Which Uni?

  • Warwick - has an e-sports centre + an hour and a half away from home (attended open day).

  • UEA - the Law facilities look good and the smallish campus seems friendly + an hour and a half away from home (attended open day).

  • Kent - a good Uni, but 3 and a half hours away + most likely an expensive area?
A sensitive lad with a mum who does EVERYTHING for him, very little experience of the real world.


I can't offer specific advice on the course or uni but from my experience, university snobbery exists during graduate recruitment, so the highest ranked / most prestigious institution would be best.

I believe Warwick is ranked the highest; #9 here: https://www.thecompleteuniversityguide.co.uk/league-tables/rankings

Being the nearest is mutually beneficial too. Far enough away so he learns how to cook toast. Near enough that visits aren’t a chore.

I am not a lawyer myself. I do work for a law firm. Many of my family are in law; a lawyer, a retired judge, two barristers, and a parol officer.

A regular topic of conversation, at work, or with family, is how hard it is to become a trainee lawyer. They general mantra proclaimed goes something like, “if you don’t have a 2.1, from a Russell Group university, don’t bother.” Warwick is a member (https://www.theuniguide.co.uk/advice/choosing-a-course/what-is-the-russell-group)

So while I hate to say it, unfortunately, I have to agree with Luckystrike123. I’ve seen the decline in junior and trainee posts in some legal areas. The barrister’s chambers would offer 3-4 junior spots 15-20 years ago. Now they mostly offer only 1 junior role. The competition is fierce. Unless they’ve something special, high grades, from a Red Brick, their CV tends to get lost in the tide. I really wish that wasn’t the case
 
They seemed to drop off a cliff somewhere around maybe 1997 or so - before that they used to be pretty popular. There seemed to be a lot of dodgy goings on with GNVQs and HNDs, etc. around that time as well which might be related.

BTECs went from being a well-respected qualification to something you got free in a breakfast cereal box.
 
I forgot to mention, it’s not impossible to become a lawyer from a non-red brick.
One of the family graduated from Southbank and managed it. It’s just harder from our experience
 
Since an LLB will have to have certain modules in order to satisfy the law society, I don't think there is going to be a much difference in terms of the course itself and its delivery. I originally studied law at Wolverhampton Uni, which at the time was ranked something like 74th in the country for that subject.

I also spend some time in law lectures at Birmingham university, and took law modules at UEA where I eventually did my degree (in another subject). The teaching was similar at all of them in both the style and the delivery, but I felt I learned the most/better at Wolverhampton. That was also the only place where you could choose between attending the 2 hour lecture for a specific topic or catch the condensed version in the evening that was taught to part-timers. It gave more flexibility. It's also worth thinking about the actual buildings. Birmingham whilst the buildings looked pretty on the outside were cold and cramped inside.

UEA is pretty strict and controlling. I was fined in total £550 in my first year for various misdemeanours, partying, library fines, other student stuff etc.. It also thinks a little much of itself. I remember wanting to go to Austria on Erasmus, but was told my school MGT wouldn't allow it as they could guarantee the quality of the teaching would be up to their standard. When I initially tried to transfer from Wolverhampton to Law at UEA they weren't interested in the pretty much full marks I'd got at Wolves, where as University Collage London were happy to consider my results if accompanied by a letter from a member of the faculty.

On the other hand Life at UEA was pretty good, but expensive. IIRC the UEA students union was one of the richest in the country. Mostly through over charging. The union shop was more than twice the price of the one at Wolverhampton. The bar was way more expensive too, but that funding was/is put to good use. There's excellent funding for sports and societies. Though the competition for facilities is huge.

The campus is a bit of a concrete jungle set in a parkland area, now with some more modern buildings thrown in. It's a nice place in general, I just wish they'd paint the concrete buildings white.

The Law school is actually quite away (a 5 min walk) from the other buildings in Earlham Hall a 17th century building in Earlham Park. A few people I know that studied law there went on to grad schemes a places like PWC and had their LPC fees sponsored.

Norwich itself is a pleasant city. A bit weird and isolated, but safe and pleasant. It's kind of the end of the line, so no-one goes there unless they work there, live there, study, or have a boyfriend or girlfriend living there. The UEA campus is about 2 miles out, so you have the best of both worlds. There's an arts university there, and City college with is large too so loads of students around. And being the largest city in the region, (it's larger than Cambridge but more condensed), it does attract a good number of companies. With it being the former HQ of Norwich Union (now Aviva), Marsh and Marsh and Mclennan, there, PWC, Virgin Money etc..

Always plenty going on, and just a short drive to the beach (though I admit it took me 3 years before I went).

Rankings are an interesting one Warwick has a good reputation. It's 10th overall in the UK (UEA is 22nd) and in the top 100 in the world. In someways that matters, and in others it doesn't matter one jot.

For what I moved there to do UEA was second best in the country. But I think both the general and course specific rankings need to be taken with a pinch of salt. They tend to include research, happiness etc.. rather than pure teaching quality, which I also don't think means much given my experiences.

I think over the years UEA has become more of a money grab, desperate for international students and the cash they bring. I believe it has opened up an international school and runs courses in London with ties to China.

Anyway best to visit them. I remember getting an offer from Aberystwyth, then visiting and thinking hell no. Also visited Plymouth which had a California beach bum vibe, so also a hard no.

I think you’ll find it’s a fine city. It even says it on the sign.

Oh man, I made that mistake the first time I tried to get a bus into the city. Got a right lecture. They are quite particular.
 
Last edited:
I believe Warwick is ranked the highest; #9 here: https://www.thecompleteuniversityguide.co.uk/league-tables/rankings

Being the nearest is mutually beneficial too. Far enough away so he learns how to cook toast. Near enough that visits aren’t a chore.

I am not a lawyer myself. I do work for a law firm. Many of my family are in law; a lawyer, a retired judge, two barristers, and a parol officer.

A regular topic of conversation, at work, or with family, is how hard it is to become a trainee lawyer. They general mantra proclaimed goes something like, “if you don’t have a 2.1, from a Russell Group university, don’t bother.” Warwick is a member (https://www.theuniguide.co.uk/advice/choosing-a-course/what-is-the-russell-group)

So while I hate to say it, unfortunately, I have to agree with Luckystrike123. I’ve seen the decline in junior and trainee posts in some legal areas. The barrister’s chambers would offer 3-4 junior spots 15-20 years ago. Now they mostly offer only 1 junior role. The competition is fierce. Unless they’ve something special, high grades, from a Red Brick, their CV tends to get lost in the tide. I really wish that wasn’t the case

Damn, that's grim :(

Just wondering what would be available with a law degree if solicitor etc wasn't to be :(
 
He's a good kid getting great grades with offers to great Uni's - and you're questioning the parent skills?

Meh - he gets his meals made for him, clothes washed and ironed - he does have his own bank account which he pays for stuff himself. Due to covid, he missed out on work experience and other social activities, much like most other kids at that age.

Agreed I had all that before I went to uni and in my second year jetted off to Toronto to study.

Sure it's a life change but I promise anyone that a uni life is much easier than working and paying rent etc plus it's more fun.
 
Damn, that's grim :(

Just wondering what would be available with a law degree if solicitor etc wasn't to be :(

Pretty much everything that is open to a business degree or history degree etc.., plus things like civil service etc..

You also get people that will do an undergrad degree in a subject, then do a top up degree (usually 12 months) to get a qualifying law degree.

The whole system has/is being shook up a bit since my time, but the point is many people who study/read law will end up in other fields.
 
Last edited:
Damn, that's grim :(

Just wondering what would be available with a law degree if solicitor etc wasn't to be :(

it’s why you have to think really carefully before committing to a law degree. Perhaps in ways that you do not for alternative degrees.

A top degree from a uni with a top name is the best thing you can do for your prospects of becoming a lawyer.
 
Well looking back i went because i was interested in computers and the idea of learning to programme was interesting so that sold it to me. I’m not from an academic family so i wasn’t pushed to go to uni at all let alone one of the prestigious ones.
Snap. Literally exactly the same as you except networking.
 
TBH, looking at grade inflation of degrees, degrees are going the same way.

That's why the institution is still quite important for plenty of employers. In an ideal world it shouldn't be but in reality brand name recognition can really open doors.

In general Oxbridge + top London colleges (ICL*, UCL, LSE) + Warwick are invariably among the "target" institutions for some of the best paying grad employers, others seem to vary according to the whims of management.

That can make a huge difference in your chances of getting into some roles, big difference in your initial career trajectory (and the ability to change it early on if desired). That isn't to say that someone from a mid-ranking university can't also end up in those sorts of roles but that it could be harder for them, they're more of a long shot.

(*Obvs Imperial is mostly science/engineering and doesn't offer law degrees AFAIK)
 
TBH, looking at grade inflation of degrees, degrees are going the same way.

This is why chartership is growing, certainly in the engineering space to add a bit of gravitas to your degree. You have to prove vocational and technical knowledge. What's good about charterships is that even apprenticeships can count towards it as you "learn as you earn".

Is there an equivalent of chartership in law? Or is it passing your Bar?

It is true though that it still seems to depend on the degree and whether it's a bachelor's or master's and what university and what grade you get. Not always but to a certain amount. There's a lot of snobbishness around MBAs.
 
This is why chartership is growing, certainly in the engineering space to add a bit of gravitas to your degree. You have to prove vocational and technical knowledge. What's good about charterships is that even apprenticeships can count towards it as you "learn as you earn".

Is there an equivalent of chartership in law? Or is it passing your Bar?

It is true though that it still seems to depend on the degree and whether it's a bachelor's or master's and what university and what grade you get. Not always but to a certain amount. There's a lot of snobbishness around MBAs.

Never understood the snobbishness around MBAs. It's just a 12 month course. In the US they are handed out like candy without ever having to have been in work. In civilised society you normally need a minimum of 3 years experience in a managerial role. Warwick actually has a very good MBA and there used to be a waiting list of blue chip companies to work with graduates during the course.

As for qualifying in law it used to be you'd do an LLB 3 year degree, then a 12 month legal practice course (LPC) for solicitors, then 2 years working in a firm. For barristers the LPC is replaced with the barrister training course BTC. It's all regulated by the Law Society. Then there was the 12 dinners.

The other route for solicitors was reaching a certain level through work experience and the Institute of Legal Executive courses.

It's funny I remember that you needed a 2:1 for the LPC, but now it seems a 2:2 is accepted. Not that it maters though as you're going to struggle to get a contract with a 2:2

Anyway some of this is changing with the new Solicitor's Qualifying Examination. Which means you won't need a law degree or LPC (any will do), but most likely they'll still exist as a means of prep for the SQE.
 
Is there an equivalent of chartership in law? Or is it passing your Bar?

That's an American thing, they have a single legal profession and have to pass the bar exam for the state they're in.

In the UK the legal profession is split into Solicitors and Barristers (the latter of whom do advocacy work in courst, though some solicitors can now do that too with further training). Solicitors have to take a legal practice course and undergo a training contract at a firm of solicitors. Barristers have a similar professional training course and undergo a "pupilage" sort of an apprenticeship within a barrister's chambers, they're then "called to the bar".
 
Fascinating. Thanks for the explanation. No wonder the friends I know that did law were destroyed in their first few years, seems intense!
 
That's an American thing, they have a single legal profession and have to pass the bar exam for the state they're in.

In the UK the legal profession is split into Solicitors and Barristers (the latter of whom do advocacy work in courst, though some solicitors can now do that too with further training). Solicitors have to take a legal practice course and undergo a training contract at a firm of solicitors. Barristers have a similar professional training course and undergo a "pupilage" sort of an apprenticeship within a barrister's chambers, they're then "called to the bar".


One amendment to that- you can get called once you finish your BPTC and do your 12 qualifying sessions at your Inn of Court. Means a lot of “non-practising” barristers out there who paid their money but never trained. Unlike solicitors where once you finish your LPC you have to complete 2 year training contract before you’re admitted to the Roll of Solicitors and are a solicitor.
 
Just wondering what would be available with a law degree if solicitor etc wasn't to be :(

Nearly all professional service sectors look out for people with Law degrees, including tax/accountancy/audit and the wider financial services and the insurance sector. A law degree translates very well to all of those, more so than any other degree that isn't in that particular subject IMO.

Loads of places you wouldn't think of also have graduate jobs in the law profession which sit outside the traditional law firms like the public sector, they have armies of solicitors at their disposal for obvious reasons.

In terms of the specific uni, target the ones you like with the highest ranking in a particular subject or the overall ranking/prestige it has. Like it or not, there is a lot of snobbery when it comes to institutions still.
 
Back
Top Bottom