We need a war.

[Amp34]

except they turned them off and modern reactors, it simply can't happen as you have to add fuel to make the reactor go, where Chernobyl you had excess fuel and you had to control the reaction. (I know that's not exactly what happens, but in laymen terms)

And you will need to turn off the safety measures in the hermetically sealed buildings once in a while.

one you spelt it wrong, two that's the worst example you could have chosen. if you read up on it you'll understand why.

Anyway you're both arguing semantics, you must realise what I mean so i'll leave it at that.

(Yeah I did think that at the time but that's the first thing that came into my head, and i'm hungry)

 

[Tefal]

Anyway you're both arguing semantics, you must realise what I mean so i'll leave it at that.

except it;s not semantics, hence the reason no British NPP has ever had a Chernobyl esq incident.

and based on the success rate 1 failure in hundreds of farms is hardly a concern.

 

[Amp34]

And that will never change, just because you have vertical farming, doesn't mean you would use identical crops in the thousands and thousands of farms.

Yet more scaremongering in face of no facts.

That was in response to Tefal's comment where he said just that, one "perfect" strain.

And actually diversity in wheat strains is decreasing as higher yield strains are being made and farmers are using those select few.

Read up on the seed banks and you'll see what I am talking about.

 

[Amp34]

except it;s not semantics, hence the reason no British NPP has ever had a Chernobyl esq incident.

and based on the success rate 1 failure in hundreds of farms is hardly a concern.

If you really don't realise what I was aiming at then I give up, forget about Chernobyl and think of the phrase "never put all your eggs in one basket". Or perhaps think about the "unsinkable" ship, the Titanic, what happened to that?

So your perfect single strain crop in their perfectly sealed building sill be perfectly fine...

 

[Tefal]

That was in response to Tefal's comment where he said just that, one "perfect" strain.

indeed a perfect stairn does not mean only one it means it is bet for it;s use. ie for brown bread ne GM crop may be best for white another fo, and thats disregarding the huge diversity in crop types.

 

[Will_3rd]

I agree, we need to get the bomb factories up to 100% production or the entire economy is going collapse.

Besides the Kremlin has been itching for the real thing for years.

 

[Tefal]

If you really don't realise what I was aiming at then I give up, forget about Chernobyl and think of the phrase "never put all your eggs in one basket". Or perhaps think about the "unsinkable" ship, the Titanic, what happened to that?

So your perfect single strain crop in their perfectly sealed building sill be perfectly fine...

except it would be in thousands of buildings along with thousands of other crops. ie at worst 1 wheat, 1 barley, 1 leak, 1 cabbage (of every variaty for tase) 1 orange 1 apple tec etc. there is such diversity combined with chemicals and modification and redundancies as to make your argument worthless.
Chernobyl did not destroy the Russian power grid when it went down for example.

 

[Tefal]

Besides the Kremlin has been itching for the real thing for years.

yeah and if it liked could wipe the entire of Britain's surface clean, without difficulty. we could not do the same.

 

[Glaucus]

.

And actually diversity in wheat strains is decreasing as higher yield strains are being made and farmers are using those select few.

Read up on the seed banks and you'll see what I am talking about.

Nice contradiction. diversity isn't falling as we have these banks which are good. vertical farming would allow more strains to be grown as the temperature and climate can be controlled.

 

[Gilo]

Not really, resource wise there's isn't really any limits on earth. If you use renewable energy/and/or fusion everything else is fine...

Also you can mine other planets, you don't have to colonise them.

so things like natural ore on earth are unlimitless?

For effective off world mining you would probably need a substantial orbiting infrastructure with some of the population living in space.

We could easily for millennia, and until the population reaches spectacular numbers.

are you saying it does have an upper limit?

 

[Tefal]

so things like natural ore on earth are unlimitless?

except we don;t need ore, with advances in carbon technology there's enough there to build more than we;d ever need.

are you saying it does have an upper limit?

on current materials science yes, but it;s so high as to be pointless.

 

[Glaucus]

so things like natural ore on earth are unlimitless?

?

Not unlimited but not an issue for a very long time.
Have you got any idea how big earth is and how much resources it contains. we will not hit any material supply issues for 100's of years.

 

[Vern1961]

Read "Down to a Sunless Sea", by David Graham (if you can track down a copy) for a chilling albeit fictional account of how global Armageddon could come about.

War at least practised to modern doctrines and excluding the use of bio or nuclear weapons on large civilian populations would not be a particularly efficient means of reducing population. The policy seems to be shock and awe, going for the decapitation of the leadership rather than 1000's of cannon fodder having at each other on the battlefield. As regrettable as even a single casualty in Iraq or Afghanistan might be, compared to even 20th century conflicts the numbers are negligible.

The main problem with population is that everyone wants to live in the established areas, no one wants to live in a hut on Rannoch Moor or the top of Snowdon (apart from oddball survivalists). If the whole planet was covered in concrete, where is the fresh oxygen going to come from (something that crosses my mind every time I watch Star Wars and the shots of Coruscant).

 

[Glaucus]

The main problem with population is that everyone wants to live in the established areas, no one wants to live in a hut on Rannoch Moor or the top of Snowdon (apart from oddball survivalists). If the whole planet was covered in concrete, where is the fresh oxygen going to come from (something that crosses my mind every time I watch Star Wars and the shots of Coruscant).

The sea, oxygen would not be a problem we don't consume enough.

 

[yantorsen]

The planet is getting too populated, come on iran and US, launch those nukes already , only joking, but on a serious note though the planet is getting far to crowded, were going to end up being knocked off by the time were 30 in the future lol

there's plenty of space left, what we really need to do is find affordable efficient ways of making deserts/tundra etc more habbitable.

 

[Amp34]

Nice contradiction. diversity isn't falling as we have these banks which are good. vertical farming would allow more strains to be grown as the temperature and climate can be controlled.

The strains used are becoming very close, and diversity is falling. The banks are to stop the diversity falling even more. There is a real worry about the falling diversity in our main staples.

 

[Weebull]

The main problem with population is that everyone wants to live in the established areas, no one wants to live in a hut on Rannoch Moor or the top of Snowdon (apart from oddball survivalists). If the whole planet was covered in concrete, where is the fresh oxygen going to come from (something that crosses my mind every time I watch Star Wars and the shots of Coruscant).

I remember reading a P.J. O'Rourke book that said if the population of the planet all lived in a giant city with the population density of New York City, it would fit within roughly two states of america.

EDIT: According to some rough maths, you could apparently fit everyone into Texas!

Although I do kind of agree with you. The problem isn't people wanting to live within built-up, city areas so much, more people wanting large, detached suburban houses with plenty of garden. That takes up far more land space per person/family than an apartment would.

 

[Glaucus]

The strains used are becoming very close, and diversity is falling. The banks are to stop the diversity falling even more. There is a real worry about the falling diversity in our main staples.

Mainly because of EU, all veg and fruit has to be x,y,z shape, size , flavour.

I also disagree for the last decade our farming has been increasing strains and variety used as more and more people want to try new and different things.

 

[Gilo]

except we don;t need ore, with advances in carbon technology there's enough there to build more than we;d ever need.

on current materials science yes, but it;s so high as to be pointless.

Not unlimited but not an issue for a very long time.
Have you got any idea how big earth is and how much resources it contains. we will not hit any material supply issues for 100's of years.

I just wanted clarification on the point as I got the impression from your other posts that the planet could sustain an infinite number of people.

Technological advances are not guaranteed. and as technology does advance you need less and less workers which will introduce social and economical problems into the equation. Nevermind the effects that such a massive population will have on nature.

 

[Tefal]

I just wanted clarification on the point as I got the impression from your other posts that the planet could sustain an infinite number of people.

Not infinate but more than we will ever have trying to live here

Technological advances are not guarenteed. and as technology does advance you need less and less workers which will introduce social and economical problems into the equation. Nevermind the effects that such a massive population will have on nature.

as technology increases you require new types of workers, not less.


and man can do without nature, and who really cares.