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Old 25th Mar 2013, 09:56   #1
AMDMatt
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RadeonPro - How To Remove Micro stutter & Improve Frame Latency

If you're suffering from micro stutter or poor frame latency you can use RadeonPro to improve things, dramatically in some cases. This applies to multi gpu mainly but can also improve performance for single card users as well.

Here are my frame time results for playing battlefield 3.




When i start using RadeonPro though im seeing much more consistent results.




If i can improve single card latency that much with only using one gpu, then you can be sure it will have twice the effect for crossfire.


How To Set It Up

Disable vsync and triple buffering in game. If there is no option to disable triple buffering then assume that having vsync off will automatically disable it.

1. Add the game exe to the RadeonPro profile list.
2. Change Vsync to always on.
3. Tick Triple Buffering. (Crossfire users DO NOT TICK triple buffering - The extra frame buffer will only add latency that will be twice as noticeable on a multi gpu setup)
4. Tick dynamic frame rate control.
5 Put in 1-2 fps below your monitors refresh rate. - Don't forget to put in your monitors refresh rate in the box above, 60 or 120hz.



If you're unable to maintain this fps please use your average, or just below your average fps. Do not go any lower than 45. For best results id recommend a minimum of 50. 58-59 is ideal for 60hz monitors providing you can maintain that fps. 120hz - 60fps or higher depending on the amount of frames you can produce. Multi gpu setups can most likely use a higher fps because they have more grunt.


6. Under advanced tick flip que size and change it to 1.




If you don't wish to use Vsync or don't mind screen tearing then simply untick triple buffering and change vsync to 'Driver Default' in RadeonPro.

If you want to use a Dynamic vsync which will use vsync but the second fps drops below 60 vsync will be auto disabled then select Dynamic from the drop down box.

Other overlays can interfere with RadeonPro and make games crash if you have them running when starting a game. So make sure you shut down afterburner, fraps, team speak etc before you load the game with RadeonPro running. Once the game is loaded you can alt tab out and start up afterburner safely.

Last edited by AMDMatt; 25th Mar 2013 at 16:17.
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Old 25th Mar 2013, 10:01   #2
PaulyD
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Nice guide Matt.

I have always done the beginning part myself and noticed it kept things silky smooth with no tearing at a constant 59/60fps with no input lag.

What does the Flip Queue size do exactly?

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 10:03   #3
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Originally Posted by PaulyD View Post
Nice guide Matt.

I have always done the beginning part myself and noticed it kept things silky smooth with no tearing at a constant 59/60fps with no input lag.

What does the Flip Queue size do exactly?
It changes how many fps the gpu renders ahead. Default is 3. Changing it to one not only decreases latency but it decreases stutter as well as frames aren't held in the buffer for so long.

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 10:16   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LtMatt View Post
3. Tick Triple Buffering. (Crossfire users DO NOT TICK triple buffering - The extra frame buffer will only add latency that will by twice as noticeable on a multi gpu setup)
That will explain why it was worse when I tried it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LtMatt View Post
Other overlays can interfere with RadeonPro and make games crash if you have them running when starting a game. So make sure you shut down afterburner, fraps etc before you load the game with RadeonPro running. Once the game is loaded you can alt tab out and start up afterburner safely.
Radeon Pro has it's own OSD(that is less intrusive than AB's), can save having the likes of AB open at all, eliminating any conflicts altogether.

Another top guide from the Lt I may add, your creeping up on my legendery status matt.


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Old 25th Mar 2013, 10:21   #5
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Originally Posted by tommybhoy View Post
That will explain why it was worse when I tried it.
Yes i forgot to mention that when i advised you last.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tommybhoy View Post
Radeon Pro has it's own OSD(that is less intrusive than AB's), can save having the likes of AB open at all, eliminating any conflicts altogether.

Another top guide from the Lt I may add, your creeping up on my legendery status matt.
Thanks Tommy.

Have you been able to get HWINFO to work with RadeonPro? I'd miss my VRM/CPU temps if i ditched msi afterburner+hwinfo. For now im using all three together. I just shut down afterburner before i load a game with radeonpro then once its loaded i start up afterburner again.

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 10:29   #6
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HWINFO is moot now matt as the Ice-Q's vrm report a constant 24c.

Had a good play late last night on the new BF3 maps(capture the flag on motor bikes is utter bedlam)@1200/1550 rock solid, my vrms must be coping with the task-totally eliminating me getting concerned about vrm temps.


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Old 25th Mar 2013, 10:31   #7
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HWINFO is moot now matt as the Ice-Q's vrm report a constant 24c.

Had a good play late last night on the new BF3 maps(capture the flag on motor bikes is utter bedlam)@1200/1550 rock solid, my vrms must be coping with the task-totally eliminating me getting concerned about vrm temps.
Sometimes its better not to know.

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 11:06   #8
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Nice guide thanks

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 11:13   #9
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Sometimes its better not to know.
You're not still fiddling are you?

PS4 :/
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Old 25th Mar 2013, 11:22   #10
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Nice guide thanks
Thanks.

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Originally Posted by Rusty0611 View Post
You're not still fiddling are you?
Not until Pete has sent Tommy the Gelid heat sink. Then once tommy has worked his dremel magic on it i will be fiddling once again and hopefully for the last time.

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 12:12   #11
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Nice guide matt. I been using almost the same setup only difference is setting fps 1/2 below refresh rate. I might check this out.


My Setup - http://goo.gl/nDxJMN "YNWA"
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Old 25th Mar 2013, 12:15   #12
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Originally Posted by shankly1985 View Post
Nice guide matt. I been using almost the same setup only difference is setting fps 1/2 below refresh rate. I might check this out.
I used some info from your original RadeonPro thread so thanks to you as well.

I used to use afterburner only and enforce a fps cap (with vsync applied in game) via that but using the settings i posted above not only provides smoother performance, you also get less input latency.

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 12:20   #13
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Does the dynamic vsync add any kind of input lag at all? Every time I've tried various methods of vsync it has added some level of input lag.
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Old 25th Mar 2013, 12:24   #14
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Does the dynamic vsync add any kind of input lag at all? Every time I've tried various methods of vsync it has added some level of input lag.
This is not dynamic vsync. Vsync is always on in the guide above. However if you hate input lag you can do the above without vsync. Just untick triple buffering and change Vsync always on to Driver Default. You can use dynamic vsync in RadeonPro if you want to though, just pick the Dynamic option. Vsync will be turned off the second fps dips below 60. This will still provide a smooth experience. I should probably add that in some sort to the OP, thanks.

In regards to your question. Limiting the fps to below that of the monitors refresh rate (60hz =59-58fps) should remove most of the input lag you get with vsync. It depends on your monitor if you can notice it or not. I can barely notice it and as i hate tearing i always use the settings posted in the OP. Best bet is to try it for yourself and see which works best for you.

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 12:31   #15
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I never notice input lag from vsync. They not been one game where having vsync on made input worst.
I also hate screen tear spoils the game for me lol

Quote:
Originally Posted by LtMatt View Post
I used some info from your original RadeonPro thread so thanks to you as well.

I used to use afterburner only and enforce a fps cap (with vsync applied in game) via that but using the settings i posted above not only provides smoother performance, you also get less input latency.
Glad I was some help


My Setup - http://goo.gl/nDxJMN "YNWA"
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Old 25th Mar 2013, 12:33   #16
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Originally Posted by shankly1985 View Post
I never notice input lag from vsync. They not been one game where having vsync on made input worst.
I also hate screen tear spoils the game for me lol



Glad I was some help
I can notice it in Battlefield 3 and Black Ops 2. However using the settings in the OP completely removes it for me. Most games (typically non fps shooters) i don't notice it at all.

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 13:17   #17
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Cheers for taking the time to set this up mate.
Much appreciated

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 14:44   #18
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Very nice guide Matt will give it a go later

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 14:53   #19
PaulyD
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It changes how many fps the gpu renders ahead. Default is 3. Changing it to one not only decreases latency but it decreases stutter as well as frames aren't held in the buffer for so long.
Excellent, thanks for the clarification

Quote:
Originally Posted by LtMatt View Post
I can notice it in Battlefield 3 and Black Ops 2. However using the settings in the OP completely removes it for me. Most games (typically non fps shooters) i don't notice it at all.
I really noticed it in BC2 on my old 570. I used Nvidia Inspector (I think that is what it is called - RadeonPro for NV basically) with a similar setup and this removed all input lag but still kept it silky smooth with no tearing.

Have since done this setup for every game I play with no issues

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 15:57   #20
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hmmm bf3 doesn't even load if I use radeon pro.

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 16:06   #21
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Cheers for taking the time to set this up mate.
Much appreciated
Happy to help GCN brothers throughout the world.

Quote:
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Very nice guide Matt will give it a go later
Atta boy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulyD View Post
Excellent, thanks for the clarification



I really noticed it in BC2 on my old 570. I used Nvidia Inspector (I think that is what it is called - RadeonPro for NV basically) with a similar setup and this removed all input lag but still kept it silky smooth with no tearing.

Have since done this setup for every game I play with no issues
Yes i used to just use afterburner to limit fps but this way is more effective.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Locky
hmmm bf3 doesn't even load if I use radeon pro.
Are you using msi afterburner? RadeonPro will not load BF3 if you have afterburner running. Shut down afterburner, load bf3, as its loading in the taskbar start up afterburner again. Now you can use afterburner with its overlay and radeonpro. Its something to do with the overlay+ afterburner. You might find this in other games so watch out for it. So far only BF3 has had this problem for me. The same applies for fraps, teamspeak etc.

Last edited by AMDMatt; 25th Mar 2013 at 16:18.
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Old 25th Mar 2013, 19:13   #22
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I Was hoping this would work on rfactor 2 but makes it worse, gives me more micro stutters, and in rf1.. strange!! so I have to use just Dynamic with 60hz refresh rate! but when it goes below 55 I get tearing..

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 19:15   #23
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I Was hoping this would work on rfactor 2 but makes it worse, gives me more micro stutters, and in rf1.. strange!! so I have to use just Dynamic with 60hz refresh rate! but when it goes below 55 I get tearing..
Do you have crossfire and what's rfactor?

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 19:37   #24
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Do you have crossfire and what's rfactor?
rFACTOR 1 and 2 are sim car racers

I just worked out that if I have dynamic frame rate control set to 59 58, I get micro stutters, also the same if I tick flip que size and change it to 1.

So i have to untick flip que size, and set dynamic frame rate control set to 60 and refresh at 60. hope this stops the tearing when frame rate goes lower!

I used to use just dynamic with 60hz, that I get tearing when frames go down.

Shall I try different number on the que size

I have a single 7970!

Thanks.

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 19:44   #25
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The flip queue size setting in RadeonPro no longer has any effect. The latest AMD drivers lock flip queue size to 3.

Dynamic Vsync automatically enables triple buffering, so don't use it if you can't stand input lag.
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Old 25th Mar 2013, 19:52   #26
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The flip queue size setting in RadeonPro no longer has any effect. The latest AMD drivers lock flip queue size to 3.

Dynamic Vsync automatically enables triple buffering, so don't use it if you can't stand input lag.
What is input lag in your view ?
I tried flip queue size on 5, and was ok.. on 5 or off seems the same to me.
What I hate in the game, is when a lot goes on at once, everything slows and stutters!!

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 20:59   #27
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The flip queue size setting in RadeonPro no longer has any effect. The latest AMD drivers lock flip queue size to 3.
Do you have any more info about this ICDP? Its just im able to change the flip queue size in farcry 3 and it has a noticeable effect, same with battlefield 3 and the perfoverlayvisible command which shows lots of frame buffering with a high flip queue size such as 3+ etc.

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 21:06   #28
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Do you have to set this up only once? or is there messing about after every driver change?

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 21:09   #29
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Do you have to set this up only once? or is there messing about after every driver change?
RadeonPro is separate from the drivers so it should be a once only thing unless you need to make changes.

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Old 25th Mar 2013, 21:30   #30
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Do you have any more info about this ICDP? Its just im able to change the flip queue size in farcry 3 and it has a noticeable effect, same with battlefield 3 and the perfoverlayvisible command which shows lots of frame buffering with a high flip queue size such as 3+ etc.
I have tested flip queue size using the latest AMD drivers and the preview version of RadeonPro. Flip queue size always made a dramatic effect on most games for me. I recently tested the following two games with all flip queue sizes and saw no difference in frametimes.

Skyrim
Hitman Absolution

Previously I could make both games stuttery messes by setting flip queue anything higher than 1. Now no matter what setting I choose the games show no change.

The loss of the ability to change flip queue occurred for me when I switched to 13.3 beta drivers.
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