lot more space. (I have a p600)
Click to expand...

There's a GN video which showcases issues with tubes up top, the TL;DW is that in the short term you likely won't notice, but after a few years, with permeation and other effects, the pump is moving an ever greater amount of air through the block, which reduces performance, creates noise, and reduces lifespan of pump, just like with my current arctic 240.

As much as I might like to go for a 360, with a p400a I wouldn't be able to run the tubes to the bottom, due to both length of tubes, and the design of the shroud.

Larger cases are also unfortunately out of the question too, as it needs to fit the desk shelf which limits me to the dimensions of the cases listed.
 
phil-k said:
A couple of the cases on my shortlist are :
Corsair 4000D Mid-Tower Case
Corsair 4000D Airflow Mid-Tower Case
They both will take a 280mm radiator at the top
Click to expand...

Corsair 4000D Airflow is one of the cases on my original post, but part picker said that the front panel on the case wouldn't work with my old z97 board, the newer 3.2 header not being compatible evidently.
 
Thanks for all the replies, I've gone for a p400a with a Noctua D15 Chromax, planning to take the front fan off if needed. Should be plenty overkill for a 4790k, so gives me room to play around with fans and whatnot.
Thank you all,
Martin
 
I was actually wondering if removing the back pcie covers would be a good idea, would I not be paying a trade off with dust accumulation when the system is off though?

I was also going to get a replacement 120mm fan to go on front of the dh15 (due to clearance), and use the 140mm that would otherwise be there in top exhaust slot.

What are your thoughts on another 120mm on rear exhaust? I'd have thought that due to the cpu cooler being so close to the back I'd imagine it should provide the same effect.

M
 
This is brilliant thank you doyll!

I was watching some videos last night on Big air coolers which actually showed the same minor difference between the D15 and D15S, so I think I'll skip buying any 120s.

I won't be able to use the second 140 that comes with the D15 cooler either way, and was planning to mount it in the top exhaust. Would I be doing myself a disservice using that up there? I suppose I'll need to do some testing to know for sure...

Thanks again,
M
 
See I've read about airflow being less effective than believed, but there's also a bugger load of evidence to suggest that exhaust (concurrent with airflow direction) would still assist.

For example even GN standardised fan layout includes exhaust fan.

And although up top isn't concurrent with the airflow, it is with convection direction, I would have thought it'd help, but I guess testing should confirm that.

More curious than anything.

Thanks,
M
 
I've actually made the switch now, and have the setup in the new Phanteks p400a case, with the Noctua Chromax, which fit just fine. I mounted the second fan on the back, rather than the front, due to clearance, and other than that, no clearance issues at all.

The PC is now whisper-quiet in comparison to what I had before, the GPU thermals are much improved, now able to keep well below the 75C throttle mark, however, the CPU thermals have gotten *slightly* worse, maybe 4-5 degrees hotter than the Arctic I cooler it replaced. I'm running a 4.7Ghz OC on it atm, 1.25 core voltage, and 1.9 or so input voltage, so that's a fair amount, although the limiting factor is de-lidding which would likely alleviate a good 15C or so given the age of the part.
 
Doug2507 said:
Delid with LM will drop temp considerably. Made a lot easier these days with the Delid tool available unlike back in the day when everyone was using a razor blade! Fair chance you'll get 4.8 around 1.3ish after a delid.
Click to expand...

I think this is the way to go, as a while back I managed to boot to Windows @ 4.8Ghz and I think maybe even 4.9 (at least 4.85Ghz for sure), although that was just booting to Windows, the temps were way too high to do anything.

Besides, if I fluff it up, I suppose I'll just have to get a nice new Ryzen for Christmas :cool:
 
Hey Doyll! Thank you for the detailed reply, I just want to be sure I'm understanding you and getting the most out of the case.

I've not blocked the gaps around the fans just yet, as I built it quite recently and haven't got round to that part yet. Should I use electrical tape or similar to cover the gaps around the fans?

Regarding the GN setup, they use Noctua fans on the 'standardized' test, which is 2x Noctua intake, and 1x Noctua exhaust. Now, GN isn't the be-all and end-all, however, they have dived deeper than most on thermals, and it does make me wonder why they would be using an exhaust, instead of 3x Intake. Although that could just as easily be that 2xIntake and 1xExhaust is the more compatible 'standardization'.

I can certainly confirm the second fan on the D15 not making much difference, as I attached it after high temps during testing and saw a slight improvement at best, around 3-5 degrees. I also found a review/comparison where the D15S was indeed only a few degrees above the D15, which corroborates it not making much difference. I'm yet to test using the second fan as an exhaust up top.

The GPU temps are certainly much better with the improved airflow in this case vs the one it replaced, which was the main objective and so that's brilliant. It's likely as suggested earlier in the thread, I've gone from the AIO grabbing cool air from outside, and warming the GPU with it, to the case having cool air from outside, and the GPU likely warming the CPU cooler, even if only slightly.

M
 
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