RIP Adam Johnson / Ice Hockey player

Soldato
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Perhaps I'm super naive but when I went to that game a few weeks back I was really surprised at just how violent it is when you're up close and personal to the rink. The force some of the players were hitting each other at was no joke.

I just can't imagine a ice hockey player would deliberately and maliciously try to slice the throat of a colleague. Sure, they're opponents and things get rough out there but that's part of the sport. When final time comes the sportsmanship kicks back in.

Perhaps the guy did do it on purpose. I've seen the video and it is odd how stiff his leg is and the position it is in before the impact but I've only seen 1 ice hockey game in my entire life. I'm not qualified enough to say it was or wasn't intentional.
 
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Perhaps I'm super naive but when I went to that game a few weeks back I was really surprised at just how violent it is when you're up close and personal to the rink. The force some of the players were hitting each other at was no joke.

I just can't imagine a ice hockey player would deliberately and maliciously try to slice the throat of a colleague. Sure, they're opponents and things get rough out there but that's part of the sport. When final time comes the sportsmanship kicks back in.

Perhaps the guy did do it on purpose. I've seen the video and it is odd how stiff his leg is and the position it is in before the impact but I've only seen 1 ice hockey game in my entire life. I'm not qualified enough to say it was or wasn't intentional.
Hence why he was arrested on suspicion of manslaughter and not murder. Involuntary manslaughter means causing a death without intention to cause grievous harm or kill the victim, the death is caused by recklessness or gross negligence. It appears like he deliberately made contact in this way, the question is was it reckless or negligent (beyond the usual scope of such tackles).
 

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Soldato
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Been a follower and player of the game since my Army days after being stationed out in Canada when i was 19 (52 now) and huge Panthers fan season ticket holder yada yada and when over to the states on business always try to get a game in. The direct hitting has calmed down a great deal you still get them but the game is now so much faster you have to time the big hits to perfection and its a joy to watch and have never seen anything like this and I have witnessed/watched some real dirty dirty hits.

This is a really really tough one to call and well out of my realm of comfort zone but it was on the dirty side as hits go.
 
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Hence why he was arrested on suspicion of manslaughter and not murder. Involuntary manslaughter means causing a death without intention to cause grievous harm or kill the victim, the death is caused by recklessness or gross negligence. It appears like he deliberately made contact in this way, the question is was it reckless or negligent (beyond the usual scope of such tackles).

I understand how/why he was arrested. It's more a general comment aimed at people using his history and role on the team as an indication it was a thought out action. It's the same when a big crash happens in F1. I don't believe any normal competitor ever wants to bring harm to their opponent. Accidents, sure. But stepping into a moment thinking "I want to hurt this guy" I just find it hard to grasp. Not to say some players out there aren't like that though.

Probably an issue with myself more than anything. I'm having the assumption that all players are fair.
 

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Soldato
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They are, some are just Hard as nails with a attitude to back it up. Only met one who was a complete knob off the ice.
 
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The other side of the pond are laughing at us. Literally for our complete lack of understanding of the game and skating. I mean it's pretty unanimous too, other than those usual hate twitter accounts that drive up engagement without every being interested in hockey.

I mean they have grown up watching this where someone intentionally drove someone's head into the metal glass support. 5 minute penalty and game misconduct.


Or Evans hit after scoring, this is game where people do try to hurt without question.


I don't think people in this Country that have never shown any interest in the sport until now have any real idea how fast and hard this game is played. I watched the Canadiens game this morning and Guhle took a skate to the face which luckily just cut his lip.


These guys can try to punch the **** out of each other, what happens if one of them dies in the NHL, it's a illegal action do you think they would get jail time?

If he gets convicted of this they might as well make hockey in the UK non contact. Quite how they convict someone when even Adam Johnsons team mates have explained how it happened and was an accident is anyone's guess at this point.
 
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The other side of the pond are laughing at us. Literally for our complete lack of understanding of the game and skating. I mean it's pretty unanimous too, other than those usual hate twitter accounts that drive up engagement without every being interested in hockey.

I mean they have grown up watching this where someone intentionally drove someone's head into the metal glass support. 5 minute penalty and game misconduct.


Or Evans hit after scoring, this is game where people do try to hurt without question.


I don't think people in this Country that have never shown any interest in the sport until now have any real idea how fast and hard this game is played. I watched the Canadiens game this morning and Guhle took a skate to the face which luckily just cut his lip.


These guys can try to punch the **** out of each other, what happens if one of them dies in the NHL, it's a illegal action do you think they would get jail time?

If he gets convicted of this they might as well make hockey in the UK non contact. Quite how they convict someone when even Adam Johnsons team mates have explained how it happened and was an accident is anyone's guess at this point.
Agree with all of this.

*If* it is found to have been intentional (which seems incredibly unlikely, not least because the allegation is involuntary manslaughter) then he should get the book thrown at him, but every person who actually understands and has a long standing relationship with the sport has said that the video certainly does not show intent.

And the point about what it means for other sports is equally relevant and important. If there had been a similar reaction to Phil Hughes's tragic death, that would probably have been the end of bouncers in cricket which would have changed the sport beyond recognition. Similarly, people die or suffer life changing injuries in rugby scrums, in American Football, obviously in boxing and wrestling. If that can lead to charges for the "perpetrator", all of those sports would change dramatically.

It's sport. Most sports have an element of danger, and you accept that when you step onto the field of play regardless of what level you're playing at. If somebody is shown to have done something dangerous which sits so far outside the realms of the sport which you're playing that you'd never expect it to happen when stepping on the field of play, then that person should face the consequences, and what Petgrave did comes close to that line. In my opinion, though, there will rightly be a huge burden to get over that line, however.

The interaction with the law in general is a really interesting one. The law doesn't provide for carve-outs for consent (see the famous and slightly disgusting case of R v Brown), but clearly it accepts that what happens on a sports field sits slightly outside of the usual, otherwise there would be assault charges all over the place.
 
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Sadly, as many industries have found out, safety regulations are often written in blood. Quite why neck guards weren’t already mandatory I don’t know. I know incidents like this are rare but it only takes one off balance event like this to show safety should have been considered before, especially as they’re mandatory in lower leagues and age groups. You’d never see lesser safety regulations at a higher level in motorsport for example.
 

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Soldato
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Sadly, as many industries have found out, safety regulations are often written in blood. Quite why neck guards weren’t already mandatory I don’t know. I know incidents like this are rare but it only takes one off balance event like this to show safety should have been considered before, especially as they’re mandatory in lower leagues and age groups. You’d never see lesser safety regulations at a higher level in motorsport for example.

Because its sport.... Why are TT riders allowed to ride bikes, why are bike riders not forced to wear more protective clothing as they can pedal at 40mph + quite easily.

Life is risk its and its a choice.
 
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Because its sport.... Why are TT riders allowed to ride bikes, why are bike riders not forced to wear more protective clothing as they can pedal at 40mph + quite easily.

Life is risk its and its a choice.
TT riders wear Leathers and a Helmet. It's mandatory. Neck guards should be too, as they are in lower leagues and younger leagues.
 
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Because its sport.... Why are TT riders allowed to ride bikes, why are bike riders not forced to wear more protective clothing as they can pedal at 40mph + quite easily.

Life is risk its and its a choice.
Ive never seen someone ride the TT in t shirt and shorts, no helmet. Why? Because there are rules to stop that level of stupidity.
They were a number of protective gear to protect them in an incident, but the nature of the TT is extremely dangerous and has the ability to end your life in a split second.

This should not be the case with Ice Hockey and it was proven recently, that it is possible, as a result something has to change.
 
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It's mandatory. Neck guards should be too, as they are in lower leagues and younger leagues.
No they shouldn't because there aren't very good. They should be when they have refined the product. They protect such a small area of the neck, like a tiny turtle neck top. There's zero evidence that it would have stopped this poor guy dying. They can do their best to mitigate risk but it's still a hugely dangerous sport. These next protectors won't stop you dying if you get a puck at 100mph to the throat, so should they wear complete neck padding because of that very real threat?
 
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