Top gear - Lambo LP640 V Golf GTI

[Stonedofmoo]

231bhp isn't really very excited though is it

If that was a Impreza or an Evo you would own a poverty spec model

 

[[TW]Fox]

Actually your first disagreement was this "In what way is watching a Golf accelerate any more interesting?"

Yes, after you had, multiple times, shared your opinion that the 330Ci is 'boring'.

and from there things were intentionally escalated by yourself - by, for example, selectively reading my posts as illustrated by you quoting only certain parts out of context.

I quoted the parts relevant to my reply. No point quoting an entire message when I am only adressing certain things you said.

I accept you don't like the BMW 330Ci. Thats your opinion and you are entitled to it. But you have to appreciate that branding it the most boring car in the world is right up there with me blurting out something like 'The Lotus Elise is the most boring car in the world' simply becuase I don't like the Elise. You didn't simply express an opinion. You were uneccesarily scathing.

I mean honestly, to suggest that it would have 'reduced viewing figures' was laughable. People don't switch off when the exact model of car in a 60 second feature isn't to their liking.

 

[[TW]Fox]

231bhp isn't really very excited though isn't it

If that was a Impreza or an Evo you would own a poverty spec model

I'd find an Impreza Turbo 2000 pretty damn exciting, really. And a Golf GTI is 200bhp. I also don't think 'the most boring car in the world' is a phrase you'd ever find coming from me after taking out a poverty spec Evo.

The average power output of cars sold in the UK last year was something like 140bhp.

Do you know what? I wouldn't even use boring to describe your 306 DT. I bet it's pretty fun, actually.

Boring = cars entirely without merit which simply do a job - just. Boring = Astra 1.7 DTi Estate. Suzuki Wagon R. Honda Jazz.

Not BMW 330Ci's, no matter how much you hate their drivers.

 

[NathanE]

It's not really just my opinion. A number of people in this very thread have also agreed that the 330Ci is boring. Also the Top Gear producers evidently didn't think a car of this type would make appropriate television.

You quoted certain parts but left out other parts that were entirely relevant and would have negated your need to even make a further reply. Just scroll up it's very easy to see where you went off on a tangent from simply not reading my posts.

I have nothing against the 330Ci at all, I don't know why you are "accepting" that or even thinking it. All I have said is that is a boring car. I would not stop my parents from buying one at all. I'm sure it would suit them down to a tea.

I didn't brand it the most boring car in the world. You misinterpreted what I was 'trying to get at'. What I was saying is that people watching Top Gear would see little difference between having a 1.2 Clio and a 330Ci go against that Lambo. They are both boring cars. Where as Golf GTI is not really quite as a boring. Yes it doesn't excite me what so ever - but the general public do get excited by a Golf GTI. I know people that point them out on a motorway for example... "OMG Look a Golf GTI!!!"

I'm not going to comment on the Elise parts as I feel the above already answers that. The very fact that you are trying to bring Elise's into this suggests to me that you have grossly misinterpreted what I have written as a personal attack on both you and BMW's. That is simply not the case. So then you saw the need to bring Elise's into this as a way to get back at me.

The remark on reduced viewing figures was meant in jest to help Phate understand why Top Gear's producers chose a Golf GTI. It's easy to criticise that remark now because it was never intended to be analysed in such detail like you have.

 

[Matt82]

RWD, 231BHP, 155MPH and 0-60MPH in 6.3 secs.

congratulations, you posted a load of numbers. im sure ive travelled quicker than that on a plane during take off... how is that exciting?

are we saying, then, that the sum of a car's involvement and abilities are its top speed, 0-60 time etc?

 

[Jez]

congratulations, you posted a load of numbers. im sure ive travelled quicker than that on a plane during take off... how is that exciting?

are we saying, then, that the sum of a car's involvement and abilities are its top speed, 0-60 time etc?

What do you drive that you could possibly call a 330ci boring? It handles excellently and its pretty fast (actually sub 6s to 60, and posts a quick 100 time).

Overall they are a very good drive.

 

[[TW]Fox]

It's not really just my opinion. A number of people in this very thread have also agreed that the 330Ci is boring. Also the Top Gear producers evidently didn't think a car of this type would make appropriate television.

They didn't think it was appropriate television because it wasn't the point of the item. The idea was to show a car that could easily be recognised as fast. The GTI does this admirably. It doesn't, however, imply the opposite and that any class of car not chosen must be boring or slow.

I'm not going to comment on the Elise parts as I feel the above already answers that. The very fact that you are trying to bring Elise's into this suggests to me that you have grossly misinterpreted what I have written as a personal attack on both you and BMW's. That is simply not the case. So then you saw the need to bring Elise's into this as a way to get back at me.

Whilst I'm sure you'd like to think that it was just to get back at you I am afraid it was not - I just picked a car I know you are very aware of the abilities of to illustrate a point - the point being, just becuase it isn't my cup of tea doesn't mean I can brand it as utterly boring.

The reason I took the line I did was becuase I've seen the same thing happen in every thread where this particular car is mentioned. Hence my throaway comment 'Only on OcUK...'. This is the only forum I view where such a car is constantly derided as boring by the majority of posters. It's really quite odd, becuase this isn't reflected elsehwere, even in forums which are even more performance orientated. That most of the people who follow the bandwagon have not even been in one let alone driven one adds to the confusion.

We had a fantastic (lol) thread a year ago where half the forum actually thought a Vauxhall Nova 1.2 was more fun to drive than a 330.

It's almost as if in OcUK land, it's cool to hate the 330Ci. Lord only knows why. I wouldnt buy one, its not my sort of car, but it's certainly not boring to drive.

 

[Booner!]

What do you drive that you could possibly call a 330ci boring? It handles excellently and its pretty fast (actually sub 6s to 60, and posts a quick 100 time).

Overall they are a very good drive.

the fact that they are very common and i can barely distinguish them apart...unless they state their engine size which then bring back to their engine performance - which in my opinion - doesn't negate whether a car is interesting or not

They just dont "float my boat".

I would have a 6series or a 7series though

 

[[TW]Fox]

the fact that they are very common and i can barely distinguish them apart..

I don't wish to be radical and sensationalist but surely what makes a boring drive or an exciting drive is how the car drives with you behind the wheel, rather than how many other people own the same car? I mean I hardly think OMGWOW when a 330 goes past, infact I rarely notice, but I thought 'boring' or 'exciting' was more than simply how a car looks?

If everyone drove a Ferrari F360 would they suddenly be boring? I don't think so..

 

[Booner!]

just becuase it isn't my cup of tea doesn't mean I can brand it as utterly boring.

Yet you had the nerve to brand my car as a "overpriced badge which make middle age women try to look posh at a golf club/horse riding club"

Hypocritical no?

 

[Alex UK]

RWD, 231BHP, 155MPH and 0-60MPH in 6.3 secs.

Thrilling. I'd rather have a GTI thanks...

 

[Booner!]

I don't wish to be radical and sensationalist but surely what makes a boring drive or an exciting drive is how the car drives with you behind the wheel, rather than how many other people own the same car? I mean I hardly think OMGWOW when a 330 goes past, infact I rarely notice, but I thought 'boring' or 'exciting' was more than simply how a car looks?

If everyone drove a Ferrari F360 would they suddenly be boring? I don't think so..

actually, there are very many cars such as a ferrari which I would find boring as a choice if I could afford it.

For instance, a porsche carrera to me is just another footballers first paycheck car.... yet if I saw a Mustang, i would be blown away, or a TVR which suffers from many faults, but is something interesting to me - unlike the run-of-a-mill popular sportcars

 

[[TW]Fox]

Yet you had the nerve to brand my car as a "overpriced badge which make middle age women try to look posh at a golf club/horse riding club"

Hypocritical no?

Not quite the same thing. You'll note that despite saying the above about the venerable Golf, I've never said anything extreme like 'its the most boring car ever' or 'its the worst car in the world' or 'they are totally rubbish'

The above was a stereotype of its owners, in much the same way that everyone else stereotypes the people who drive BMW's. I don't particularly care about that sort of generalisation becuase they are often amusing

 

[Matt82]

What do you drive that you could possibly call a 330ci boring? It handles excellently and its pretty fast (actually sub 6s to 60, and posts a quick 100 time).

Overall they are a very good drive.

ive owned/driven plenty of stuff that calls a 330 boring. a 330 is so-so quick, does handle neatly for a common or garden saloon, but the overall experience was dominated by grip-grip-grip (massively over tyred to be exciting), lack of lsd stops it being genuinely fun.

in all honesty, id say a 1.2 clio is more fun.... ive had more fun chucking around a 1.2 clio.

yes i have driven a 330 (saloon, not coupe, doubt it makes the biggest difference in the world)... but in short, is typical german saloon ware.

it wont set anyone's pants alight unless youve just stepped out of a corsa, just too predicable and sanitised

how quick a car gets away from a set of lights or from a roundabout is no way a measure of how much fun it is.

 

[[TW]Fox]

For instance, a porsche carrera to me is just another footballers first paycheck car.

Perhaps I will never understand opinions like this. To me, a Porsche 911 is one of the worlds finest sports cars. The amount of morons who buy them has no bearing on the cars mechanical ability. It's still great.

 

[Dangerous Dave]

Amazing how this thread has turned into a rather heated debate.

I would expect they happened to have the Golf spare at the time more than likely for an article in there mag and used this as a comparison. I doubt they would have went to the hassle to get a press GTi just for it.

 

[Booner!]

Not quite the same thing. You'll note that despite saying the above about the venerable Golf, I've never said anything extreme like 'its the most boring car ever' or 'its the worst car in the world' or 'they are totally rubbish'

The above was a stereotype of its owners, in much the same way that everyone else stereotypes the people who drive BMW's. I don't particularly care about that sort of generalisation becuase they are often amusing

I think it is fair to say, you can see when I jumped on the defensive about somebody branding my car that way and the typical owner... hence your reaction to the BMW slander in this thread made you jump the defensive.

Man this thread has totally go off the rails.

Anyways, Lambo is still my dream car

 

[[TW]Fox]

Amazing how this thread has turned into a rather heated debate.

More interesting than the original question

 

[[TW]Fox]

I think it is fair to say, you can see when I jumped on the defensive about somebody branding my car that way and the typical owner... hence your reaction to the BMW slander in this thread made you jump the defensive.

I've no problems with people levelling accuruate criticisms at BMW. Doesn't bother me, I didn't design them For example the 1 Series is fairly nasty, the 316 is gutless and for badge snobs only, the E60's styling leaves much to be desired, etc etc

But even though I hate the 1 Series and everything it stands for i wouldnt call it boring simply becuase.. no matter how much I dislike it... it's hardly boring.

 

[NathanE]

They didn't think it was appropriate television because it wasn't the point of the item. The idea was to show a car that could easily be recognised as fast. The GTI does this admirably. It doesn't, however, imply the opposite and that any class of car not chosen must be boring or slow.

Gee thanks for the education

Whilst I'm sure you'd like to think that it was just to get back at you I am afraid it was not - I just picked a car I know you are very aware of the abilities of to illustrate a point - the point being, just becuase it isn't my cup of tea doesn't mean I can brand it as utterly boring.

But then I'm sure you know I can turn that point on it's head in that this is a discussion forum where opinions are meant to be expressed.

The reason I took the line I did was becuase I've seen the same thing happen in every thread where this particular car is mentioned. Hence my throaway comment 'Only on OcUK...'. This is the only forum I view where such a car is constantly derided as boring by the majority of posters. It's really quite odd, becuase this isn't reflected elsehwere, even in forums which are even more performance orientated. That most of the people who follow the bandwagon have not even been in one let alone driven one adds to the confusion.

I don't think it is just OcUK that will say the 330Ci is boring compared to a Golf GTI.

We had a fantastic (lol) thread a year ago where half the forum actually thought a Vauxhall Nova 1.2 was more fun to drive than a 330.

Now that's a good point. A lot of people will know what a Nova is and how crap they are so people would much rather watch a segment about the 330Ci than a Nova. It's all weights and balances really.

It's almost as if in OcUK land, it's cool to hate the 330Ci. Lord only knows why. I wouldnt buy one, its not my sort of car, but it's certainly not boring to drive.

Reality and public perceptions are different things I'm afraid. I've not commented on the "real" capabilities of the 330Ci once because frankly I don't see the relevance to this thread.