Valve OS

Macro · 28 Nov 2013 at 12:07

I don't know which thread you're reading but i posted why i personally didn't think it was a great idea and struggled to see where it would fit and you responded by launching into "how much butthurt can you can into your post". If you're going to complain when you get some stick back or someone doesn't share your opinion maybe you should think about how you reply to people in the first place.?

I've been quite open and reasond why I dislike what I think Valve are attempting to do as well as taking on other peoples opinions when they highlighted scenarios it might work for them.

It's just an OS, you didn't need to get ansy.

In any case I think I've been quite clear on my feelings on the subject but will be happy to be persuaded otherwise if it proves good for PC gaming.

PhilGQ · 28 Nov 2013 at 12:37

MrMarvelous said:
Anyone know if there's a Beta to sign up for? Wouldn't mind trying this.

There is a beta, but you missed it. 200 Steam boxes were sent out. I don't think there is beta of just the OS by itself yet.

ZombieFan · 28 Nov 2013 at 13:16

Here's what the prototype units consist of:

GPU: Some units with NVidia Titan, some GTX780, some GTX760, and some GTX660
CPU: Some boxes with Intel i7-4770, some i5-4570, and some i3
RAM: 16GB DDR3-1600 (CPU), 3GB GDDR5 (GPU)
Storage: 1TB/8GB Hybrid SSHD
Power supply: Internal 450w 80Plus Gold
Dimensions: approx. 12 x 12.4 x 2.9 inches high

The funny thing is that you could buy one of these, re-format and install Windows and Steam running in fullscreen mode, and you would be able to run all your Steam games directly on your TV without having to stream. What's the point of SteamOS again? (apart from being free).

Aedus · 28 Nov 2013 at 13:22

Not really sure on the GabeCube, but SteamOS could be interesting.

Witcher1979 · 28 Nov 2013 at 13:24

ZombieFan said:
The funny thing is that you could buy one of these, re-format and install Windows and Steam running in fullscreen mode, and you would be able to run all your Steam games directly on your TV without having to stream. What's the point of SteamOS again? (apart from being free).

Could also use all your retails/non steam games on your TV as well. I am still interested in testing though to see what it is like and what you can do with it. The streaming part is streaming to another PC though from your main PC.

Raikiri · 28 Nov 2013 at 14:53

ZombieFan said:
What's the point of SteamOS again? (apart from being free).

A dedicated gaming OS allows for greater optimization and lower overheads for the RAM/CPU, gives some of the advantages that consoles have.

Witcher1979 said:
Could also use all your retails/non steam games on your TV as well. I am still interested in testing though to see what it is like and what you can do with it. The streaming part is streaming to another PC though from your main PC.

Yep. It would just be a PC with the TV as a screen, I do it all the time for non competitive games.

86JR · 29 Nov 2013 at 09:09

Here's what the prototype units consist of:

GPU: Some units with NVidia Titan, some GTX780, some GTX760, and some GTX660
CPU: Some boxes with Intel i7-4770, some i5-4570, and some i3
RAM: 16GB DDR3-1600 (CPU), 3GB GDDR5 (GPU)
Storage: 1TB/8GB Hybrid SSHD
Power supply: Internal 450w 80Plus Gold
Dimensions: approx. 12 x 12.4 x 2.9 inches high

Whut?

Warbie · 29 Nov 2013 at 11:25

ZombieFan said:
The funny thing is that you could buy one of these, re-format and install Windows and Steam running in fullscreen mode, and you would be able to run all your Steam games directly on your TV without having to stream. What's the point of SteamOS again? (apart from being free).

I may be mistaken here, but I thought the higher spec versions wouldn't be used so much for for streaming, but playing directly to the tv - albeit with the option to stream from another machine. The cheapo stream only versions will be low specced and exist just to stream content from a powerful PC somewhere else in the house. The latter I'll be all over, the former I don't care about.

ZombieFan · 29 Nov 2013 at 12:36

Warbie said:
I may be mistaken here, but I thought the higher spec versions wouldn't be used so much for for streaming, but playing directly to the tv - albeit with the option to stream from another machine. The cheapo stream only versions will be low specced and exist just to stream content from a powerful PC somewhere else in the house. The latter I'll be all over, the former I don't care about.

A cheaper version just for streaming makes sense. But that doesn't justify why anyone would keep SteamOS on the more expensive version if they can get a much better range of games by reinstalling Windows.

A dedicated gaming OS allows for greater optimization and lower overheads for the RAM/CPU, gives some of the advantages that consoles have

I would be interested in the perfomance differences, but considering it's a pretty powerful PC you're not going to run into too many problems running games under Windows instead of ~~Linux~~ SteamOS.

Mockingbird · 29 Nov 2013 at 12:55

ZombieFan said:
A cheaper version just for streaming makes sense. But that doesn't justify why anyone would keep SteamOS on the more expensive version if they can get a much better range of games by reinstalling Windows.

Windows isn't free - and the objective of the higher spec ones would appear to be similar to having a console (i.e. hassle-free, boot-up-and-use-it, no need for the thinkings/mouse and keyboard/anything else).

I guess anyone who's a regular on this forum is going to immediately mess about with it as much as possible and dual-boot win (for productivity) and SteamOS (for the performance increases it promises, if it pays off), or just replace it with their OS of choice if the SteamOS performace increases turn out to be so much hot air.

Paul_cz · 29 Nov 2013 at 13:20

If Valve suceeds and manages even some small portion of "console only" gamers to get a PC (in the form of Steam Machine), then that, is a WIN.
More gaming capable PCs in people's hands, better for everyone.

Personally, I am not a target audience - I already have a PC in my living room connected to 55" TV, and I already use Steam - so Valve are perfectly happy with me, like I am perfectly happy with them.

But people who do not have a PC, maybe are a bit scared of it, and want convenient, comfortable option of it, Steam Machines are for them.
And I for one thank Valve for doing this. Especially since SteamOS will be open and the computers themselves will be open as well.
It would be amazing if closed console platforms, thriving on forcing gamers into exclusive lockouts from games and DLCs, died out.

uncle_rufus · 29 Nov 2013 at 14:06

What I'm confused about is why do some people keep talking about SteamOS as if it's going to be even more restrictive than Windows/OSX?

I realise this is just conjecture on my part as well, but I picture SteamOS not as being some kind of Linux-derived but heavily locked down OS (like OSX) but an actual Linux derivative (of Ubuntu afaik) which has just been built with gaming in mind. If that turns out to be the case then it won't be locked down at all... It'll be like most other Linux distros out there - you want your Steambox to also download torrents in the background? Just install a torrent client... You want it to launch XBMC on startup? Just install XBMC and set it to do so... You want it to serve up your screenshots so you can view them from other devices on your network? Install Samba or NFS and point it to the relevant folders...

All the way up to - You want to take SteamOS apart and build your own Linux derivative using many of its features? Sure, go for it...

Perhaps I'm being naive but I can't imagine the support they've gotten from the Linux community and developers would have been so strong if they were planning to go the route some people are suggesting

Paul_cz · 29 Nov 2013 at 14:48

Precisely, Uncle Rufus (I love that username

). Valve explicitely wrote that SteamOS will be open and modifiable. The Steam Machines will be completely open too, upgradeable, Windows 7/8+ supporting...
So anyone who hates on this is probably just misinformed.

uncle_rufus · 29 Nov 2013 at 15:29

Paul_cz said:
Precisely, Uncle Rufus (I love that username )

Haha thanks

Macro · 29 Nov 2013 at 18:07

uncle_rufus said:
What I'm confused about is why do some people keep talking about SteamOS as if it's going to be even more restrictive than Windows/OSX?

I realise this is just conjecture on my part as well, but I picture SteamOS not as being some kind of Linux-derived but heavily locked down OS (like OSX) but an actual Linux derivative (of Ubuntu afaik) which has just been built with gaming in mind. If that turns out to be the case then it won't be locked down at all... It'll be like most other Linux distros out there - you want your Steambox to also download torrents in the background? Just install a torrent client... You want it to launch XBMC on startup? Just install XBMC and set it to do so... You want it to serve up your screenshots so you can view them from other devices on your network? Install Samba or NFS and point it to the relevant folders...

All the way up to - You want to take SteamOS apart and build your own Linux derivative using many of its features? Sure, go for it...

Perhaps I'm being naive but I can't imagine the support they've gotten from the Linux community and developers would have been so strong if they were planning to go the route some people are suggesting

It's not so much the OS that is restrictive (although that remains to be seen) it's steam itself. All the games are DRM'd preventing you doing something even as simple as lending a game to a friend or selling it on when you've finished with it (or indeed being able to buy second hand games). With Windows there are other places and options to buy games so you don't have to be locked down by Steam, with SteamOS valve obviously hope to be the sole distribution platform, in particular if the games will have to be bought through Steam and only run on SteamOS locking out any other distro. They will in effect tie down the whole Linux gaming ecosystem leaving no choice other than "buy expensive drm games through steam".

Now you could argue that's better than the current (almost)no native Linux gaming ecosystem at all, but then there are other choices.

I just don't think we should be under any misapprehension that based on Steam, Valve intend to lock any new Linux gaming community into Valve

uncle_rufus · 29 Nov 2013 at 23:16

Macro said:
It's not so much the OS that is restrictive (although that remains to be seen) it's steam itself. All the games are DRM'd preventing you doing something even as simple as lending a game to a friend or selling it on when you've finished with it (or indeed being able to buy second hand games).

Well that's how Steam has always worked and the size of their userbase doesn't lie - a whole lot of people don't consider the way Steam works to be a problem... The 2nd hand games market on the PC has always had issues, and with the completely crazy prices the games on Steam go for in the sales anyway allowing people to make money back on pre-owned games (which aren't even physical copies) would be just idiotic on their part - why do you feel they owe us that? Is £3.74 for Skyrim in a sale not cheap enough for you and you'd rather have it for £3.00 with none of that going to the developer?

Macro said:
With Windows there are other places and options to buy games so you don't have to be locked down by Steam, with SteamOS valve obviously hope to be the sole distribution platform, in particular if the games will have to be bought through Steam and only run on SteamOS locking out any other distro. They will in effect tie down the whole Linux gaming ecosystem leaving no choice other than "buy expensive drm games through steam".

I don't see this... As already mentioned being a Linux derivative means that if you want to install a game which works natively in Linux you're more than welcome to do so, or you could use WINE to play certain windows games, all under SteamOS (probably, as discussed above)... And in terms of games released through Steam yeah you'll need either SteamOS or the Steam client on another Linux distro to play them - this is exactly how it already works now so why is this any different?

There is no "tie down" in Linux... no matter how successful SteamOS is there is such diversity in different users and distros and the entire ethos of the Linux community that there will always be people gaming on Linux in other ways - perhaps using WINE or sticking to native Linux titles, perhaps using their own obscure Manjaro kernel that they've hacked the Steam client into working on - perhaps emulating an entire Steam-alike interface with a bespoke emacs config (this one's for you fellow lisp-wizards

)...

Also expensive games? I don't think PC gaming has ever been as economical and a lot of that is down to Valve