Wheel tracking/alignment - Tyre recommendations too
- Thread starter Scuzi
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ad75 said:
Im comtemplating these myself, look amazing.
Soldato
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Changing the wheel alignment involves adjusting the suspension geometery, so they are one and the same. Cost me about £65 to get my Mondeo done last year, but it made a real difference to the feel of the car and everyone who drives it comments how straight it tracks at speed.
Before and after settings on my car (PDF)
As you can see it was the left rear that had too much toe in, and the total toe on both rear wheels was well out. This was needing a touch of steering to the left to correct it all the time which scrubbed the inside edge of the right front. It shows the reason why a normal tracking is often of new use - the front track was pretty much level (its shown in red because I asked them to use the ST220 settings which set the front wheels exactly parallel, the ST TDCi wasn't on their system but normally runs a little more toe in on the front than the ST220).
That was done using a Hunter DSP600 setup - they put the car on a scissor lift with turnplates so they can turn the steering wheel with it on the ramp. They attached targets to each of the wheels which reflect a laser beam and took a reading, then they bounced the car a bit and ran through moving the steering lock to lock a few times and took the final before reading. They then made the adjustments which appear on the screen in real time so the fitter can see what effect its having. Once its all OK they do a printout like the one i've attached.
It sounds like you have too much toe out somewhere to scrub the outsude edges, but your tyre size won't help with big sidewalls givng a lot of flex if you throw the car around a lot, but these laser alignment machines will show you exactly what the wheels are doing.
If you're getting new tyres you want the alignment set with the new tyres on, preferably as soon as possible after they are fitted.
Before and after settings on my car (PDF)
As you can see it was the left rear that had too much toe in, and the total toe on both rear wheels was well out. This was needing a touch of steering to the left to correct it all the time which scrubbed the inside edge of the right front. It shows the reason why a normal tracking is often of new use - the front track was pretty much level (its shown in red because I asked them to use the ST220 settings which set the front wheels exactly parallel, the ST TDCi wasn't on their system but normally runs a little more toe in on the front than the ST220).
That was done using a Hunter DSP600 setup - they put the car on a scissor lift with turnplates so they can turn the steering wheel with it on the ramp. They attached targets to each of the wheels which reflect a laser beam and took a reading, then they bounced the car a bit and ran through moving the steering lock to lock a few times and took the final before reading. They then made the adjustments which appear on the screen in real time so the fitter can see what effect its having. Once its all OK they do a printout like the one i've attached.
It sounds like you have too much toe out somewhere to scrub the outsude edges, but your tyre size won't help with big sidewalls givng a lot of flex if you throw the car around a lot, but these laser alignment machines will show you exactly what the wheels are doing.
If you're getting new tyres you want the alignment set with the new tyres on, preferably as soon as possible after they are fitted.
I have just swapped my Toyo-r's for Bridgestone Potenza RE720's
I didn't get too bad a life out of my Toyo's though I was fortunate that I could swap front for rears half way through their life. Here is a pic of my Toyos at the end of their life
As you can see the outside edges are rather soft and dissapear a fair bit quicker than the rest of the tyre if you press on a bit. The main tread was still above the wear bar though! I thought the tracking might have been out but nope it was spot on still when I had it checked.
I now have Potenza RE720's on the gti-6. First impressions were there isn't the same outright grip but I am warming to them more and more. The turn in feels much crisper and sure footed and doesn't unsettle my car so much. The rear end does feel a little looser but with front wheel drive I am learning to use this to make the car tuck more in corners using a fraction of lift off. My only worry is how quickly these will wear out. Here is a shot after about 60miles of getting the tyres and scrubbing them in
I did want to fit Goodyear F1's to my car too this time after all the good reports. I can only get them in GDS2 design though in my tyres size
I was still going to try them but the place i use said their supplier was on backorder and I wanted new tyres ASAP!
I didn't get too bad a life out of my Toyo's though I was fortunate that I could swap front for rears half way through their life. Here is a pic of my Toyos at the end of their life
As you can see the outside edges are rather soft and dissapear a fair bit quicker than the rest of the tyre if you press on a bit. The main tread was still above the wear bar though! I thought the tracking might have been out but nope it was spot on still when I had it checked.
I now have Potenza RE720's on the gti-6. First impressions were there isn't the same outright grip but I am warming to them more and more. The turn in feels much crisper and sure footed and doesn't unsettle my car so much. The rear end does feel a little looser but with front wheel drive I am learning to use this to make the car tuck more in corners using a fraction of lift off. My only worry is how quickly these will wear out. Here is a shot after about 60miles of getting the tyres and scrubbing them in
I did want to fit Goodyear F1's to my car too this time after all the good reports. I can only get them in GDS2 design though in my tyres size
I was still going to try them but the place i use said their supplier was on backorder and I wanted new tyres ASAP!
With a little bit of patience it is possibly to set your own tracking (toe in/out) and camber at home, with only one "tool".
If anyone is interested I'll let you know how it's done. I paid £240 for my first geo setup but now do it all myself.
If anyone is interested I'll let you know how it's done. I paid £240 for my first geo setup but now do it all myself.
Berger said:
Ive tried varying it as some things say 2.3bar others say 2.5bar. My pug book that came with the car states 2.5bar but that seems rather high to me? the Haynes automotive technical data boook states 2.3bar.
I questioned the place fitting my tyres and that came up as 2.5bar too, though we did have to look at the book a bit to find it for the pug 306 gti-6.
On the 306gti6 site people run between 32-36 to suite their individual driving styles.
I'm just waiting to see what happens to the edges of the new Bridgestones now. I dont think a few psi is what caused the 720's to start the edges of the tread ripping up though, it does feel like quite a soft tyre to me. I guess this is the case as I'm sure the physical amount of rubber in contact with the road is less than with the toyos but they want to keep the grip levels up.