You could run the same thing for a Kia Sportage vs a Range Rover.
When are you going fully electric?
- Thread starter Ricochet J
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You could run the same thing for a Kia Sportage vs a Range Rover.
You might want to check that ID3 number, the version they tested has a 58kwh battery, the cheapest version has 45kwh battery and it only has a WLTP of 217 miles, the version tested is 260 miles.
I work it out to be £125/mile with the life spec, upgraded 58kwh battery and no other options. £28,420 after the grant / 226 miles range.
What a useless comparison. Everybody knows the original purchase cost of the car is irrelevant but what counts is the depreciation. Now if somebody did a £/mile based on 3 years and 10k miles per annum and its depreciation then that would be a useful chart.
No surprised the sportscar came out top of the cost per mile.............
Check that number on the Renault Zoe too, the cheapest version is £27,595 after the grant making it £132/mile of range.
You can also buy a new one for significantly less than the number on the Renault website.
Edit: yes, completely agree with the above, it’s a silly metric, particularly where you are comparing a bottom spec ID.3 that has steal wheels and next to nothing else to a Tesla which is basically fully loaded from the factory and has few options or a big SUV.
It only makes sense to compare cars in this way which are from similar segments, spec, performance and quality levels.
You can also buy a new one for significantly less than the number on the Renault website.
Edit: yes, completely agree with the above, it’s a silly metric, particularly where you are comparing a bottom spec ID.3 that has steal wheels and next to nothing else to a Tesla which is basically fully loaded from the factory and has few options or a big SUV.
It only makes sense to compare cars in this way which are from similar segments, spec, performance and quality levels.
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You could! I doubt the disparity of value would be quite so great though. Perhaps a better comparison is a Tesla Model 3 Performance versus a Taycan - somewhere around 60% of the /mile value, yet same performance? In my mind the Porsche is vastly over-priced.
Oh, good catch, n1. I will edit my post. Still a bargain
What a useless comparison. Everybody knows the original purchase cost of the car is irrelevant but what counts is the depreciation. Now if somebody did a £/mile based on 3 years and 10k miles per annum and its depreciation then that would be a useful chart.
No surprised the sportscar came out top of the cost per mile.............
lol, don't know if being sarcy! I don't care a jot about the depreciation, every car is a money-sink
That is a good point though, and theoretically do-able if I get bored enough to look for the data. Where would I get depreciation from? It also doesn't really work for the newest models (Q4 eTron for instance)I disagree. That's the point of presenting it this way. Most people's biggest limiters on BEV choice would be cost and range. This gives you a feel for the relative value there, at the baseline for the car spec they tested. Clearly, as you go up the range and spec sheet, the financial value diminishes (but the experience value increases)
Oh, and also @b0rn2sk8 I priced for the exact spec of Zoe they tested, not what's cheapest.
You could! I doubt the disparity of value would be quite so great though. Perhaps a better comparison is a Tesla Model 3 Performance versus a Taycan - somewhere around 60% of the /mile value, yet same performance? In my mind the Porsche is vastly over-priced.
Oh, good catch, n1. I will edit my post. Still a bargain
lol, don't know if being sarcy! I don't care a jot about the depreciation, every car is a money-sink
I disagree. That's the point of presenting it this way. Most people's biggest limiters on BEV choice would be cost and range. This gives you a feel for the relative value there, at the baseline for the car spec they tested. Clearly, as you go up the range and spec sheet, the financial value diminishes (but the experience value increases)
Oh, and also @b0rn2sk8 I priced for the exact spec of Zoe they tested, not what's cheapest.
If your looking at the spec they actually tested for the ID.3 then it was the slightly more powerful version and was actually £29,740 after the grant with no options or £131.59.
I also disagree on the usefulness of the metric. Once you have enough range then other things start taking president and in reality going above 250 real word miles doesn’t add huge amounts of value to most people. But say going from 100 to 200 would.
I agree cost is a barrier but most people are more interested in the PCP cost than the list price. Outside of Tesla, Polestar and Porsche (because you’ll want £30k of options!), the list prices are meaningless anyway because people don’t actually pay them. You can pick up a Zoe for a lot less than Renault say on their website.
And on the Porsche point, there’s so much more to a car than price and range. The quality of the Porsche is an order of magnitude nicer than the Tesla and that’s what you are paying for, that and the badge.
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Soldato
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You need to add 10k onto that Porsche RRP 
Some interesting points, and I partly agree. But not on everything. In my experience (as EV owner for 4 years and latterly driving a change to a fleet of hundreds of co car drivers), I can tell you that people are not rational about car ranges. Even if they only take lil' Timmy to the shops 10 miles/day, and only travel 100 miles once per year, most people make a decision based on fear (range anxiety) rather than practicality. For those who lack the imagination or will to visualise the change, anything less than the 600 miles in a diesel tank is unacceptable. Practically I completely agree with the 250+ range statement, but only in a Tesla at present for true long journey drivers (200+ each way for instance). In the future, a lot more so for other mfrs.
There's also the seasonal issue - I wonder how the relative differences in efficiency and tech would amplify in less favourable conditions - it would be great to do that value comparison given real-world winter ranges.
PCP pricing, oh yes. But even then, people do make that mental calculation about the price they pay versus capability. Our first Zoe cost us very little, but I can't make a quick n dirty comparison based on market variables and haggling! If anything, it's only likely to amplify the differences between the top end and the bottom,a as you pointed out, showing the even bigger gap between Taycan and reality.
And once again on the quality of the Porsche, based on what? Handling on the track? Irrelevant for most drivers. Reliability? I sincerely doubt that it's any better than a new Tesla M3P or S, or Audi. Quality of stitching on the dash? That certainly doesn't account for the gulf in value in my head versus Tesla or Audi. The ridiculous value that people place on the £1 plastic badge on the bonnet? Valueless to me, but priceless for so many, and that's the point!
Soldato
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Got two gears in the rear axle. That’s worth mega £k
It is a really weird car from a size perspective. In isolation and in photos it generally looks bigger than it actually is in reality. It is bigger than our Fiesta ST but not massively so (more so in the visual side of being wider and taller).
Biggest area it may not work for some people is the relative lack of room in the back. I am relatively short and even with the drivers seat in my position I find it somewhat cramped i the back. Boot size is ok for its size but could do with being a bit wider.
All that being said I love driving it. Just so relaxing... well apart from the bit where Orbit Culture/Cypecore is blaring out of the sound system...
Also I like being consistent....
Started the week on 94% battery and an estimated range (GoM) of 328 miles. Finished the week after driving ~142 miles with 55% and 184 miles remaining. Pretty much 1 for 1 (144 consumed, driven 142).
Soldato
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Impressive numbers regardless of size. And great when you start to trust and understand the range GoM. (guess o meter)
I returned from the South West today. Decent run trying decent A30 & motorway speed around 77mph cruise but often used the hills to build momentum only over taken probably 5 times so making progress as such.
The car has impressed me this trip, longer range with the battery at temp etc seems to pay dividends. Even fully loaded up with 5 people and luggage it’s effortless.
Planned to stop at Cribbs for quick wander anyway but I reckon in these ambient temps where the battery system isn’t trying to heat planet Earth in conjunction with the cells and then slowing down to 68mph or so I could have done it none stop. (65miles left as you can see and ~110miles to home).
The CYC/Source West charger at Cribbs Mall wasn’t playing ball so grabbed enough + headroom to get home at Mollies Diner again. 28kWh in 21mins ~ 80kW avg is ace for 30p/kWh. Especially as the bulk of the trip was free granny charge juice.
This was cool in Wadebridge.
I returned from the South West today. Decent run trying decent A30 & motorway speed around 77mph cruise but often used the hills to build momentum
only over taken probably 5 times so making progress as such.
The car has impressed me this trip, longer range with the battery at temp etc seems to pay dividends. Even fully loaded up with 5 people and luggage it’s effortless.
Planned to stop at Cribbs for quick wander anyway but I reckon in these ambient temps where the battery system isn’t trying to heat planet Earth in conjunction with the cells and then slowing down to 68mph or so I could have done it none stop. (65miles left as you can see and ~110miles to home).
The CYC/Source West charger at Cribbs Mall wasn’t playing ball so grabbed enough + headroom to get home at Mollies Diner again. 28kWh in 21mins ~ 80kW avg is ace for 30p/kWh. Especially as the bulk of the trip was free granny charge juice.
This was cool in Wadebridge.
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Car is too big for that sort of efficiency
Soldato
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I don’t think I’d ever see it that high in real world motorway driving, 3.3 maybe with the 83-84kWh available would be close to WLTP of 282miles.
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with a similar strategy for the private buyer that would incentivise the, thought it was, only 1/3rd of private buyers.
it's a rear camera shot - excellent ... how do they come out at night time.
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like the fleetnews article I posted a while back money talks and with zero bik it was a case of sign me up - what range anxiety. - they had a better more cynical phrase,
with a similar strategy for the private buyer that would incentivise the, thought it was, only 1/3rd of private buyers.
Yeah I'm amazed people ignore the size of a car and think the efficient cars have some sort of magical powertrain. Reality is the high m/kwh cars are small slippy things
Reminds me of the fact that due to how coefficient of drag figures work a Model X has a smaller effective frontal area than a Lotus Elise (dont tell Nasher
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