Windows 8 is a Joke!
- Thread starter jeffa123
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but Microsoft hasn't blocked people from using 3rd party programs to get the normal start menu back.
people seem to be fixed on Microsoft must offer every option/setting etc.
Soldato
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Heh - you don't understand users. If you did then you'd realise that something as 'simple' as changing associations isn't simple unless you know that it's an option. Most enterprise users wouldn't have the foggiest. Certainly they would be using a corporate image although for W8 at the early stage it's more likely that they've been an early adopter and got an OEM modified build plonked on their desk by IT. They'd be trying it out to see if it's viable for a broader rollout and the more frustrations that they have to deal with the less likely they'd be to have positive feedback.
As for experience in these things, I've been in the IT industry for the last 16 years and am currently a Senior Engineer. I deal with this stuff every day and I can assure you that your simplest assumptions of what you 'think' a user should be able to do does not match reality. The reality is that these people walk into the office, turn their computer on, go get a tea or coffee, fire up their App of choice (Word, Excel, HR app, Accounting app etc) and split their time between that and their emails. All the extra functionality within the OS needs to be relatively seamless and they expect it to be like an Apple (to just work - that's a lame tech joke by the way). Windows 8 throws up countless workflow breakers that constantly throw people like needing to WindowsD all the time to get back to the desktop.
Microsoft have made an error with removing familiarity that I believe they will struggle to overcome - In my opinion.
Its been repeated already. You can turn off metro, so there is only the desktop. The users never need to use Windows+D. If its an image you can lock them down to just one app if required. So they don't even have a desktop or file mangler/explorer. Your reply seem to completely oblivious to any of this.
16yrs might seem like a lot. But the office I'm in we have Dec Alpha's running longer that. I've only about 20+ in IT. Some people in my office have 30yrs+in IT. Except it wasn't called IT back then, it was called central records, or data processing etc and they used punch cards.
If you learn anything in IT its that you never know everything. Even the least experienced person might know something that you don't.
My current gen of a support call is asking someone to email me an id number. They thought the best way was to take a screengrab, print it out, then scan it back in on a printer using the scan to PDF and email functionality. All because they didn't know how to cut and paste into an email. Consider then that its a user thats been working on a computer for at least 10yrs. Oh and they took a screengrab that didn't have the number in it....and they've been asked for this number every time they email or ring over the last 10yrs. I'm only here about 10yrs I'm probably just out of new guy status for some. They've probably being doing the same crud for longer than that.
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That's an issue alright. But I think the issue really is the changes don't improve the user experience, or add any new functionality. There's no incentive/benefit to change. For Joe Soap.
Unless of course you like the other changes under the hood, ignoring Metro. Things like the shared environment between your windows phone, and your computer/tablet. The better hardware support, minor speed bumps, things like that.
you can break the workflow with a bad corporate image quite well enough without the help of windows 8! just associate an unfamiliar application with a file and that will throw your average user regardless of what os, and you can do a well thought out windows 8 build that doesnt pull you away from the desktop.
As this thread shows people aren't aware of this and are unwilling/too stupid to look for a fix or embrace the change.
Offering it as an option would spoon feed these people and stop them crying into their corn flakes every morning because "Windows 8 is a joke"
MW
I recently bought a laptop that had w8 installed but opted to swap out the slow 1tb hdd for a fast 240gb ssd, needless to say I could not clone the software to the new drive for love nor money so had to put w7 on...
I have since received an install disc and so have upgraded w7 to w8... my initial thoughts were OMG, were is everything, but after 30 minutes sorting out Metro to show only what I want and adding my most used apps to the taskbar, i'm quite happy and at ease with w8, it feels much faster and more responsive than w7, sure now and them I have found myself needing an app not on metro or my taskbar, but two seconds sorts that out and so don't see what all the fuss is about, I boot up and as soon as I log in I hit windows-D to get my desktop and rarely need to go near metro again, so it's not an issue.
A few minutes of your time and patience and it's worth it for such small niggles.
Admittedly I don't get the need for metro on a desktop (to clunky when you have a lot of apps) and would have thought it should be an option during the initial setup to choose between desktop mode or metro for the startup/login but it's really not that big of a deal surely unless you like quick access to Lots of apps but then there are ways around all of that too.
I have since received an install disc and so have upgraded w7 to w8... my initial thoughts were OMG, were is everything, but after 30 minutes sorting out Metro to show only what I want and adding my most used apps to the taskbar, i'm quite happy and at ease with w8, it feels much faster and more responsive than w7, sure now and them I have found myself needing an app not on metro or my taskbar, but two seconds sorts that out and so don't see what all the fuss is about, I boot up and as soon as I log in I hit windows-D to get my desktop and rarely need to go near metro again, so it's not an issue.
A few minutes of your time and patience and it's worth it for such small niggles.
Admittedly I don't get the need for metro on a desktop (to clunky when you have a lot of apps) and would have thought it should be an option during the initial setup to choose between desktop mode or metro for the startup/login but it's really not that big of a deal surely unless you like quick access to Lots of apps but then there are ways around all of that too.
Soldato
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Have you thought through the implications of a company like Microsoft releasing an OS that needs to be fixed out of the box with a 3rd party purchase especially in light of how easy it is to just acquiesce to their customers desires. It's foolish and belligerent. Who is more stupid, the users or the company that can't just add the feature because it doesn't fit to their own vision?
but it doesn't need fixing. it's just that some people can't get over not having a start menu. but theres an simple fix for them already.
doesnt it depend on whether you think it needs fixed or not. Majority of our users dont use the startmenu, using almost exlusivly desktop icons, so it not being there is total non issue, and a good build would mean they rarely, if ever need to see the metro UI, just as our users now barely if ever see the start menu.
At the end of the day microsoft didnt just do it without thinking, they collected lots of stats and found that the start menu usage was dying out, they maybe underestimated how vocal that portion of there users would be, but they are making some comprimise with 8.1 and adding a visual link between the desktop and the start screen by reinstating the start button.
Soldato
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Says you. There are an awful lot more that would disagree with you. I personally think that it's a dogs breakfast that you learn to work with - the changes make no improvement to workflow at all unless you're using a touch interface, and what does the majority of MS's user base use? Mouse and keyboard... foolish.
There's nothing wrong with the concept of metro it's just been implemented very poorly. It's feels like beta software.
Tech companies have many hits and misses over time. It's part of the process.
If Metro was truly an improvement they would have had no problem.
But since you can turn it off its kinda pointless to keep complaining about it while overlooking everything else.
Tech companies have many hits and misses over time. It's part of the process.
If Metro was truly an improvement they would have had no problem.
But since you can turn it off its kinda pointless to keep complaining about it while overlooking everything else.
touch screen argument is rubbish, just because it has better touch screen functionality it has no detrimental effect on the ability to use the mouse or keyboard.
what would be foolish is if microsoft had released another desktop, mouse and keyboard only OS, when there customers have been shouting for years for better touch screen support from there OS, windows 7 wasnt very good in this area so MS have responded, and overall it fits with the idea of a unified OS across mutiple platforms, tablets, phones etc, whilst currently these roles are usually filled by Iphone etc which dont integrate very effectivly with an existing MS enviroment, the idea of a windows solution that meets all those needs is an appealing one. Its what Microsofts customers have been asking them for, it may not be your idea of what is needed currently but I would say you are wide of the mark, Microsoft know what their customers are asking for and are trying to provide it. As with any change there is often teething problems so they havent been perfect in their implementation but one thing is for sure if they had released another windows that was desktop only, retained the start menu etc etc, basically what some people seemed to want was windows 7 again, well doing that would have been foolish really as it would have been largly ignored and unneeded, and could have consigned windows to the scrapheap of irrelevance in todays changing enviroment.
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I think you forget Win8 is a hybrid OS,Metro works great for touch devices like phones,tablets etc and a lot better then the old start menu could ever do(its too small for touch devices),also Metro works fine with mouse and keyboard as Zuban mentioned even on a desktop PC,I do feel some users just don't like change or want to be spoon fed ,very sad times indeed.
I can have a lot more of my programs listed then I could ever pin on the old start button menu, (it was limited in a lot of ways ) with Metro I can use the whole screen if I want and have my own columns/tiles as well as use the old desktop UI for shortcuts and taskbar etc..
Btw remember Win8 is their first hybrid OS so expect faults and improvements down the road,look at Win7 it took 18 years from Win95 to Win7 to get where it is(UI virtually remain unchanged however),also desktop users in the old days had no competition with other hardware,nowadays its different with plenty of tablet,phone users out there as well and Win8 was designed to handle it all,this is what some desktop users can't understand and something Microsoft want to cover ,sorry you guys(desktop users) are no longer the only kid on the block so too speak.
99% of the moaning/bitching is desktop users,I consider myself a desktop/gamer user first but adaptable to the operating systems I use ,end of story.
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Do you have proof of that? I suspect there's an equal amount that would agree with him, or just don't care either way and are just getting on with it without the constant need to moan just because it's a little bit different.
Win8 is very easy to use,I spent two weeks learning all I could even with Metro,then I made Win8 work for me ie had all my programs in both Metro and old desktop UI organised to my needs,it paid off since now I've a very easy to use Win8 on all my PCs,I did the same for my Linux PCs as well,its a lot better then bitching and resisting change,it pays of 100x fold in the end.
I don't even use touch(unless you count my Android tablet and smartphone).
When Win9 arrives I will do the same thing,learn all I can and have it organised to my needs,simple it's not rocket science.
I use a mouse and metro has improvement a lot the way I use windows.
people had to lean a new UI and find shortcuts etc. coming from 3.11 to 95. so it's the same thing now. I know 95 had a option to use the 3.11 UI. but for windows 8 you've still got ways to get the old UI back even for free.
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