Wife Vs HR

Dis86 · Friday at 18:24

A nice fun one!

Wife has been formally warned that she's now on a stage 2 warning for her attendance at work. This has apparently been triggered as a result of 2 absences within a short period of time, in line with the workplace attendance policy.

Yes. That vague.

The reason for the absences is emergency care of dependents, something we're both already aware is protected within law and cannot trigger any negative consequences.
She does not have a copy of the attendance policy. One is not available on their HR portal (not even mentioned). No other staff member has a copy. It simply appears not to exist.

She's already had a number of run-ins with HR after promised payrises didn't materialise (written records from her line manager and the head detailing the raises had been awarded) and they removed certain benefits she received during maternity leave.

This warning was delivered not by HR, but under duress by her line manager who made it clear to her.

HR are either utterly incompetent or acting maliciously here. Would you continue to let HR dig themselves in to a hole? Push back now? Go for legal action? Any thoughts on angles you'd take an arguments you'd make for this would be appreciated.

Participant · Friday at 18:33

The attendance policy is normally in the original contract / T&C of employment. Was she given a copy of that?

Also, my next steps would be to start looking for a new job, just in case. I take it there are no union considerations here?

tom_e · Friday at 18:39

Talk to Acas and go from there but as participant says probably also time to start job hunting if they're that inept.

Finners · Friday at 18:39

How long has she worked there?

Felon · Friday at 18:42

Dis86 said:
Would you continue to let HR dig themselves in to a hole? Push back now? Go for legal action?

I doubt there's a legal angle here, because she's just been warned she hasn't been fired, if she was fired then you potentially could get legal help.

Also agree with @tom_e that ACAS are probably worth speaking to.

Dis86 · Friday at 18:44

Participant said:
The attendance policy is normally in the original contract / T&C of employment. Was she given a copy of that?

Also, my next steps would be to start looking for a new job, just in case. I take it there are no union considerations here?

Nope, not there, first place we checked. Union is an option however her union rep is a bit...meh.

As it happens she's already looking for a new job. Bit of additional background is that it used to be a fantastic place to work but it was taken over. The original senior management team were all removed and replacements brought in. It has utterly destroyed the culture there and the performance.

Dis86 · Friday at 18:44

Finners said:
How long has she worked there?

15 years.

shifty_uk · Friday at 18:45

I never understand how people can stay in jobs when there’s any level of animosity. I get job hopping isn’t easy but I’d get the ball rolling.

shifty_uk · Friday at 18:46

Dis86 said:
15 years.

What a shame, there’s not many that would stick with a company that long these days

Bear · Friday at 18:50

Just spoke to the wife who is an HR director and she said to appeal the warning and to send a link to HR that points to the .gov website https://www.gov.uk/time-off-for-dependants that states she is allowed to take time off for emergencies to look after dependents.

Goodie · Friday at 18:52

Where was stage 1?

Dis86 · Friday at 18:56

Goodie said:
Where was stage 1?

Exactly. They skipped it.

Bear · Friday at 19:01

It sounds like they are trying to constructively dismiss her

Diddums · Friday at 19:02

Dis86 said:
Exactly. They skipped it.

Well then they need to get their **** together. That's not acceptable and as a manager, I'd be dragged over the coals for it.

booyaka · Friday at 19:03

Dis86 said:
A nice fun one!

Wife has been formally warned that she's now on a stage 2 warning for her attendance at work. This has apparently been triggered as a result of 2 absences within a short period of time, in line with the workplace attendance policy.

Yes. That vague.

The reason for the absences is emergency care of dependents, something we're both already aware is protected within law and cannot trigger any negative consequences.
She does not have a copy of the attendance policy. One is not available on their HR portal (not even mentioned). No other staff member has a copy. It simply appears not to exist.

She's already had a number of run-ins with HR after promised payrises didn't materialise (written records from her line manager and the head detailing the raises had been awarded) and they removed certain benefits she received during maternity leave.

This warning was delivered not by HR, but under duress by her line manager who made it clear to her.

HR are either utterly incompetent or acting maliciously here. Would you continue to let HR dig themselves in to a hole? Push back now? Go for legal action? Any thoughts on angles you'd take an arguments you'd make for this would be appreciated.

Anything actually issued in writing? Or just verbally "issued"

If it's in writing there has to be a section which refers to the actual sections of the contract/Workplace attendance policy...

I would formally write to the HR department asking for a full copy of the said policy - if they can't produce something, then it simply doesn't exist.

Dis86 · Friday at 19:04

Bear said:
It sounds like they are trying to constructively dismiss her

That was our thought. She's basically the last of the old 'regime'.

Bear · Friday at 19:10

Dis86 said:
That was our thought. She's basically the last of the old 'regime'.

The wife says appeal the warning ASAP as some companies only allow a certain amount of time to appeal, else she would have to raise a grievance

Dis86 · Friday at 19:11

Bear said:
The wife says appeal the warning ASAP as some companies only allow a certain amount of time to appeal, else she would have to raise a grievance

Will do. Pass on my thanks to her please. That random man on the Internet she will never encounter

Nutty667 · Friday at 19:17

I'd be talking to an employment solicitor about potential tribunal or something.
Especially if they're trying to punish her for emergency dependent care.

Pants · Friday at 19:36

Solicitors etc seems premature at this stage. I would for now email the manager & HR with:

Dear x & y,

Please could you send me a copy of the workplace attendance policy referenced and let me know where it is usually available.

Could you also send me evidence that I was previously on a stage 1 warning, as my understanding is that I was not previously on a warning for attendance.

Finally I would like to re-iterate that the reason for the absences is emergency care of dependents. In reference to https://www.gov.uk/time-off-for-dependants I don't believe this should result in a warning.

I would appreciate your confirmation that the warnings have been rescinded.

Regards, blah, blah.

(then also get the hell out of there as soon as a decent opportunity comes up)